# TubaDiva, you may have missed this. **URL:** \ **Category:** About This Message Board\ **Created:** [September 6, 2011, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-you-may-have-missed-this/595421 "2011-09-06T18:55:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2011, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-you-may-have-missed-this/595421/1 "2011-09-06T18:55:50Z")
Last Friday I reported a post and the only action taken was that the [thread was closed](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=622674). Within [the existing ATMB thread I have](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=622749) (Post #10) inquiring of tomndebb, I added this: [QUOTE=magellan01] I also reported his post late last night. Then this morning I see that: 1. the thread is closed 2. no warning or admonishment was issued to An Gadai 3. a comment by TubaDiva tells AG and I to take it to the pit Questions for TubaDiva: - why wasn’t an Gadia warned or admonished? - what posts of mine in that thread were pit worthy? Or near pit worthy? [/QUOTE] I thought it was easier to just include this question in the other thread, but I assume now that you haven’t seen it. So this thread is just to direct you there. Ideally, you can answer it in the other thread and just close this one. Thanks. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2011, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-you-may-have-missed-this/595421/2 "2011-09-06T19:24:06Z")
And while you are at it, start handing out warnings for using “you and your ilk”, which is a bald-faced personal insult. ---
**Author:** ![TubaDiva](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tubadiva/32/507_2.png) [@TubaDiva](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TubaDiva)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2011, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-you-may-have-missed-this/595421/3 "2011-09-06T19:30:00Z")
I have been out of town and I didn’t see this earlier. I closed the thread because it was an argument that started elsewhere and had made its way to About This Message Board, where it was becoming more heated. About This Message Board is not the Pit, you’re not supposed to tussle with other posters here. If you have a problem with An Gadai – or anyone else – the Pit is where you should be. Not here. About This Message Board is not an appropriate forum to re-fight battles/rehash arguments from other SDMB areas. When we find such a thread in ATMB we will generally close it down. While we could probably revisit the thread and invoke counseling/action I’m going to give it all a pass. ---
**Author:** ![TubaDiva](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tubadiva/32/507_2.png) [@TubaDiva](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TubaDiva)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2011, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-you-may-have-missed-this/595421/4 "2011-09-06T19:36:10Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > And while you are at it, start handing out warnings for using “you and your ilk”, which is a bald-faced personal insult. You and your ilk would say things like that. What is “ilk” anyway? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2011, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-you-may-have-missed-this/595421/5 "2011-09-06T19:48:40Z")
> [@TubaDiva](#): > > I have been out of town and I didn’t see this earlier. > > I closed the thread because it was an argument that started elsewhere and had made its way to About This Message Board, where it was becoming more heated. About This Message Board is not the Pit, you’re not supposed to tussle with other posters here. > > If you have a problem with An Gadai – or anyone else – the Pit is where you should be. Not here. > > About This Message Board is not an appropriate forum to re-fight battles/rehash arguments from other SDMB areas. When we find such a thread in ATMB we will generally close it down. > > While we could probably revisit the thread and invoke counseling/action I’m going to give it all a pass. Huh? I was not carrying over a discussion. I don’t even recall engaging **An Gadai**. Even if I had (which I don’t think I did) all I did was question him on what he posted. Here’s the original exchange: [QUOTE=magellan01] [QUOTE=An Gadai] It’s not that subjective a thing really. OPs that talk about scientific proof that one “race” is stupider than another shouldn’t be tolerated. [/QUOTE] Why? I’m sure that if you took measurement of the races as far as height and weight, head size, etc, they wouldn’t all be precisely equal. Therefore they could be ranked. Why is it so hard to accept that genetic differences might manifest themselves in physical performance? Or intelligence? It’s quite something that a members of a clearly left-leaning debate board would want to quash views that they are uncomfortable with. Why can’t this stuff be discussed? What are you so afraid of? Seriously. [/QUOTE] Where’s the Pit-worthy stuff? The “tussling”? And here are the rest of my posts in that thread: > [@](#): > > How surprising! You ignored the content of my post and instead of trying to explain your position you use sarcasm in some transparent and lame attempt to seize some moral high ground. Results: massive fail. > > I’m still wondering what you’re so afraid