# Trump's unapologetic style utterly confounds modern media institutions. What's going on here? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [December 26, 2015, 1:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-unapologetic-style-utterly-confounds-modern-media-institutions-whats-going-on-here/741360 "2015-12-26T01:15:16Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![T.M](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ad7895/32.png) [@T.M](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/T.M)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2015, 10:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-unapologetic-style-utterly-confounds-modern-media-institutions-whats-going-on-here/741360/21 "2015-12-26T10:00:07Z")
Trump said a temp. ban on Muslims entering the country until we get our systems sorted, Common sense but implementing it is the problem. The media report him as saying Ban all Muslims. No he did not and this is why we should form our opinions from knowledge not biased reporting ---
**Author:** ![Hari\_Seldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hari_seldon/32/5173_2.png) [@Hari\_Seldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hari_Seldon)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2015, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-unapologetic-style-utterly-confounds-modern-media-institutions-whats-going-on-here/741360/22 "2015-12-26T15:17:32Z")
The GOP went after the racist vote like a kid with a bag of candy. Is it any suprise that now the racists own the party? ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2015, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-unapologetic-style-utterly-confounds-modern-media-institutions-whats-going-on-here/741360/23 "2015-12-26T15:38:05Z")
> [@T.M](#): > > The media report him as saying Ban all Muslims. You’ll have to provide examples of this reporting, as I call bullshit on your statement. ---
**Author:** ![T.M](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ad7895/32.png) [@T.M](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/T.M)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2015, 4:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-unapologetic-style-utterly-confounds-modern-media-institutions-whats-going-on-here/741360/24 "2015-12-26T16:10:09Z")
> [@Chefguy](#): > > You’ll have to provide examples of this reporting, as I call bullshit on your statement. I am in the U.K. so I am going by reports in our papers. Why call bullshit on a statement when there is no value in lying ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2015, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-unapologetic-style-utterly-confounds-modern-media-institutions-whats-going-on-here/741360/25 "2015-12-26T16:12:09Z")
> [@Boyo\_Jim](#): > > His popularity is an illusion. He’s got, what, 30-40% of self identifying Republicans, who themselves are 30-40% of the electorate. At best he’s got 10-20% of potential voters. If every voter turns out, his defeat will be epic and historic. But of course not every voter will turn out. Depending on which groups a depressed or not otherwise motivated, his vote percentage may turn out higher than what he might have otherwise got. > [@Claverhouse](#): > > That’s still more than any _other_ has got. > > They fear him because he speaks power to truth. Again, not enough support to win in a general election, what I have seen is that if he does manage to get the Republican nomination I look forward to see many of the ones that did recently declare “no way” to a Trump presidency or to not vote for him or to support him on the election to be perfect hypocrites when the main contest comes… More than half of Americans will realize that those new supporters will be full of it then. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2015, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-unapologetic-style-utterly-confounds-modern-media-institutions-whats-going-on-here/741360/26 "2015-12-26T16:15:11Z")
> [@Chefguy](#): > > You’ll have to provide examples of this reporting, as I call bullshit on your statement. I have seen a number of cases where both opinions and quotations of these claims were presented by the media. I do not recall a new reporter presenting those words as fact, but consider the infotainment nature of the news it’s kind of hard to tell when they are reporting news or commenting on it. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2015, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-unapologetic-style-utterly-confounds-modern-media-institutions-whats-going-on-here/741360/27 "2015-12-26T16:20:26Z")
