# TSA, Police and FBI handcuff and detain student for possessing arabic flashcards **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 10, 2010, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tsa-police-and-fbi-handcuff-and-detain-student-for-possessing-arabic-flashcards/528497 "2010-02-10T23:58:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 11\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![buttonjockey308](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bcef8e/32.png) [@buttonjockey308](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/buttonjockey308)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2010, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tsa-police-and-fbi-handcuff-and-detain-student-for-possessing-arabic-flashcards/528497/141 "2010-02-17T23:25:12Z")
> [@Rumor\_Watkins](#): > > Ok, I’ll amend the scenario because I didn’t intend to set it up so that Traveler X is a material witness as to OBLs wherabouts, rather was just trying to portray a 100% non-violent, non-weapon holding, non lawbreaking traveler who is, unquestionably, a cheerleader for islamic fundamentalism (or whatever term you care to use for “terrorist sympathizer” > > and I don’t think they’re out of the context of the issue at all. indeed, they’re precisely at the crux of the issue. You and **Gyrate** are on here crooning about how it’s justifiable to be denied passage through a guns-n-explosive check at an airport because of ones belief, ideology, outlook, etc. > > Tell me, what if this student answers the first question of the TSA guys with “yep, I’m learning Arabic so I can read the original works of my idol Osama”. Is there any cause to detain him? > > (oh, and isn’t this a bit inconsistent: he’s invited to sit down, free to leave, but he’s gotta stick around for long enough so the alphabet squad can decide what to do with him? What do you propose happen if he flatly rejects the invitation to “come and sit down”) You say “denied passage” which is false, he was delayed, not completely denied. That said, even the delay _in this case_ was excessive and stupid. If the student says “yep, I’m learning Arabic so I can read the original works of my idol Osama” then you shake your head, complete your checks and if he does not fail the checks, you let him pass. That’s the trick, sports fans; know your rights. It’s hardly inconsistent and completely in line with the law. If you’re sitting in a chair at the request of an authority, in an airport or frankly in any public area, not behind any closed/locked doors, and have not been advised that you’ve been placed under arrest you’re free to leave. They can browbeat you, make you think you can’t leave, but you can. If they tell you that you cannot, immediately shut your face and repeatedly request a lawyer and little else. If in that scenario he says, “no, I have a flight to catch, and unless there’s a problem with my screening process, I have to go”. It is at that point, a decision has to be made. Do I think this is worth checking out, or do I let the guy go? The answer depends on the circumstances. In this case, they chose a poor course of action. ---
**Author:** ![Carol\_the\_Impaler](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Carol\_the\_Impaler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Carol_the_Impaler)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2010, 4:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tsa-police-and-fbi-handcuff-and-detain-student-for-possessing-arabic-flashcards/528497/142 "2010-02-18T04:04:28Z")
> [@Zeriel](#): > > Uh huh. You must be such a hit at parties. I misread this as: You must be such a shit at parties. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2010, 12:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tsa-police-and-fbi-handcuff-and-detain-student-for-possessing-arabic-flashcards/528497/143 "2010-02-18T12:01:16Z")
> [@Rumor\_Watkins](#): > > You and **Gyrate** are on here crooning about how it’s justifiable to be denied passage through a guns-n-explosive check at an airport because of ones belief, ideology, outlook, etc. I wasn’t aware it was called a “guns-n-explosive” check - I thought it was a SECURITY check. Weapons are merely the most obvious things they are looking for. I also wasn’t aware I was “crooning”. You can be detained at airports for many reasons. You can be held by Security, Customs, Immigration…you can be detained for bringing the wrong kind of cheese into the country. It’s part of the price of air travel. Which is not to say that I don’t think that much of what the TSA does these days isn’t primarily for show, nor that they shouldn’t have to behave in a professional manner, as already mentioned several times. The police have the right to pull me over and check my license if they think I’m driving strangely; they don’t have the right to arrest me and interrogate me if they don’t find anything wrong and just feel embarrassed about having pulled me over, which is essentially what (allegedly) the TSA have done here. ---
**Author:** ![Rumor\_Watkins](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/d9b06d/32.png) [@Rumor\_Watkins](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rumor_Watkins)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2010, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tsa-police-and-fbi-handcuff-and-detain-student-for-possessing-arabic-flashcards/528497/144 "2010-02-18T17:21:13Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > I wasn’t aware it was called a “guns-n-explosive” check - I thought it was a SECURITY check. Weapons are merely the most obvious things they are looking for. I also wasn’t aware I was “crooning”. security \*is \*guns-n-explosives. it’s not distasteful literature or unpopular ideologies. > [@](#): > > You can be detained at airports for many reasons. You can be held by Security, Customs, Immigration…you can be detained for bringing the wrong kind of cheese into the country. It’s part of the price of air travel. customs and immigration are inapposite to the discussion at hand. TSA has authority solely over ensuring that prohibited items are not brought aboard aircraft and denying boarding to those on a no fly list. that’s it - they don’t have general policing authority. > [@](#): > > The police have the right to pull me over and check my license if they think I’m driving strangely; are you breaking the law when you’re driving strangely? if not, they don’t. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2010, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tsa-police-and-fbi-handcuff-and-detain-student-for-possessing-arabic-flashcards/528497/145 "2010-02-18T17:54:44Z")
I suppose that depends on your definition of strangely. The first thing I thought of was weaving and/or erratic lane changes, which would constitute probable cause for a DUI stop. ---
