# Turn Out the Lights, Republicans **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [April 28, 2016, 11:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/turn-out-the-lights-republicans/753326 "2016-04-28T11:44:21Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2016, 11:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/turn-out-the-lights-republicans/753326/1 "2016-04-28T11:44:21Z")
The Guest Editorial in **Variety** (of all places) has some wonderful phrases in it, going 'way off the Deep End: > [@](#): > > Cleveland, it’s safe to say, is going to be the most “Democratic” Republican convention ever, which is not the same as saying it’s going to be the most democratic Republican convention ever. Conventions are never democratic — each party’s primary rules are a tangled knot of delegate selection, favor-banking, threats and even actual voting results — but Republicans in Cleveland are going to get a taste of what Democrats have been experiencing for years. There will be threats. There will be protests. There will be fists raised. There will be stupefying ignorance about how it all works. There will be so many “calls to order” and “points of process” and “moves to suspend” that each cable news outfit will have Robert’s Rules of Order experts on-camera, daily, to explain what, exactly, is happening (and more likely, what, exactly, isn’t happening) and why. There will be absurd rumors: Sen. Tom Coburn is wooing delegates! Paul Ryan is meeting with Condoleeza Rice! Mitt Romney is in that skybox! And there will be accusations of fraud, mendacity, bribery, theft and, probably, incest and cannibalism, because once you get started on that stuff, it’s hard to pull back. > [@](#): > > The Reagan-era unity that led the party to the White House, to House and Senate majorities, to an overwhelming advantage in statehouses and governorships across the country — it’s all starting to fray and fracture along the San Andreas Trump, between the big-government vagueness of Make America Great Again-ism and the Gospel of Tax Cuts and Economic Growth. > > It turns out that the constituencies that made up the Republican Party secretly hate each other. The D.C. and coastal moderates are tired of being yoked with the religious crowd. The movement conservatives are sick of making common cause with the increasingly on-the-dole working-class right. The small-towners hate the big-timers. The patriots hate the libertarians. About the only things they all agree on are the importance of American-flag lapel pins and the notion that all political consultants should be publicly executed. > **[Turn Out the Lights on Republicans — the Party’s Over (Guest Column)](https://variety.com/2016/biz/news/republican-party-over-gop-rob-long-1201760435/)** > > One writer weighs in on the state of the Republican party -- and it doesn't look good. The kicker is that the author of this Republican-bashing freewheeling piece is Rob Long — “a contributing editor for National Review and co-founder of the conservative community website [ricochet.com](http://ricochet.com).” > [@](#): > > Make popcorn. It’s going to be quite a funeral. The guests are going to be shouting and fighting so hard and loud that it’s even possible they’ll rouse the corpse. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2016, 11:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/turn-out-the-lights-republicans/753326/2 "2016-04-28T11:53:04Z")
I’m afraid it will be anticlimactic. Trump will have it sewn up going into the convention. Not to say I wouldn’t mind munching on popcorn and watching fists and teargas fly, and it would be cool if Dan Rather got himself carried off the floor by a bunch of thugs for old times’ sake, but I don’t think it will have as much drama and fireworks as we might hope. ---
**Author:** ![elbows](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/b3f665/32.png) [@elbows](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elbows)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2016, 12:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/turn-out-the-lights-republicans/753326/3 "2016-04-28T12:11:31Z")
Ah, if only they were willing to live their beliefs, (and allow in those guns they love so much and think should be everywhere, yknow, for safety reasons!) Now that would make for a convention we’d all tune in to. Part of me believes it might just be the antidote to the frothy rhetoric/bald faced lies. Maybe if everyone was armed the speakers would be less inclined to stirring up their constituency! ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2016, 1:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/turn-out-the-lights-republicans/753326/4 "2016-04-28T13:44:01Z")
> [@elbows](#): > > Ah, if only they were willing to live their beliefs, ( **and allow in those guns** they love so much and think should be everywhere, yknow, for safety reasons!) > > Now that would make for a convention we’d all tune in to. Part of me believes it might just be the antidote to the frothy rhetoric/bald faced lies. Maybe if everyone was armed the speakers would be less inclined to stirring up their constituency! I believe the Secret Service (and probably the venue’s insurance carrier) put the kibosh on that one. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2016, 1:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/turn-out-the-lights-republicans/753326/5 "2016-04-28T13:54:57Z")
Well, we don’t NEED Secret Service there if everyone has guns, now do we? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Count\_Blucher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c5a1d2/32.png) [@Count\_Blucher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Count_Blucher)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2016, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/turn-out-the-lights-republicans/753326/6 "2016-04-28T14:20:12Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > Trump will have it sewn up going into the convention. [Here’s a theme song for Republicans Convention, if they’re taking requests](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ymx74gyvz28)…[.](http://solongpsoriasis.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/vaseline-for-psoriasis.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![Simplicio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c37758/32.png) [@Simplicio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Simplicio)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2016, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/turn-out-the-lights-republicans/753326/7 "2016-04-28T14:32:26Z")
