# TubaDiva is not fit to be in a position of power on this board. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [April 30, 2006, 4:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-is-not-fit-to-be-in-a-position-of-power-on-this-board/354845 "2006-04-30T16:58:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 15
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2006, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-is-not-fit-to-be-in-a-position-of-power-on-this-board/354845/281 "2006-05-03T15:04:05Z")
> [@don't ask](#): > > As I say, I have no emotional investment in this I just think **TubaDiva** is one of those people who has found herself in a role not suited to her personality - like the nurse who doesn’t want to nurse her patients, the HR person who knows all the regulations but doesn’t know how to help you, the guy on the enquiry phones who hates answering questions. Wow, i figured that after i returned from my weekend out of town (and away from the SDMB) this whole brouhaha would have blown over, but it rages as fiercely as it did last week. Before i left, i was going to make a post to **Garfield226** ’s [earlier Pit thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=368736), but never got around to it. Now that i see the debate is still going, i’ll make that post here, and take the opportunity to agree with **don’t ask**. In the past, i’ve never really spent much time weighing in on the big moderating controversies. Some of them passed me by altogether, and i only found out about them later on. And, when i do contribute to threads about the mods and admins, it’s usually to address the particular issue at hand, rather than to make blanket criticisms of moderation in general, or of a particular moderator. I don’t think i’ve ever before said “[Insert name here] is a consistently bad moderator and shouldn’t be in a position of power.” In fact, when i do make a generalization, it’s usually to the effect that the moderation is generally reasonable and fair. And i still believe that. But it has become clear to me over the past year or so, based on events during that time, and on other events in the more distant past that i only recently became aware of, that **Tubadiva** is, in fact, a very poor moderator, one who consistently treats this place like her own little fiefdom and whose standards of professionalism are not even up to the level that might reasonably be expected from a volunteer. The last bit of that sentence is, i think, important, because even if **TubaDiva** and the other mods/admins do what they do for absolutely no remuneration— not even a coffee mug—we still have the right to expect a certain level of courtesy and professionalism. We expect volunteer firefighters and volunteer charity workers to be competent at their chosen avocation, and it should be no different here. If you can’t perform at a certain minimum standard, you need to stop doing it, whether you do it for free or not. Now, to **Left Hand of Dorkness** and others who are defending **TubaDiva** here and in the earlier threads: If this particular incident were an isolated and unusual case, your rearguard action would be completely understandable. If everything else had gone swimmingly, and **TubaDiva** had always been a model of disinterested professionalism, i could certainly agree that **Garfield** and others were blowing this particular issue out of proportion. The same could be said of any one of a number of the earlier criticisms of **TubaDiva** and other mods; in fact, the relatively minor nature of some of those incidents was a key reason that decided not to weigh in on some of the discussions. But for some folks on this board, the accumulation of incidents, large and small, over an extended period of time, becomes noticeable and disturbing. From the resume-padding incident to the privacy incident to any one of a number of poor moderating decisions and inconsiderate or peremptory actions, **TubaDiva** has provided, over time, ample evidence that she is just fucking God-awful at this job. Sure, there are people on this board who seem to have a bit of a hard-on over the whole issue, and who look for any opportunity to criticise. But there are also many other members, fair and level-headed and not interested in stirring shit, who have noticed the lack of professionalism combined with self-righteous indignation and have become annoyed enough to comment on it. I guess you might possibly argue that every single person making these criticisms is being unreasonable, but i’m not sure that’s a tenable position. Just how many people have to complain before it becomes reasonable to conclude that there may, in fact, be a problem? Will my attitude to all of this have any effect on my participation here? Probably not. And that’s one possible reason that nothing changes, because while we might complain we continue to stay here and post. I like this place, despite its problems, and one incompetent administrator isn’t bad enough to offset the pleasure i get from posting here. Also, i’ve never suffered directly from **TubaDiva** ’s incompetence and capriciousness, so my own posting habits haven’t really been affected. I just carry on, keeping in the back of my mind that i have very little respect for one of the people running this message board. My opinion of her need not affect either of us in any practical way, but it seems that quite a few people share my opinion, a fact that is already leading to problems, and might lead to even more down the road. ---
