# TSA going to be worse than most first dates
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tsa-going-to-be-worse-than-most-first-dates/781561
**Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share
**Created:** [March 6, 2017, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tsa-going-to-be-worse-than-most-first-dates/781561 "2017-03-06T18:06:27Z")
**Posts on this page:** 15
**Page:** 3
### Author:  [@jtur88](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jtur88)
#### Post date: [March 8, 2017, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tsa-going-to-be-worse-than-most-first-dates/781561/41 "2017-03-08T14:56:25Z")
> [@Eva\_Luna](#):
>
> You could just get yourself a passport.
You could, but there is a long-standing tradition in the USA that a passport is not required to move about within the country. It is (or was) one of a dwindling number of things about America that I was actually proud of.
I’ve been in a lot of countries where citizens are required to carry papers. It is not a list of countries that it would be an honor to be among.
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### Author:  [@Martini\_Enfield](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martini_Enfield)
#### Post date: [March 9, 2017, 1:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tsa-going-to-be-worse-than-most-first-dates/781561/42 "2017-03-09T13:56:14Z")
An American friend once pointed out to me a lot of his fellow citizens never _needed_ to leave the US because most of the stuff they wanted was available somewhere within in. Historic sites? Plenty of those. Theme Parks? No shortage of them. Natural attractions? Take your pick. Not much point getting a passport if you never intended to go to one of those “other countries” one heard about on TV sometimes.
It’s not like (say) Australia or NZ where most of the interesting stuff is overseas (Yeah, I know we’ve got Ayers Rock and the Great Barrier Reef here, but Disneyland, The Tower of London and the Eiffel Tower are inconveniently on the other side of the planet) and so having a passport is pretty much de rigeuer for anyone who’s living somewhere safely above the poverty line.
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### Author:  [@Lord\_Feldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Feldon)
#### Post date: [March 9, 2017, 2:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tsa-going-to-be-worse-than-most-first-dates/781561/43 "2017-03-09T14:25:09Z")
Americans also get a lot less time off work. We’re not guaranteed any paid leave at all. And even when people are granted it on paper (most are), they can be pressured not to use it.
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### Author:  [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)
#### Post date: [March 9, 2017, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tsa-going-to-be-worse-than-most-first-dates/781561/44 "2017-03-09T14:30:18Z")
> [@Spoons](#):
>
> And $110 for a passport. Seriously? A US passport for $110 US is a great deal. It is a solid ID, not rejected by any country in the world. Not rejected by any state in the US, nor in any province of Canada. Not rejected overseas. Yeah, I’d pay $110 US or $120CAD (for a Canadian passport) for that kind of ID.
My passport is 0€ if I renew it within a certain period of its expiration date; there is supposed to be a fee if you renew it outside that time but 14 months ago (when I renewed both passport and national ID) it happened to be zero and AFAIK still is. I got charged a fee for the National ID, but it was less than 11€.
YO! Spanish government! You guys are too cheap, apparently!
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### Author:  [@jtur88](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jtur88)
#### Post date: [March 9, 2017, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tsa-going-to-be-worse-than-most-first-dates/781561/45 "2017-03-09T16:27:57Z")
I paid $110 for a new passport renewal three years ago, and got the short one. Then the bastards decided that new pages can’t be added anymore, I used mine up, and had to pay another $110 for another one.
My first US passport was in 1962, and I think then it might have cost $10, and was only good for three years, with a free renewal stamp for two more years, but still $20 for ten years (with four trips to the passport office) , which allowing for inflation, was a lot more expensive than $110 for ten years today.
The first time I went to Europe with my $10 passport, I was carrying Arthur Frommer’s “Europe on $5 a day”, so the passport cost equal to two days travel in Europe. Yes, in Stockholm, you could stay in the youth hostel and eat at the cooking school for $5 a day in the 60’s. Portugal and Yugoslavia, it was a splurge to spend $2 a day.
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### Author:  [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)
#### Post date: [March 9, 2017, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tsa-going-to-be-worse-than-most-first-dates/781561/46 "2017-03-09T16:44:25Z")
Yeah I just sent off my passport renew a couple days ago. $110 is pricey. Can’t remember what it cost 10 years ago, but it didn’t make me wince.
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### Author:  [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)
#### Post date: [March 9, 2017, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tsa-going-to-be-worse-than-most-first-dates/781561/47 "2017-03-09T17:10:10Z")
> [@Spoons](#):
>
> .
>
> You speak about hassles, licenses, notarizations, and fees. What, exactly, are you speaking about? I’ve never run into the equivalents when I’ve needed to get or renew a passport. I simply fill out a form, show my Ontario birth certificate, and Canada produces a passport for me.
It has been discussed in the voter-ID threads, that for a number of Americans it’s a PITA to get their hands on a COLB and an “official” ID. A surprising number of people in the USA manage to get through much of life without a federal-standard proof of identity, residence and citizenship, and if you have to rebuild your paper trail later in life and from a different state that’s when the notarizations and fees begin piling up.
But yeah, for your average person who knows where their birth certificate is, and has already an official state ID, getting the passport is mostly about the $135 fee and getting the photograph right. Was for me.
OTOH if you’re never ever leaving the country, and your state issues Real-ID compliant driving licenses, I could see finding it a luxury.
> [@jtur88](#):
>
> I paid $110 for a new passport renewal three years ago, and got the short one. Then the bastards decided that new pages can’t be added anymore, I used mine up, and had to pay another $110 for another one.
