# Twin Cities **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [May 23, 2002, 6:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twin-cities/110450 "2002-05-23T06:43:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2002, 5:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twin-cities/110450/21 "2002-05-24T05:28:41Z")
Minneapolis is the very pinacle of urbane sophistication, in terms of what Midwestern rubes are permitted. St. Paul is the mildly retarded kid sister that your Mom makes you take with. Its the place to stick the Lutheran Colleges and Women’s University’s. It is the only city in the USA wherein the street/address system is adopted from the Chinese. Not everybody knows that. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2002, 5:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twin-cities/110450/22 "2002-05-24T05:46:59Z")
I’ll admit that for years I also thought Minneapolis was in Minnesota while St. Paul was nearby but over the state line in Wisconsin. ---
**Author:** ![Mandarax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/df705f/32.png) [@Mandarax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mandarax)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2002, 6:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twin-cities/110450/23 "2002-05-24T06:18:38Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Bryan Ekers \* > \*\*I’ll admit that for years I also thought Minneapolis was in Minnesota while St. Paul was nearby but over the state line in Wisconsin. \*\* Of course, it would be somewhat odd for the capital of Minnesota to be in Wisconsin. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2002, 6:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twin-cities/110450/24 "2002-05-24T06:21:03Z")
Hence the collapse of the belief as soon as I did some actual reading. ---
**Author:** ![chique](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4491bb/32.png) [@chique](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chique)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2002, 10:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twin-cities/110450/25 "2002-05-24T10:13:56Z")
> [@](#): > > _Originally posted by Candlemas_ > \*\*- - Minneapolis is more working class. It is predominantly blue collar and its economy is mostly industry driven. > > - > - St. Paul is more white collar and its economy is more business driven. > > - > - Most Mpls’ers think people from St. Paul are snooty. Most St. Paulers think people from Mpls. are a little low class. \*\* > [@](#): > > _Originally posted by ummm… yeahh…_ > \*\*Well, as our esteemed governor pointed out one time, the streets in St. Paul make sense. If you’re on 3rd and you need to go one block over, you can expect it to be 4th. In Mpls, you can be on 3rd and 11th is only one block over. \*\* Um…I think both of you guys switched cities there. I mean, I know the Cities are twins and all, but it was all the working-class, ill-bred Irishmen than got ticked off at our _cough_ governor _cough_ for making fun of St. Paul’s street system. [sub]Tongue firmly in cheek.[/sub] > [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by NurseCarmen \* > **…my little chunk of the planet…** [There are more of us than you think](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=103080&perpage=40&pagenumber=1) 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![chique](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4491bb/32.png) [@chique](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chique)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2002, 10:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twin-cities/110450/26 "2002-05-24T10:23:40Z")
Heh. And I forgot to mention the ‘twin’ thang. Someone once told me he thought of Minneapolis as NYC and St. Paul as Chicago - two great cities in their own right but with slightly different attitudes. I’m not really sure I wholeheartedly agree with that, but to a point it does make sense. I also forgot to smack **elucidator** upside the head for that “rube” comment 😛 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Opengrave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/919ad9/32.png) [@Opengrave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Opengrave)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2002, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twin-cities/110450/27 "2002-05-24T17:50:55Z")
I [Texarkana](http://www.texarkana.org) perspective. Pretty much everyone I know just considers it one city. They are actually separate cities with individual governments and all but that never seems to be a big deal. Texarkana has some other oddities that I bet don’t occur on many other twin cities. First is the [Federal Building](http://www.aristotle.net/~russjohn/tkana.html) that straddles the state line. The flag pole in the picture is the state line dividing Texas and Arkansas. Here is a cheesy [photo](http://www.virtualtourist.com/m/.129974/3358/?s=b) of the tourist island at the front of the building. Next is the Bi State Justice Center noted for its unique positioning straddling the state line. It sits in two states, two cities, and two counties. This building is home to over 20 city, county and state judicial and law enforcement agencies for the two states of Arkansas and Texas. Special legislation by both states created an exceptional legal jurisdiction applicable only inside the building. Functions for one state, county, or city may be legally performed in the offices of the other. For example, an Arkansas judge may hold court in a courtroom which is physically located in Texas. And vice versa. We actually call ourselves the ‘Four States Area’ because LA and OK are so close. ---