> [@OP's article](#): > > but Republicans in Cleveland are going to get a taste of what Democrats have been experiencing for years. There will be threats. There will be protests. There will be fists raised Democrats have been experiencing this for years? I admittedly don’t watch the convention coverage very closely, but I don’t really remember any of this happening in meaningful amounts since the Vietnam era. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2016, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/turn-out-the-lights-republicans/753326/8 "2016-04-28T14:35:15Z")
> [@Simplicio](#): > > Democrats have been experiencing this for years? I admittedly don’t watch the convention coverage very closely, but I don’t really remember any of this happening in meaningful amounts since the Vietnam era. I think the original piece is referring to the disparate elemenmts within the Democratic Party fighting amongst themselves, with no clear direction. The Republicans , despite the veryt different philosophies of their constituencies, have shown more party discipline and moved in lockstep. _That’s_ what is now breaking down in the party. I don’t think he’s saying that the Democrats have been having rioting in their convention. Not since 1968, anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Icarus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/icarus/32/72_2.png) [@Icarus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Icarus)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2016, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/turn-out-the-lights-republicans/753326/9 "2016-04-28T14:55:47Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > I don’t think he’s saying that the Democrats have been having rioting in their convention. Not since 1968, anyway. Yeah, but to a Republican, anything that a Democrat has done over the last 100 years is still happening and all Democrats do it on a daily basis. ---
**Author:** ![Simplicio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c37758/32.png) [@Simplicio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Simplicio)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2016, 3:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/turn-out-the-lights-republicans/753326/10 "2016-04-28T15:07:14Z")
> [@Icarus](#): > > Yeah, but to a Republican, anything that a Democrat has done over the last 100 years is still happening and all Democrats do it on a daily basis. Yea, the article seems like a kinda silly effort to project 1968 forward onto the present day Democratic party, which hasn’t been particularly disorganized over the last two or three decades, anyways. I think he’s sort of doing the opposite with the GOP as well, pretending that the GOP’s current trouble controlling its base started with Trump. But the GOP has been dealing with upstart, anti-intellectual candidates primarying establishment picks since 2008, and had to depend on Dem votes to pass bills out of the House since they won the majority. Trump just seems like the most prominent example of an ongoing process. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2016, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/turn-out-the-lights-republicans/753326/11 "2016-04-28T15:18:11Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > The Guest Editorial in **Variety** (of all places) has some wonderful phrases in it, going 'way off the Deep End: (post shortened) That is one very entertaining article. Seriously. Unfortunately for Rob Long, the Democrat collective, media outlets, and others have been predicting the demise of the GOP since at least 2009 and they’re still wrong. They ignore the fact that many voters don’t seem to care what the professional pundits and media talking heads have to say about this issue. Currently, you have millions of voters who disregard the will (demands?) of the pundits, media, and the usual party power brokers and vote for Trump and Bernie. _But, but, but that’s just not possible. Why don’t these voters listen to, and obey, the pundits, media, and power brokers anymore?_ My guess is that many voters are tired of listening to the horseshit being spewed by people who can’t/won’t believe that the voters could possibly form their own opinions without receiving direction from the professionals. Maybe Rob Long is looking at this issue wrong? If you remember, the Tea Party was formed by individual voters who were disenchanted by the SSDD politics coming from the usual GOP power brokers. The purpose of political parties is to get candidates elected. Fewer elected candidates means less political power. No elected candidates means no political power. The Tea Party has become one of the most successful grassroots political parties ever because the Tea Party did managed to elect enough candidates to upset the plans of both the Democrat and Republican parties. Change has been coming from within the party. The Democrat Party is facing it’s own Tea Party-type movement from the supporters of Bernie Sanders. It appears that many more voters have grown tired of the SSDD politics coming from the usual power brokers running the state and national Democrat parties. _How many types of delegates did they say there? How did Hillary end up with hundreds of delegates before anyone even voted? Why isn’t the DNC supporting both of their leading candidates equally? This system just doesn’t seem fair. Maybe I and my friends can change things?_ If the Bernie supporters stay strong, change will come from within the party. But it won’t be easy. In the mean time, I’ll continue to read articles like Rob Long’s and laugh. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2016, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/turn-out-the-lights-republicans/753326/12 "2016-04-28T15:56:31Z")
> [@Simplicio](#): > > I think he’s sort of doing the opposite with the GOP as well, pretending that the GOP’s current trouble controlling its base started with Trump. But the GOP has been dealing with upstart, anti-intellectual candidates primarying establishment picks since 2008, and had to depend on Dem votes to pass bills out of the House since they won the majority. Trump just seems like the most prominent example of an ongoing process. Do Not Call Up Any You Cannot Again Put Down, Wizard [Santelli](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tea_Party_movement#First_national_protests). ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2016, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/turn-out-the-lights-republicans/753326/13 "2016-04-28T16:07:40Z")