**Author:** ![Harborwolf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@Harborwolf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Harborwolf)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2006, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-is-not-fit-to-be-in-a-position-of-power-on-this-board/354845/282 "2006-05-03T15:06:07Z")
> [@saoirse](#): > > There certainly is a Chicken-And-Egg effect, and many of the posters here have cried “egg” so many times that it’s hard to blame the mods for not taking them seriously. However, no matter how many times it’s a false alarm, sometimes when the chicken cries “egg” there really is a wolf in the hothouse. I’m not trying to say that people need to stop calling attention to percieved mod abuses. I just think it’d be dandy if we could be a bit more rational about it. You really can’t start a thread with a title like this one and be surprised when the moderators that respond are a teensy bit hostile. You can’t keep harping on an issue and be surprised that people will post without reading the entirety of another thread. I’m not saying that what Dex did was right, but it’s certainly understandable. **XJETGIRLX** , I’m agree with you, but if I may borrow a phrase from you, in an ideal world a person in authority would be completely above the phrase and nigh zen-like in demeanor. To say that it is only the moderators problem is still wrong. You cannot reasonably expect them to put up with a limitless amount of crap and not get a little snarky in return. ---
**Author:** ![Sevastopol](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/cdc98d/32.png) [@Sevastopol](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sevastopol)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2006, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-is-not-fit-to-be-in-a-position-of-power-on-this-board/354845/283 "2006-05-03T15:13:19Z")
> [@saoirse](#): > > There certainly is a Chicken-And-Egg effect, and many of the posters here have cried “egg” so many times that it’s hard to blame the mods for not taking them seriously. However, no matter how many times it’s a false alarm, sometimes when the chicken cries “egg” there really is a wolf in the hothouse. Isn’t moderation really a question of the bears getting Goldilock’s porridge not too hot or too cold but just right? Because when it comes to giving the golden apple to ‘the fairest’ you need to be sure the apple isn’t the one with the worm, that spoils the barrel. Otherwise the board risks going over the Falls in an uncaulked vessel. There’ll be a lot of noise and the squeaky wheels will get the grease. Whereas you catch more flies with honey and surely that’s the best approach to take with the bears? ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2006, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-is-not-fit-to-be-in-a-position-of-power-on-this-board/354845/284 "2006-05-03T15:16:51Z")
> [@mhendo](#): > > Now, to **Left Hand of Dorkness** and others who are defending **TubaDiva** here and in the earlier threads: > > If this particular incident were an isolated and unusual case, your rearguard action would be completely understandable. You know, if you’d like me to respond to your posts, it’d help if you didn’t start off by mischaracterizing what I’m saying. Daniel ---
**Author:** ![XJETGIRLX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/9fc29f/32.png) [@XJETGIRLX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XJETGIRLX)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2006, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-is-not-fit-to-be-in-a-position-of-power-on-this-board/354845/285 "2006-05-03T15:19:17Z")
> [@Harborwolf](#): > > To say that it is only the moderators problem is still wrong. You cannot reasonably expect them to put up with a limitless amount of crap and not get a little snarky in return. Actually, I can. I would expect no less of any customer service employee. It was expceted of me in every customer service position I ever worked, and I managed to treat even the worst of my customers with the very basest level of polite professional service. Sure, I vented my frustrations in my own time to people not involved, but I would never insult a customer to their face in the course of my interaction with them. That’s part of what the job entails. And like it or not, they are the ones with the responsibility to take the high ground. There is no equal sharing of blame here, because they are the ones with the authority to enfoce the rules. They should be held to a higher standard. If they aren’t up to managing that, they should not be in a position of authority. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2006, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-is-not-fit-to-be-in-a-position-of-power-on-this-board/354845/286 "2006-05-03T15:28:54Z")
> [@XJETGIRLX](#): > > Actually, I can. I would expect no less of any customer service employee. It was expceted of me in every customer service position I ever worked, and I managed to treat even the worst of my customers with the very basest level of polite professional service. Depends on the field. Bartenders, for example, are sometimes rude, and the other customers sometimes appreciate it. My favorite bartender in twon has no problem telling off asshole customers. Remember whatshername, the Texas bartender who used to post around here? She sounded like she rocked, in part **because** she was willing to get in the face of dumb customers. I personally don’t at all mind moderators who occasionally cut loose. Their reasons for doing so may or may not be good, but their doing so is not in itself a problem for me. Daniel ---