**Author:** ![El\_Kabong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/el_kabong/32/496_2.png) [@El\_Kabong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Kabong)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2010, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tsa-police-and-fbi-handcuff-and-detain-student-for-possessing-arabic-flashcards/528497/146 "2010-02-18T19:49:29Z")
> [@Projammer](#): > > As many events as we hear about and as many of us have direct experience, no, this case will make no difference at all. > > TSA representatives have a history of screwing up by the numbers so nothing short of a screwup involving multiple casualties will prompt any significant change. Something that gets voters screaming at their congresscritters. Let’s give credit for stupidity to all who deserve it. A surprising number of people seem to be talking solely about the TSA being at fault, but, as noted right there in the thread title, the unfortunate student was actually detained and held by the **Philadelphia police** at their airport substation. Which would pretty much have to be the case; AFAIK TSA security screeners have no police powers and no authority to detain anyone on their own, nor any authority to command that police hold anyone for any given length of time. It seems it would be the PPD that primarily has to answer for why the guy was held for so long. With that said, at least half the detention time consisted simply of waiting around for the FBI to show up and question him. Of couse, it should never have gone that far to begin with, but still. In conclusion, save some hate for the Philly cops and maybe the Feds, people. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2010, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tsa-police-and-fbi-handcuff-and-detain-student-for-possessing-arabic-flashcards/528497/147 "2010-02-18T20:24:07Z")
> [@El\_Kabong](#): > > Which would pretty much have to be the case; AFAIK TSA security screeners have no police powers and no authority to detain anyone on their own, nor any authority to command that police hold anyone for any given length of time. It seems it would be the PPD that primarily has to answer for why the guy was held for so long. I highly doubt this is the case. Say a TSA screener spots a rifle in your pants leg and tries to stop you. Can you just walk off? Unlikely. ---
**Author:** ![El\_Kabong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/el_kabong/32/496_2.png) [@El\_Kabong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Kabong)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2010, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tsa-police-and-fbi-handcuff-and-detain-student-for-possessing-arabic-flashcards/528497/148 "2010-02-18T22:10:45Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > I highly doubt this is the case. Say a TSA screener spots a rifle in your pants leg and tries to stop you. Can you just walk off? Unlikely. I’ll see if I can turn up something definitive. ---
**Author:** ![dasmili](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/df788c/32.png) [@dasmili](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dasmili)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2010, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tsa-police-and-fbi-handcuff-and-detain-student-for-possessing-arabic-flashcards/528497/149 "2010-02-18T22:22:39Z")
Speaking as a TSA officer, I can definitely say that TSA employees at the screening checkpoint level have no ability to detain. _However_, per regulations, a passenger who has submitted to screening can not exit the checkpoint until the screening process is complete, and there are creative ways of prolonging that process. Airport police, or TSA law enforcement officers (ex. Federal Air Marshals) obviously have more authority in that regard. ---
**Author:** ![Rumor\_Watkins](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/d9b06d/32.png) [@Rumor\_Watkins](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rumor_Watkins)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2010, 10:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tsa-police-and-fbi-handcuff-and-detain-student-for-possessing-arabic-flashcards/528497/150 "2010-02-18T22:28:19Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > I highly doubt this is the case. Say a TSA screener spots a rifle in your pants leg and tries to stop you. Can you just walk off? Unlikely. This is moot: the speed at which a police officer will arrive in your immediate proximity would astonish you - almost like you had a doughnut in your pocket. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2010, 3:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tsa-police-and-fbi-handcuff-and-detain-student-for-possessing-arabic-flashcards/528497/151 "2010-02-19T03:08:10Z")
> [@Giles](#): > > Seriously, dude, how are you going to chat up those virgins in Islamic heaven if you don’t speak Arabic? > > ETA: and I was beaten to it by **MEBuckner** > > But, even more seriously, if Arabic is a sign that you are a terrorist, then the Iranians and the North Koreans have won. I guess that would mean “they” will be going after my local pizza man soon. If they do, they will have to go through me first :eek: [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tsa-police-and-fbi-handcuff-and-detain-student-for-possessing-arabic-flashcards/528497.md?page=7)