of. Or do you only like science when you think you’ll like what it reveals? > [@](#): > > Oh, almost forgot. Are you aware that it is against board rules to call other posters racists? Or do you and your ilk not care that such ad hominems are not only out of bounds, but do nothing to actually argue your point? Please, share how you and your ilk think. I find it fascinating. Keep in mind, these two posts by me were preceded by this one by **An Gadai** —in clear violation of board rules: (bolding mine) [QUOTE=An Gadai] OMG I’m afraid of your equation that proves dem niggers are stupid. Except you don’t have any such proof of anything, \*\*because your concept of race, and that of every other board racist, \*\*is simplistic and flawed. And it doesn’t seem any amount of cited evidence that highlights your misconceptions (of which there’s a truckload) will persuade you, or your ilk, that your ideas are ill-founded, small-minded, bullshit. [/QUOTE] As I asked earlier, and the reason I had reported the post last Friday, where’s the Warning or admonition to An Gadai. Other mods have stated that one my NOT refer to another board member as a racist, except in the Pit. So, why didn’t you come down on **An Gadai** for such a flagrant violation? Next question, what did I write that was pit-worthy? As you know, these discussion don’t stay on a track one centimeter wide. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2011, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-you-may-have-missed-this/595421/6 "2011-09-06T20:19:46Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > Where’s the Pit-worthy stuff? The “tussling”? Yes. She said clearly that the argument between you and **An Gadai** should be taken to the Pit instead of continuing in ATMB. > [@](#): > > Other mods have stated that one my NOT refer to another board member as a racist, except in the Pit. [Oh, really?](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=14206601#post14206601) > [@Statistically, blacks score poorly on IQ and IQ-proxy exams than whites, is black genetics to blame?](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/statistically-blacks-score-poorly-on-iq-and-iq-proxy-exams-than-whites-is-black-genetics-to-blame/594488/104): > > Do not accuse a poster of being a racist in Great Debates. > > [/Moderating] There is no board-wide rule against calling another poster a racist; it’s something we discourage in Great Debates. From what I can tell, **tomndebb** has been consistent on this point and I think I have, too. And you were posting in ATMB. While we don’t allow insults in ATMB, we have to give posters a little bit of latitude in asking questions about the rules. (For example you can’t call another poster a troll or a jerk in any forum except the Pit, but in ATMB you can link to a post or a thread and ask if a certain poster was trolling or being a jerk in that thread.) ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2011, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-you-may-have-missed-this/595421/7 "2011-09-06T20:39:06Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > Yes. She said clearly that the argument between you and **An Gadai** should be taken to the Pit instead of continuing in ATMB. > [Oh, really?](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=14206601#post14206601) > There is no board-wide rule against calling another poster a racist; it’s something we discourage in Great Debates. From what I can tell, **tomndebb** has been consistent on this point and I think I have, too. And you were posting in ATMB. While we don’t allow insults in ATMB, we have to give posters a little bit of latitude in asking questions about the rules. (For example you can’t call another poster a troll or a jerk in any forum except the Pit, but in ATMB you can link to a post or a thread and ask if a certain poster was trolling or being a jerk in that thread.) Please. Is “racist” an insult or not. Answer: “yes”. Therefore, even by your own calculation **An Gadai** was in clear violation of the ATMB rules. I reported it and no Warning or admonishment was issued to him. I must admit that I was quite surprised by this, given how blatant his violation. But I am getting less and less surprised at this bullshit. Ignorance being fought and all that. You know, if you guys want to stay on that tightrope and continually try to argue with a straight face that the moderation of this board isn’t badly biased, you should just suck it up and accept that every once in a while you’re going to have to not let flagrant violations by those who share your sensibilities skate by. Come on, man. At least try to make it a little believable!! ---