**Author:** ![Wikkit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c0e974/32.png) [@Wikkit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wikkit)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2002, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twin-cities/110450/28 "2002-05-24T23:55:51Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by NurseCarmen \* > \*\*While traveling, when I tell people I’m from Minneapolis (they just look at you blank when you say Saint Paul) They say "oh neat, that’s the place with the big car race, right? \*\* When I would say I was from Mediapolis, it was even worse. Everyone would mis-hear it as Minneapolis. ---
**Author:** ![Grither](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grither/32/425_2.png) [@Grither](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grither)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2002, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twin-cities/110450/29 "2002-05-25T00:08:38Z")
(Wherein Michael veers wildly into IMHO territory) > [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Candlemas \* > \*\*- - Minneapolis is more working class. It is predominantly blue collar and its economy is mostly industry driven. > > - > - St. Paul is more white collar and its economy is more business driven.\*\* Hmmm…this is just the opposite of my recollection of living in the Twin Cities (Minneapolis, in particular). I worked for a LOT of different temp agencies in the area, and not once did they have a listing for me in St. Paul… > [@](#): > > **- - Most Mpls’ers think people from St. Paul are snooty. Most St. Paulers think people from Mpls. are a little low class.** Most all of the clubs worth talking about in the Twin Cities is in Minneapolis. As are most of the really happening restaurants, theaters, and other nightlife. I dare you to try to find an indepent cinema or record shop in St. Paul. It was always the joke amongst my group of friends that they rolled up the sidewalks in St. Paul at 6:00 p.m. But, then, I was hanging with Urbane Sophisticates at the time, so perhaps our heads were stuck firmly in the (Minneapolis) sand. If anything, we thought of St. Paul as the cute little city where the big Broadway Tours come. ---
**Author:** ![Swede\_Hollow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/3bc359/32.png) [@Swede\_Hollow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Swede_Hollow)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2002, 2:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twin-cities/110450/30 "2002-05-25T02:13:22Z")
There are three sets of “Twin Cities” connected to Minnesota. THE Twin Cities of Saint Paul and Minneapolis; the previously mentioned Duluth, MN and Superior, WI; and Fargo, ND and Moorhead, MN. I guess we’re all afraid of being alone. ---
**Author:** ![CnoteChris](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/278dde/32.png) [@CnoteChris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CnoteChris)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2002, 2:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twin-cities/110450/31 "2002-05-25T02:26:36Z")
I concur with those saying that **Candlemas** got it reversed- Minneapolis is the shit, and St. Paul is… hmmmm. I haven’t been over there in so long, it’s hard to say. Whatever it is, it’ll forever be stuck behind Minneapolis (St. Paul’s new arena is pretty cool, though). Me? I live in Uptown, the coolest of the two. -smile- In terms of the Twin City aspect of this question, I seem to recall, years ago, getting a question in Trivial Pursuit that claimed that the true Twin Cities were Austin and Dallas (? - I think) Texas. At the time, we were stunned. Austin and Dallas? But that’s what the answer said. We decided to ignore their ‘correct’ answer. Anything else you want to know about Minneapolis/St. Paul? ---
**Author:** ![Mandarax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/df705f/32.png) [@Mandarax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mandarax)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2002, 4:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twin-cities/110450/32 "2002-05-25T04:44:15Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by CnoteChris \* > **In terms of the Twin City aspect of this question, I seem to recall, years ago, getting a question in Trivial Pursuit that claimed that the true Twin Cities were Austin and Dallas (? - I think) Texas. At the time, we were stunned. Austin and Dallas? But that’s what the answer said.** Could it have been Dallas and Fort Worth? These two are part of the same metropolitan area – city centers are separated by 30 miles – but Austin is about 180 miles from Dallas. ---
**Author:** ![BlackKnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/eb8c5e/32.png) [@BlackKnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BlackKnight)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2002, 5:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twin-cities/110450/33 "2002-05-25T05:29:16Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Swede Hollow \* > \*\*I guess we’re all afraid of being alone. \*\* Nah, we’re just extremely friendly. 🙂 (Actually, the Duluth / Superior brotherhood is just 'cause there are lots of college students in Duluth and lots of alcohol in Superior. A match made in heaven! 😉 ) ---
**Author:** ![CnoteChris](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/278dde/32.png) [@CnoteChris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CnoteChris)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2002, 2:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twin-cities/110450/34 "2002-05-25T14:04:37Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Mandarax \* > **Could it have been Dallas and Fort Worth?** That sounds right. I was racking my brain trying to remember the question and went with what ‘sounded’ right, but even after typing it up and looking at a map of Texas, I wasn’t really sure. But now I am- It said Dallas - Fort Worth. Thanks. [quote] _Originally posted by BlackKnight_ **(Actually, the Duluth / Superior brotherhood is just 'cause there are lots of college students in Duluth and lots of alcohol in Superior. A match made in heaven!)