> [@T.M](#): > > I am in the U.K. so I am going by reports in our papers. Why call bullshit on a statement when there is no value in lying Well, yes, but one has to take into account the actual numbers and who are the ones getting fooled: > **[Dear Media, Stop Freaking Out About Donald Trump’s Polls](https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/dear-media-stop-freaking-out-about-donald-trumps-polls/)** > > Lately, pundits and punters seem bullish on Donald Trump, whose chances of winning the Republican presidential nomination recently inched above 20 percent for t… > [@](#): > > One problem with this is that it’s not enough for Trump to merely avoid fading. Right now, he has 25 to 30 percent of the vote in polls among the roughly 25 percent of Americans who identify as Republican.\*\* (That’s something like 6 to 8 percent of the electorate overall, or about the same share of people who think the Apollo moon landings were faked.)\*\* As the rest of the field consolidates around him, Trump will need to gain additional support to win the nomination. That might not be easy, since some Trump actions that appeal to a faction of the Republican electorate may alienate the rest of it. Trump’s favorability ratings are middling among Republicans (and awful among the broader electorate). > > Trump will also have to get that 25 or 30 percent to go to the polls. For now, most surveys cover Republican-leaning adults or registered voters, rather than likely voters. Combine that with the poor response rates to polls and the fact that an increasing number of polls use nontraditional sampling methods, and it’s not clear how much overlap there is between the people included in these surveys and the relatively small share of Republicans who will turn up to vote in primaries and caucuses. > > But there’s another, more fundamental problem. That 25 or 30 percent of the vote isn’t really Donald Trump’s for the keeping. In fact, it doesn’t belong to any candidate. If past nomination races are any guide, the vast majority of eventual Republican voters haven’t made up their minds yet. Of course Trump is doing a bit better now, around 30% to 40% among registered **Republican** voters, but that could then include less reasonable conservatives to the already batshit insane conservatives and just plain discordians. ---
**Author:** ![2gigch1](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/2gigch1/32/3313_2.png) [@2gigch1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/2gigch1)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2015, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-unapologetic-style-utterly-confounds-modern-media-institutions-whats-going-on-here/741360/28 "2015-12-26T16:25:04Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > Not news media fail - people fail. The media didn’t train people to want infotainment - infotainment shows got more eyeballs. The one channel full of crap for political purposes has the highest ratings. > Do you want the media to refuse to cover a newsmaker just because nearly every word he says is a lie? And the media is making it quite clear that Trump is lying. Thanks for writing this - I’ve seen plenty of good, solid news operations flounder providing exactly what people claim they want while the infotainment operations rake it in. Al Jazeera America is a fine example of a BBC style operation doing great work in the US, carried on a lot of cable ops and going nowhere. I think the last time I saw their ratings it was about 50k nationwide. > [@](#): > > I don’t agree. Because news channels shouldn’t be about getting the most eyeballs. They may have to generate a profit, but there’s no need to become big multimedia companies. > > Of course people like being entertained more than getting real news. That’s like blaming people for wanting to play games instead of going to school. News operations aren’t a charity. It takes a lot of money to put on a show or create a newspaper. Newspapers have been dying off because they have not been able to monetize the internet revolution to the point they can survive. Those same newspapers with lifelong veteran reporters were the ones who had contacts and sources that were most likely going to break an important story and keep the facts straight. They were sacrificed to the money saving cuts years ago, so now we depend on green reporters, often not from the area they are working in, trying to learn the truth and report it. It’s much harder. As with most things you get what you pay for. In an advertising based broadcast or newspaper, eyeballs = money = survival. There’s no other way around it. ---
**Author:** ![GusNSpot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gusnspot/32/436_2.png) [@GusNSpot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GusNSpot)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2015, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-unapologetic-style-utterly-confounds-modern-media-institutions-whats-going-on-here/741360/29 "2015-12-26T16:30:38Z")
> [@T.M](#): > > I am in the U.K. so I am going by reports in our papers. Why call bullshit on a statement when there is no value in lying Because anyone who is posting political BS on message boards in this country :rolleyes: is either telling a lie :eek: or is so uninformed 😕 or so ignorant :smack: that they can not understand nor believe someone else is not lying. 🆒 Trump is just the most visible of all the totally useless potential presidents this country will pick as it self destructs. Bawahahaha ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2015, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-unapologetic-style-utterly-confounds-modern-media-institutions-whats-going-on-here/741360/30 "2015-12-26T17:27:01Z")