**Author:** ![Irishman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b487fb/32.png) [@Irishman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Irishman)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2011, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-you-may-have-missed-this/595421/8 "2011-09-06T20:42:47Z")
Wearing my **TubaDiva** hat\* for a moment (it doesn’t fit well, but I’ll pretend), I read in that thread that **An Gadai** asking why we don’t outlaw certain kinds of threads/arguments. Marley, samclem, and tomndebb all chime in that it isn’t going to happen, with various responses about why. In the process, An Gadai tries to justify his request with the statement that certain claims are not based on science, that the claimed science to support their position is flawed and repeatedly demonstrated. You came along and replied to that claim. At that point, the ATMB thread is moving away from “why don’t we ban this topic” to rehashing the arguments of the topic. That right there is marginal. I say marginal, because I can see an argument that An Gadai wanted to justify why the threads should be banned, and thus that makes the basis for that claim seem material. Which it would be if the mods were giving it any merit. Except the mods were not accepting the claim as the basis for a decision, and responding to An Gadai’s request in the negative based on other matters. So An Gadai responds to your counterargument with his Pit-worthy reply. They you replied to him with a counter finger-pointing. Now I grant you that you didn’t steep to the name-calling level that An Gadai did, but to a non-participant, there’s a fair amount of back and forth going on right there. Couple the rehashed argument that really should be in GD instead of ATMB with An Gadai getting name-cally and you kinda sorta giving it back, and I suspect TubaDiva felt “Both of you cut it out” and closed the thread. Especially since the answer had already been given - No, we’re not automatically closing/locking threads on this topic. ## Now not wearing my TubaDiva hat (she’ll appreciate that), to me it doesn’t feel like your comments per se are Pitworthy, but the focus of the argument was aimed at An Gadai rather than his argument (specifically that “you and your ilk” business), so that is Pit territory. \*It should be obvious, I’m not TubaDiva, I’m not a mod or admin, I’m merely trying to guess at her perspective. I don’t really have a TubaDiva hat. TubaDiva isn’t a hat. I don’t really like hats, anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2011, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-you-may-have-missed-this/595421/9 "2011-09-06T20:45:48Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > Is “racist” an insult or not. Answer: “yes”. While I hold out little hope this will satisfy you, it is not an insult. It’s a personal comment that we discourage, but it is not a personal insult. And again, **tomndebb** ’s instruction said not to call someone a racist in Great Debates, and when **An Gadaí** called you a racist, the post was not in Great Debates. ---
**Author:** ![Irishman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b487fb/32.png) [@Irishman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Irishman)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2011, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-you-may-have-missed-this/595421/10 "2011-09-06T20:50:34Z")
Marley, while there may need to be some leeway for discussing context in ATMB, I don’t think An Gadai’s comment fits that bill. > [@](#): > > OMG I’m afraid of your equation that proves dem niggers are stupid. Except you don’t have any such proof of anything, because your concept of race, and that of every other board racist, is simplistic and flawed. And it doesn’t seem any amount of cited evidence that highlights your misconceptions (of which there’s a truckload) will persuade you, or your ilk, that your ideas are ill-founded, small-minded, bullshit. That is not characterizing the content of the post, it is labeling board posters, including specifically **magellan01**. That comment seems to me to serve no purpose but to inflame. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2011, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-you-may-have-missed-this/595421/11 "2011-09-06T20:55:19Z")
And that’s why the posters were told to take it to the Pit. Maybe it would make more sense if I put it this way: **magellan01** is asserting that “racist” is treated as a personal insult here (it isn’t) and that the mods usually warn posters who use it (we don’t). ---
**Author:** ![TubaDiva](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tubadiva/32/507_2.png) [@TubaDiva](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TubaDiva)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2011, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-you-may-have-missed-this/595421/12 "2011-09-06T21:12:10Z")
> [@Irishman](#): > > Wearing my **TubaDiva** hat\* for a moment (it doesn’t fit well, but I’ll pretend), I read in that thread that **An Gadai** asking why we don’t outlaw certain kinds of threads/arguments. Marley, samclem, and tomndebb all chime in that it isn’t going to happen, with various responses about why. > > In the process, An Gadai tries to justify his request with the statement that certain claims are not based on science, that the claimed science to support their position is flawed and repeatedly demonstrated. > > You came along and replied to that claim. At that point, the ATMB thread is moving away from “why don’t we ban this topic” to rehashing the arguments of the topic. That right there is marginal. I say marginal, because I can see an argument that An Gadai wanted to justify why the threads should be banned, and thus that makes the basis for that claim seem material. Which it would be if the mods were giving it any merit. Except the mods were not accepting the claim as the basis for a decision, and responding to An Gadai’s request in the negative based on other matters. > > So An