**Author:** ![Harborwolf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@Harborwolf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Harborwolf)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2006, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-is-not-fit-to-be-in-a-position-of-power-on-this-board/354845/287 "2006-05-03T15:31:21Z")
> [@XJETGIRLX](#): > > Actually, I can. I would expect no less of any customer service employee. It was expceted of me in every customer service position I ever worked, and I managed to treat even the worst of my customers with the very basest level of polite professional service. Sure, I vented my frustrations in my own time to people not involved, but I would never insult a customer to their face in the course of my interaction with them. That’s part of what the job entails. > > And like it or not, they are the ones with the responsibility to take the high ground. There is no equal sharing of blame here, because they are the ones with the authority to enfoce the rules. They should be held to a higher standard. If they aren’t up to managing that, they should not be in a position of authority. I think we’re just going to have to agree to disagree on this. I understand your point, and I agree that the mods to have more of a responsibility to be…well, more moderate than the posters. I just think that we have our own amount of responsiblity to shoulder. ---
**Author:** ![aldiboronti](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc348/32.png) [@aldiboronti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aldiboronti)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2006, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-is-not-fit-to-be-in-a-position-of-power-on-this-board/354845/288 "2006-05-03T15:31:25Z")
This thread needs a descriptive tagline. How about, “A tale told by an idiot, Full of sound and fury and signifying nothing.” No prizes for guessing who the idiot is. ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2006, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-is-not-fit-to-be-in-a-position-of-power-on-this-board/354845/289 "2006-05-03T15:31:44Z")
> [@Left Hand of Dorkness](#): > > You know, if you’d like me to respond to your posts, it’d help if you didn’t start off by mischaracterizing what I’m saying. > > Daniel Jesus, i made my post in the hopes of having a rational discussion, but it appears that self-righteousness wins the day. I was not making any particular allegation about your involvement except to note that your general tone in this thread and earlier threads was to defend the moderators. You have, with some justification, been criticising some posters and their attitudes, and you have taken issue with their assertions. That’s fine, but what sometimes gets lost in the constant battle of who-said-what-to-whom-and-when is the issue of whether there was any merit to the original criticisms of the mods, and the issue of whether this is part of a larger pattern of problematic behavior. I was simply trying to address those questions. But if you feel the need to see some sort of accusation or disingenuous criticism in my post, knock yourself out. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2006, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-is-not-fit-to-be-in-a-position-of-power-on-this-board/354845/290 "2006-05-03T15:36:44Z")
> [@mhendo](#): > > Jesus, i made my post in the hopes of having a rational discussion, but it appears that self-righteousness wins the day. Waah. When you start off by referring to my opinions as a rearguard action, you shoot yourself in the foot. Next time, if you want serious discussion, don’t start off with an insult. Makes me not read the rest of your post. Daniel ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2006, 3:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-is-not-fit-to-be-in-a-position-of-power-on-this-board/354845/291 "2006-05-03T15:42:51Z")
> [@Left Hand of Dorkness](#): > > Waah. When you start off by referring to my opinions as a rearguard action, you shoot yourself in the foot. Next time, if you want serious discussion, don’t start off with an insult. Makes me not read the rest of your post. > > Daniel I really don’t care enough about you to have this conversation. I made the points i wanted to make in my earlier post, and if you feel the need to take offense at such a miniscule perceived slight, one that i also took the time to clarify in my second post, that’s your prerogative. I did wonder why so many people have been calling you a tool recently; i guess i know now. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2006, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-is-not-fit-to-be-in-a-position-of-power-on-this-board/354845/292 "2006-05-03T15:51:21Z")
> [@Left Hand of Dorkness](#): > > Waah. When you start off by referring to my opinions as a rearguard action, you shoot yourself in the foot. Next time, if you want serious discussion, don’t start off with an insult. Makes me not read the rest of your post. > > Daniel Daniel, you are being silly here. \*\*Mhendo \*\* barely mentioned you in his post and it wasn’t until half way through. Are you carrying your anger towards others over to **mhendo**? I don’t agree with **mhendo’s** post but it was put together with lots of thought and without too much rancor. Pick apart his points if you feel like it or don’t but what you posted about it, makes it appear you didn’t bother reading it in the first place. Jim ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2006, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-is-not-fit-to-be-in-a-position-of-power-on-this-board/354845/293 "2006-05-03T15:55:04Z")