> [@T.M](#): > > I am in the U.K. so I am going by reports in our papers. Why call bullshit on a statement when there is no value in lying To promote one’s own agenda, usually. However, since you’re a Brit, and it’s your media, I retract. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2015, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-unapologetic-style-utterly-confounds-modern-media-institutions-whats-going-on-here/741360/31 "2015-12-26T19:03:04Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > Note that, while only 39% of Republicans polled recently pick Trump as their 1st choice, another 28% pick Cruz or Carson. Those of us who correctly consider Rubio and Huckabee to be grotesquely unqualified agree that 79% of Republicans polled want someone _ **bizarrely unqualified** _ to be the President. (This 79% doesn’t even include Paul’s 4% or the 5% too disillusioned to answer the poll.) Only 11% picked Bush, Christie, Kasich, Graham, Pataki or Santorum – the closest thing the GOP has to competent candidates. :eek: I agree that Trump and Carson are not possessed of what history strongly suggests are the appropriate qualifications to serve as President: former vice president, former governor, former senator, or former Supreme Commander, Allied Forces. But I’m not sure I agree that Rubio and Huckabee are grotesquely unqualified. I wonder if you mean that they hold positions with which you strongly disagree? Rubio is a first-term U.S. Senator and former state legislator and college professor – this is a background very similar to Senator Obama’s when he was a candidate. Huckabee is a former Arkansas governor, which was the exact job held by Bill Clinton when he successfully ran in 1992 for President. ---
**Author:** ![Crafter\_Man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crafter_man/32/458_2.png) [@Crafter\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crafter_Man)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2015, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-unapologetic-style-utterly-confounds-modern-media-institutions-whats-going-on-here/741360/32 "2015-12-26T19:48:44Z")
Trump is arrogant, obnoxious, and belligerent. Many people interpret these traits as “being confident,” and hence the reason for his popularity. ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2015, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-unapologetic-style-utterly-confounds-modern-media-institutions-whats-going-on-here/741360/33 "2015-12-26T21:50:21Z")
> [@Chefguy](#): > > You’ll have to provide examples of this reporting, as I call bullshit on your statement. The problem is that the headlines here just refer to him wanting to ban all Muslims [Here’s one](http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/dec/07/donald-trump-ban-all-muslims-entering-us-san-bernardino-shooting) from The Guardian. > [@](#): > > Donald Trump: ban all Muslims entering US > Republican frontrunner wants ‘total and complete shutdown’ of borders to Muslims after San Bernardino shooting in latest boundary-pushing proposal > … > > Donald Trump, the leading contender to become the Republican party’s nominee for US presidential candidate, has called for a “total and complete shutdown” of the country’s borders to Muslims in the wake of the San Bernardino terrorist attack. > … > He said there was such hatred among Muslims around the world towards Americans that it was necessary to rebuff them en masse, until the problem was better understood. See also the [BBC](http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-35035190): > [@](#): > > Donald Trump urges ban on Muslims coming to US ---
**Author:** ![botsgotme](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/91b2a8/32.png) [@botsgotme](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/botsgotme)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2015, 10:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-unapologetic-style-utterly-confounds-modern-media-institutions-whats-going-on-here/741360/34 "2015-12-26T22:50:45Z")
Trump is not afraid to speak his mind. Contrast that with our president. For years we have been engaged in war in Syria. Obama issues foolish statements that always turn out to be untrue…“ISIS is led by the “JV” team”…“we have contained ISIS”…“ISIS sales of oil to Turkey are insignificant”. Now we learn that over $500 million has been spent on the “good rebels”-who somehow have dwindled down to 5 people. The Russians have demonstrated that there was a huge oil export business that funds ISIS…based upon oil sales to Turkey. We have been bombing ISIS for years…with no (apparent) results. Finally, Obama won’t interrupt his golf game when 6 US soldiers are blown to bits in Afghanistan…but he makes an apology of sorts days later. Give me Trump’s plain speaking any day. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2015, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-unapologetic-style-utterly-confounds-modern-media-institutions-whats-going-on-here/741360/35 "2015-12-26T23:44:58Z")