Yeah, adding hassle and cost does seem to be what they do best; “oh if you travel that much you surely can afford it” or “oh if you travel that much you surely will budget an extra 4 hours at the connection in case you are given extra screening”. The whole vision that hey, you can always choose to not travel by air or not travel internationally so you’ve no right to complain and you should just suck it up…
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### Author:  [@Tranquilis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tranquilis)
#### Post date: [March 9, 2017, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tsa-going-to-be-worse-than-most-first-dates/781561/48 "2017-03-09T17:54:47Z")
Lovely. I predict lines of creepy trench-coated pervs buying up airline seats…
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### Author:  [@Zsofia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zsofia)
#### Post date: [March 9, 2017, 9:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tsa-going-to-be-worse-than-most-first-dates/781561/49 "2017-03-09T21:13:43Z")
> [@Martini\_Enfield](#):
>
> An American friend once pointed out to me a lot of his fellow citizens never _needed_ to leave the US because most of the stuff they wanted was available somewhere within in. Historic sites? Plenty of those. Theme Parks? No shortage of them. Natural attractions? Take your pick. Not much point getting a passport if you never intended to go to one of those “other countries” one heard about on TV sometimes.
>
> It’s not like (say) Australia or NZ where most of the interesting stuff is overseas (Yeah, I know we’ve got Ayers Rock and the Great Barrier Reef here, but Disneyland, The Tower of London and the Eiffel Tower are inconveniently on the other side of the planet) and so having a passport is pretty much de rigeuer for anyone who’s living somewhere safely above the poverty line.
And you use 'em, too! I swear, if you’re in the ass end of Azerbaijan and find a bar there’s already going to be a really nice pair of cheerful Aussie guys sitting at it. You guys are _everywhere_.
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### Author:  [@Martini\_Enfield](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martini_Enfield)
#### Post date: [March 10, 2017, 12:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tsa-going-to-be-worse-than-most-first-dates/781561/50 "2017-03-10T00:51:59Z")
> [@Zsofia](#):
>
> And you use 'em, too! I swear, if you’re in the ass end of Azerbaijan and find a bar there’s already going to be a really nice pair of cheerful Aussie guys sitting at it. You guys are _everywhere_.
We’re well known for being a nation who like to travel 🙂
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### Author:  [@Lord\_Feldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Feldon)
#### Post date: [March 10, 2017, 1:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tsa-going-to-be-worse-than-most-first-dates/781561/51 "2017-03-10T01:50:39Z")
> [@JRDelirious](#):
>
> It has been discussed in the voter-ID threads, that for a number of Americans it’s a PITA to get their hands on a COLB and an “official” ID. A surprising number of people in the USA manage to get through much of life without a federal-standard proof of identity, residence and citizenship, and if you have to rebuild your paper trail later in life and from a different state that’s when the notarizations and fees begin piling up.
Sometimes it’s annoying even for people who don’t have to rebuild a whole paper trail but just need a new copy to replace one that got lost in a move, etc. My mom was born in a state where _every_ person who applies for a certified copy of a birth certificate from out of state has to get the paperwork notarized.
That’s not impossible at all, but it’s another hurdle that might lead a not-particularly-motivated person’s motivation to fizzle. (Another thing discussed in the voter ID threads is that multi-step processes involving fees, paperwork, and visits to offices will discourage even a lot of people who are _able_ to deal with the hassle.)
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### Author:  [@Ambivalid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ambivalid)
#### Post date: [March 10, 2017, 2:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tsa-going-to-be-worse-than-most-first-dates/781561/52 "2017-03-10T02:02:44Z")
> [@Projammer](#):
>
> I fly a lot for work and am in the TSA-Pre program. It still never fails that the scanner at my local air port dings when I go through it that I have been ‘randomly’ selected for extra screening. Sometimes the swabs for explosives, sometimes the pat-down.
>
> Seriously. EVERY time. 100%. It doesn’t matter if I’m the only person in line or at some random spot in the first 30 or so. I’m the one that gets to step to the side.
>
> I may have to start carrying flowers for my TSA dates.
Ha! Welcome to my world. Those who use wheelchairs are taken and patted down every-single-time. No randomness about it.
ETA: Although to be fair, I understand why this is done.
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### Author:  [@Eva\_Luna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eva_Luna)
#### Post date: [March 20, 2017, 9:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tsa-going-to-be-worse-than-most-first-dates/781561/53 "2017-03-20T21:45:01Z")
> [@JRDelirious](#):
>
> Yeah, adding hassle and cost does seem to be what they do best; “oh if you travel that much you surely can afford it” or “oh if you travel that much you surely will budget an extra 4 hours at the connection in case you are given extra screening”. The whole vision that hey, you can always choose to not travel by air or not travel internationally so you’ve no right to complain and you should just suck it up…
So damn annoying, especially for people who have family overseas. Like you’re never supposed to see your family if it’s inconvenient or something, especially if they are unable to travel themselves.
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### Author:  [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)
#### Post date: [March 21, 2017, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tsa-going-to-be-worse-than-most-first-dates/781561/54 "2017-03-21T15:31:15Z")
You know what you’ll get as a response will be, again, “if it’s that important to see the old folks often, you should be willing to suck it up for their sake.” It’s always that we should just put up with it and STFU.
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### Author:  [@swampspruce](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/swampspruce)
#### Post date: [March 21, 2017, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tsa-going-to-be-worse-than-most-first-dates/781561/55 "2017-03-21T16:54:17Z")
I generally agree with **Spoons** on a lot of things but the notion that I would need a passport to travel in-country in North America by rail, air or road is patently ridiculous. An American (Canadian, or Mexican for that matter) citizen should have the freedom to be able to travel within their own country without _having to_ carry Federal ID.
Travelling outside your own country, sure.
I refuse to step into the scanners on principle (Not to mention that long-term studies on mm wave radar on humans is pretty much non-existant), seeing as I work with enough RF and other high frequency stuff at work.
You could always wrap your bits in tin foil and walk into the scanner with a rager like an acquaintance of mine did if you are so built and inclined, though. 🙂
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