> [@Left Hand of Dorkness](#): > > Waah. When you start off by referring to my opinions as a rearguard action, you shoot yourself in the foot. Next time, if you want serious discussion, don’t start off with an insult. Makes me not read the rest of your post. > > Daniel Where was the insult? I’m honestly not seeing one. Not really seeing the mischaracterization, either, for that matter. You’ve had a merry collection of assholes piling on to you lately, but **mhendo** isn’t one of them, and I think you’re reading more into his comments than is actually there. ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2006, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-is-not-fit-to-be-in-a-position-of-power-on-this-board/354845/294 "2006-05-03T15:56:09Z")
> [@catsix](#): > > I didn’t start this thread, or any of the other ones. A guy on a gaming board I frequent didn’t like something TPTB there did to their game so he bitched about the change and TPTB in every thread on the subject. He also used the “but I never started a thread on the subject!” defense. ---
**Author:** ![Ensign\_Edison](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7ab992/32.png) [@Ensign\_Edison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ensign_Edison)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2006, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-is-not-fit-to-be-in-a-position-of-power-on-this-board/354845/295 "2006-05-03T16:07:50Z")
I think Daniel has whipped himself into one of his Pit frenzies, and is now in a different place from the rest of us; a place where everyone has a scary alien head and he has orders from the Shadow President to shoot to kill. There’s nothing we can do now but get out of the way and wait for him to get tired. Then we can sweep in, strap him down and take him gently away to a nice, quiet room where he can really get some time to get his head together, maybe do a little macrame’ or some watercolor landscapes. It’ll all work out for the best in the end, except of course for the aliens, who, with no one left to fight them, will enslave us all in their salt mines and breeding pits. So don’t be too hard on poor LHoD. Saving the universe from evil is a neverending, thankless task, and it sends even the most dedicated Space Ninjas a little fucking coocoobanananuts from time to time. ---
**Author:** ![catsix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e19b73/32.png) [@catsix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/catsix)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2006, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-is-not-fit-to-be-in-a-position-of-power-on-this-board/354845/296 "2006-05-03T16:19:56Z")
> [@](#): > > **Lute Skywatcher** said: > A guy on a gaming board I frequent didn’t like something TPTB there did to their game so he bitched about the change and TPTB in every thread on the subject. He also used the “but I never started a thread on the subject!” defense. And you’re still off base. I might be part of the subject in these threads, and have posted in them, but I am by far not the one leading the charge. Nor do I post in _every_ thread where there’s a complaint about a mod. I think that you’re unfairly assigning to me the behavior of someone else, some guy, on some other message board that I have probably never even heard of. So, could you please stop treating me as if I am someone who I am not? ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2006, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-is-not-fit-to-be-in-a-position-of-power-on-this-board/354845/297 "2006-05-03T16:22:34Z")
> [@catsix](#): > > And you’re still off base. I might be part of the subject in these threads, and have posted in them, but I am by far not the one leading the charge. Nor do I post in _every_ thread where there’s a complaint about a mod. Didn’t all this get started with you bitching at an admin? The same admin you were bitching about a year ago? ---
**Author:** ![Ensign\_Edison](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7ab992/32.png) [@Ensign\_Edison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ensign_Edison)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2006, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-is-not-fit-to-be-in-a-position-of-power-on-this-board/354845/298 "2006-05-03T16:24:07Z")
> [@Lute Skywatcher](#): > > Didn’t all this get started with you bitching at an admin? The same admin you were bitching about a year ago? Pretty much everybody agrees that no, it did not. It started with her asking a reasonable question in a non-bitchy way. ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2006, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-is-not-fit-to-be-in-a-position-of-power-on-this-board/354845/299 "2006-05-03T16:32:11Z")
> [@Ensign Edison](#): > > Pretty much everybody agrees that no, it did not. It started with her asking a reasonable question in a non-bitchy way. I don’t think **catsix** is capable of not being a bitch in regards to **Tubadiva**. YMMV. I still think **Tuba** ’s original post in that thread was intended as a parody of **drmark** and not to be taken literally. ---
**Author:** ![Garfield226](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Garfield226](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Garfield226)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2006, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-is-not-fit-to-be-in-a-position-of-power-on-this-board/354845/300 "2006-05-03T16:34:01Z")
> [@Lute Skywatcher](#): > > I still think **Tuba** ’s original post in that thread was intended as a parody of **drmark** and not to be taken literally. And I still think that if that was her intention, it was obviously misread by a number of people and would take her less than five minutes to clarify. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-is-not-fit-to-be-in-a-position-of-power-on-this-board/354845.md?page=14) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-is-not-fit-to-be-in-a-position-of-power-on-this-board/354845.md?page=16)