Gadai responds to your counterargument with his Pit-worthy reply. They you replied to him with a counter finger-pointing. > > Now I grant you that you didn’t steep to the name-calling level that An Gadai did, but to a non-participant, there’s a fair amount of back and forth going on right there. > Couple the rehashed argument that really should be in GD instead of ATMB with An Gadai getting name-cally and you kinda sorta giving it back, and I suspect TubaDiva felt “Both of you cut it out” and closed the thread. Especially since the answer had already been given - No, we’re not automatically closing/locking threads on this topic. > > ## Now not wearing my TubaDiva hat (she’ll appreciate that), to me it doesn’t feel like your comments per se are Pitworthy, but the focus of the argument was aimed at An Gadai rather than his argument (specifically that “you and your ilk” business), so that is Pit territory. > > \*It should be obvious, I’m not TubaDiva, I’m not a mod or admin, I’m merely trying to guess at her perspective. I don’t really have a TubaDiva hat. TubaDiva isn’t a hat. I don’t really like hats, anyway. Actually, you wear it well. And I thank you. I would tip my hat to you but you’re wearing it. 🙂 You have summed up very nicely the entire situation. Which I thought was clear to everyone, which is why I didn’t think I needed to expound on it. ---
**Author:** ![An\_Gadai](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@An\_Gadai](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/An_Gadai)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2011, 9:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-you-may-have-missed-this/595421/13 "2011-09-06T21:23:39Z")
OMG, my ears are burning. ---
**Author:** ![twickster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ec9cab/32.png) [@twickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twickster)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2011, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-you-may-have-missed-this/595421/14 "2011-09-06T21:49:36Z")
> [@An\_Gadai](#): > > OMG, my ears are burning. Wash carefully – who knows what was on/in that hat. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2011, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-you-may-have-missed-this/595421/15 "2011-09-06T21:58:30Z")
> [@](#): > > What is “ilk” anyway? It’s like a møøse. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2011, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-you-may-have-missed-this/595421/16 "2011-09-06T22:00:17Z")
> [@TubaDiva](#): > > What is “ilk” anyway? It’s like a moose. Glad I could clear that up for you. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2011, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-you-may-have-missed-this/595421/17 "2011-09-06T22:01:45Z")
No fair, Chronos, using your ability to control the flow of time to ninja me. ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2011, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-you-may-have-missed-this/595421/18 "2011-09-06T22:09:41Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > While I hold out little hope this will satisfy you, it is not an insult. It’s a personal comment that we discourage, but it is not a personal insult. :eek: Say WHAT?!!! Calling someone a racist is _not_ an insult? _Very_ interesting. Then, pray tell, why is it against the rules in GD? You’re living on an other planet if you think calling someone a racist isn’t an insult. That may be not only THE most ridiculous comment you’ve ever made, but that has ever appeared on these boards—period. But please, by all means, let’s hear you’re rationale. Here, let me get you a bigger shovel. I can’t wait to here this. > [@Marley23](#): > > And again, **tomndebb** ’s instruction said not to call someone a racist in Great Debates, and when **An Gadaí** called you a racist, the post was not in Great Debates. Ahem. I know where the post was. That’s why I got **Tuba** is involved. ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2011, 10:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-you-may-have-missed-this/595421/19 "2011-09-06T22:17:18Z")
Oh, I forgot this regarding your other dodge, [from here.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=623061) Post #15. (bolding mine) [QUOTE=C K Dexter Haven] Just as a reminder and general statement: name-calling directed at other posters is NOT PERMITTED on the Straight Dope Message Boards, except in the forum called “The BBQ Pit.” **In all other forums, name-calling/personal insults are a direct violation of our rules.** [/QUOTE] ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2011, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-you-may-have-missed-this/595421/20 "2011-09-06T22:18:19Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > You’re living on an other planet if you think calling someone a racist isn’t an insult. That may be not only THE most ridiculous comment you’ve ever made, but that has ever appeared on these boards—period. I’ve seen way ridiculouser. “Racist” doesn’t strike _me_ as an insult, but it’s something the accuser should be prepared to back up with examples of the alleged racist’s racism and it’s greatly overused, like accusations of “hypocrite”. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tubadiva-you-may-have-missed-this/595421.md?page=2)