The _National Review_ hates, hates, hates Trump. Anything one of its mindless minions says can be discarded except for enertainment and schadenfreude. He also doesn’t seem to have noticed that the Republican Convention doesn’t operate under Robert’s Rules but House [of Representatives] Rules. That’s actually been a major controversy, with [Solomon Yue](http://www.npr.org/2016/04/22/475157156/as-a-contested-convention-looms-republicans-punt-on-rules-changes) loudly advocating for Robert’s Rules to make the convention more “democratic” and the RNC loudly ignoring him. If Long doesn’t know that, he’s even more worthless than one would think. [limbo voice](How low can we go?[/limbo voice] You might compare his ignorance with that of doorhinge. > [@](#): > > If you remember, the Tea Party was formed by individual voters who were disenchanted by the SSDD politics coming from the usual GOP power brokers. [Sourcewatch](http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php/Tea_Party) > [@](#): > > In an article in the August 30, 2010 issue of The New Yorker magazine, author Jane Mayer links the billionaire brothers David Koch and Charles Koch, owners of Koch Industries to tea party movement funding. … > > Reports indicate that the Tea Party Movement benefits from millions of dollars from conservative foundations that are derived from wealthy U.S. families and their business interests. It appears that money to organize and implement the Movement flows primarily through two conservative groups: Americans for Prosperity and FreedomWorks. Guess what? The same Koch brothers who heavily funded the success of the Tea Party have abandoned Trump and may covertly support Clinton. Oh, those plucky anti-establishment true Americans by the millions and all their power over the world. Did I mention schadenfreude? Yeah, but let’s say it again. Schadenfreude. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2016, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/turn-out-the-lights-republicans/753326/14 "2016-04-28T16:09:40Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > . . . the Democrat collective . . . . . . not only does not exist, but is a [Not Even Wrong](http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Not_even_wrong) sort of notion. ---
**Author:** ![Do\_Not\_Taunt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/do_not_taunt/32/2968_2.png) [@Do\_Not\_Taunt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Do_Not_Taunt)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2016, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/turn-out-the-lights-republicans/753326/15 "2016-04-28T16:22:40Z")
It’s not even grammatically correct! (if [http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Not\_even\_grammatically\_correct](http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Not_even_grammatically_correct) doesn’t link to anything, it should.) ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2016, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/turn-out-the-lights-republicans/753326/16 "2016-04-28T16:35:45Z")
> [@](#): > > And there will be accusations of fraud, mendacity, bribery, theft and, probably, incest and cannibalism, because once you get started on that stuff, it’s hard to pull back. I’m sure Ted Cruz will be along any day to tell us how people would be banging their siblings and eating human flesh _all the time_ if there weren’t a law against it. ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2016, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/turn-out-the-lights-republicans/753326/17 "2016-04-28T16:49:10Z")
Although I don’t think the Republican convention will be this bad, I would see the [reform party convention of 2000](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reform_Party_presidential_primaries,_2000)as a better match than the Democratic conventions of the 1960’s. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2016, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/turn-out-the-lights-republicans/753326/18 "2016-04-28T17:03:50Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > …Guess what? The same Koch brothers who heavily funded the success of the Tea Party have abandoned Trump and may covertly support Clinton. Oh, those plucky anti-establishment true Americans by the millions and all their power over the world. (post shortened) Funding for political parties comes from many sources. Funding doesn’t guarantee votes. Lots of money has been spent on losing campaigns. Voters vote and their numbers still count. Voters are voting for Bernie and Trump because they do not like the SSDD politics of the established political parties. There are many highly paid professionals who are more than willing to tell the voters how they should vote and how stupid the voters are for not voting the way the professionals told them to. It’s becoming apparent that many voters don’t care what the highly paid professional pundits and media types have to say. It’s just more of the SSDD blah, blah, blah, yadda, yadda, yadda, political horseshit that more and more voters have learned to tune out. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2016, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/turn-out-the-lights-republicans/753326/19 "2016-04-28T17:06:34Z")
doorhinge, do you think Rob Long is part of the Democrat collective? ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2016, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/turn-out-the-lights-republicans/753326/20 "2016-04-28T17:10:12Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > . . . not only does not exist, but is a [Not Even Wrong](http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Not_even_wrong) sort of notion. Hahahaha. A collection of Democrats would be a Democrat collective. Your denial of that fact doesn’t change reality. I guess that makes you not even wrong. (Whatever that means.) 😃 [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/turn-out-the-lights-republicans/753326.md?page=2)