> [@Lord\_Feldon](#): > > As of November, [around 90%](https://sunlightfoundation.com/blog/2015/11/13/donald-trump-may-be-a-self-starter-but-hes-not-self-funded/) of his campaign’s funding was from donors. (If he ever has to spend like a normal candidate, that might change. Right now it’s an extremely cheap campaign that relies on outrage-induced free media.) Makes sense - Trump was never one for using his own money. ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Feldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lord_feldon/32/341_2.png) [@Lord\_Feldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Feldon)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2015, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-unapologetic-style-utterly-confounds-modern-media-institutions-whats-going-on-here/741360/36 "2015-12-27T00:25:26Z")
> [@botsgotme](#): > > Trump is not afraid to speak his mind. Why do people assume rudeness is sincere? Chris Christie benefits from the same assumption that mean=truthful. Why? Is it just that it’s not what we expect from politicians, so it startles people out of their cynicism? ---
**Author:** ![jz78817](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jz78817/32/1028_2.png) [@jz78817](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jz78817)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2015, 12:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-unapologetic-style-utterly-confounds-modern-media-institutions-whats-going-on-here/741360/37 "2015-12-27T00:35:00Z")
> [@Lord\_Feldon](#): > > Why do people assume rudeness is sincere? Chris Christie benefits from the same assumption that mean=truthful. Why? Is it just that it’s not what we expect from politicians, so it startles people out of their cynicism? IME people who say he “speaks his mind” are really saying he “says things I agree with.” ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2015, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-unapologetic-style-utterly-confounds-modern-media-institutions-whats-going-on-here/741360/38 "2015-12-27T01:23:01Z")
Tangentially, there’s some interesting analysis of his (bizarre or grotesque?) hyper-repetitive rhetorical style here. [http://languagelog.ldc.upenn.edu/nll/?p=22691](http://languagelog.ldc.upenn.edu/nll/?p=22691) [http://languagelog.ldc.upenn.edu/nll/?p=23057](http://languagelog.ldc.upenn.edu/nll/?p=23057) ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2015, 1:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-unapologetic-style-utterly-confounds-modern-media-institutions-whats-going-on-here/741360/39 "2015-12-27T01:26:17Z")
> [@Quartz](#): > > The problem is that the headlines here just refer to him wanting to ban all Muslims I should not have to point out that those headlines refer to his much-derided proposal to halt immigration of Muslims into the U.S., whereas “ban all Muslims” suggests that he wants to make the faith illegal and/or deport all Muslims (which I doubt even Trump is nutty enough to call for, although the campaign has a ways to run). > [@septimus](#): > > …79% of Republicans polled want someone bizarrely unqualified to be the President. Some of your examples hold bizarre views or are just plain bizarre (i.e. Cruz, who in addition looks like a cross between Joseph McCarthy and a grown-up Eddie Munster). But if we’re calling candidates like Cruz and Rubio unqualified based on experience, then numerous past Democratic (and Republican) presidential candidates would have to have been regarded as unqualified as well. Some of them performed competently or even admirably, others - the less said the better.\* \*examples include U.S. Grant and Eisenhower (who as former generals have a rather divergent position in history), and Woodrow Wilson, whose elective experience consisted of two whole years as governor of New Jersey. ---
**Author:** ![Mijin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mijin/32/9369_2.png) [@Mijin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mijin)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2015, 1:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-unapologetic-style-utterly-confounds-modern-media-institutions-whats-going-on-here/741360/40 "2015-12-27T01:42:01Z")
> [@Penfeather](#): > > Because he’s a playing it as a wrestling villain. not a political candidate. He’s giving audiences the spectacle they crave, and it’s working. This. And I’d also say the media’s power to shock with He / She said stories is deteriorating since so often they take sentences out of context or do a very misleading paraphrase. Heck, that’s even happened plenty of times with the donald, even considering what he said in the first place was already bile. That said, I don’t know why they don’t do it the UK way, and just say things like “Pressure building for X to resign” (omitting that “the pressure” is coming from the media writing such stories). [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-unapologetic-style-utterly-confounds-modern-media-institutions-whats-going-on-here/741360.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-unapologetic-style-utterly-confounds-modern-media-institutions-whats-going-on-here/741360.md?page=3)