** Done that a few times myself. Talk about driving the gauntlet… cops everywhere. Personally, I’ve never heard of the Duluth - Superior = Twin City thing, but I have heard it referred to as the Twin Ports. Same thing? ---
**Author:** ![elmwood](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmwood/32/3060_2.png) [@elmwood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elmwood)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2002, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twin-cities/110450/35 "2002-05-25T19:31:35Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Exapno Mapcase \* > \*\*Niagara Falls, New York and Niagara Falls, Ontario or Niagara Falls and Buffalo, New York > \*\* Not really twins, but rather cases of industrial satelite towns that developed independently. Buffalonians don’t think of Niagara Falls as an equal, but rather as a gritty suburb of sorts – the same thing as North Tonawanda, Lockport and Lackawanna. There’s plenty of old, large industrial satelites orbiting North American cities – not quite suburban, but not quite major, independent-feeling cities in their own right, either. Buffalo --\> Niagara Falls, NY; Niagara Falls, ON; St. Catharines, ON Philadelphia --\> Camden, NJ; Chester, PA Albany --\> Troy New York --\> Newark, NJ St. Louis --\> East St. Louis, MO Kansas City, MO --\> Kansas City, KS Los Angeles --\> Long Beach Houston --\> Pasadena ---
**Author:** ![elmwood](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmwood/32/3060_2.png) [@elmwood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elmwood)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2002, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twin-cities/110450/36 "2002-05-25T19:40:38Z")
I’d also have to agree with the popular image of the Twin Cities – Minneapolis = a colder version of Seattle or Denver, St. Paul = “Oof-da, where’s the lutefisk? The women of St. Borkborkbork’s Lutheran Church are expecting it for their knitting circle!” Inevitably, when someone discusses twin cities in a bulletin board, the Denver-Aurora thing will come up. Denver and Aurora aren’t twins, even if Aurora grows to a point where it has a larger population than Denver. Aurora has no “edge city” type area, no downtown to speak of – it’s just an ginormous suburb. ---
**Author:** ![OldBroad](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/ed655f/32.png) [@OldBroad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OldBroad)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2002, 12:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twin-cities/110450/37 "2002-05-26T00:04:13Z")
I was born in St. Paul, of native St. Paulites - both from large families. Moved to Chicago when I was little and grew up there. When I moved back to “The Cities” in '75 I was anxious to get acquainted and reacquainted with cousins. I was invited to all kinds of family events and was expected to attend. They all lived in St. Paul and some in North St. Paul. Strangely, when I invited them to my home in Bloomington (on the Mpls. side of the river) most of them couldn’t come because it was TOO FAR. Or maybe they didn’t have visas to cross the river. These cities seemed to have all the same love-hate feelings for one another as human siblings do. It seems strange to see Mpls characterized as the blue-collar town when that seems to have always been ascribed to St. Paul. Must be the nouveau riche are just jealous of Summit Avenue. ---
**Author:** ![Swede\_Hollow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/3bc359/32.png) [@Swede\_Hollow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Swede_Hollow)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2002, 12:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twin-cities/110450/38 "2002-05-26T00:45:25Z")
We definitely have our qwirks. St. Paul seems to have had a lot of trouble historically with directions. Jesse Ventura announced to the world the joke about the layout of downtown being done by drunk (insert current “joke” nationality here). But there is also the issue of our suburbs. West St. Paul is south of St. Paul; South St. Paul is southeast; North St. Paul is east; Maplewood and Roseville are north. Apparently compasses weren’t very good back then. Of course, alcohol COULD have been involved. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Wikkit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c0e974/32.png) [@Wikkit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wikkit)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2002, 3:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twin-cities/110450/39 "2002-05-26T03:39:39Z")
For a completely different view, the twin cities are one of the Urban Exploration capitals of the world, just behind Paris and New York. Minneapolis has caves and mines galore (the tiny Nicollet Island has almost as much tunnel length underneath it as it has road length on top of it), along with the tailraces and headraces left over from the mills. St. Paul is a lot less impressive in those things, but has one of the most impressive tunnel systems in the world, with at least seven different tunnel systems (electricity, telecommunications, gas, water, sewers, mining…) all concentrated around the downtown area. It even connects to a police station and a bridge room. [http://www.actionsquad.org/](http://www.actionsquad.org/) ---
**Author:** ![Kyla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/eada6e/32.png) [@Kyla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kyla)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2002, 4:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twin-cities/110450/40 "2002-05-26T04:04:17Z")
> [@](#): > > San Francisco and Oakland, California Actually, the largest city in the Bay Area is San Jose - it’s the only one of the three with a population over one million. It’s also much larger geographically. All three of the major Bay cities have their own distinct histories, economie, topologies, and weather. They are, however, all united in geographical proximity and extremely high housing costs. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twin-cities/110450.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twin-cities/110450.md?page=3)