# Twisted Florida Ruling Says Pregnant Teen Isn’t ‘Mature’ Enough for Abortion **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [August 16, 2022, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twisted-florida-ruling-says-pregnant-teen-isn-t-mature-enough-for-abortion/969773 "2022-08-16T18:22:06Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2022, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twisted-florida-ruling-says-pregnant-teen-isn-t-mature-enough-for-abortion/969773/1 "2022-08-16T18:22:06Z")
I’m really at a loss for words. These **evil assholes** say she’s not mature enough to decide on having an abortion, but she is mature enough to go through a pregnancy and become a mother. Good chance she will have to drop out of school and it will ruin her and her parents lives. But that’s ok for these bastards. > **[Twisted Florida Ruling Says Pregnant Teen Isn’t ‘Mature’ Enough for Abortion](https://www.yahoo.com/news/twisted-florida-ruling-says-pregnant-162422622.html)** > > An appeals court has upheld a decision to deny the parentless girl’s request to waive a state law requiring minors get parental consent for an abortion. GRRRRRRR. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2022, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twisted-florida-ruling-says-pregnant-teen-isn-t-mature-enough-for-abortion/969773/2 "2022-08-16T18:25:26Z")
AFAICT, she’s parentless and a ward of the state. That means that Florida literally controls whether or not she can leave the state (to get an abortion). Which is absolutely abominable and I hope there’s some other way she could get out. ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2022, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twisted-florida-ruling-says-pregnant-teen-isn-t-mature-enough-for-abortion/969773/3 "2022-08-16T18:30:49Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > That means that Florida literally controls whether or not she can leave the state (to get an abortion). Just when you think you’ve heard every screwed up possible tragedy these laws could cause, they go and one-up themselves. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2022, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twisted-florida-ruling-says-pregnant-teen-isn-t-mature-enough-for-abortion/969773/4 "2022-08-16T18:32:40Z")
> [@Horatius](#): > > > [@iiandyiiii](#): > > > > That means that Florida literally controls whether or not she can leave the state (to get an abortion). > > Just when you think you’ve heard every screwed up possible tragedy these laws could cause, they go and one-up themselves. - They’ve only just begun… ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2022, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twisted-florida-ruling-says-pregnant-teen-isn-t-mature-enough-for-abortion/969773/5 "2022-08-16T18:35:30Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > she’s parentless and a ward of the state. Someone report the state to CPS. ---
**Author:** ![Dung\_Beetle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dung_beetle/32/7945_2.png) [@Dung\_Beetle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dung_Beetle)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2022, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twisted-florida-ruling-says-pregnant-teen-isn-t-mature-enough-for-abortion/969773/6 "2022-08-16T18:41:06Z")
The article says she lives with a relative, who has no objection to her having an abortion. I wonder why she can’t go ahead with that person’s permission? Also, I hope there is someone close to her who can help her before it’s too late. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2022, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twisted-florida-ruling-says-pregnant-teen-isn-t-mature-enough-for-abortion/969773/7 "2022-08-16T18:46:54Z")
If she lives with a relative, someone needs to drive her to another state. If they need gas money, I’ll gladly chip in. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2022, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twisted-florida-ruling-says-pregnant-teen-isn-t-mature-enough-for-abortion/969773/8 "2022-08-16T18:58:19Z")
> [@Dung\_Beetle](#): > > The article says she lives with a relative, who has no objection to her having an abortion. I wonder why she can’t go ahead with that person’s permission? I imagine the relative is not her legal guardian. This ruling is not about what is best for anyone. It’s about the government punishing women or girls for having sex. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2022, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twisted-florida-ruling-says-pregnant-teen-isn-t-mature-enough-for-abortion/969773/9 "2022-08-16T19:25:24Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > I imagine the relative is not her legal guardian. That doesn’t make sense. (I’m not saying that you’re wrong, we’re talking about Florida after all, so what you’re saying could very well be true.) If this is the situation, then a teen who is a legal minor and must be cared for by a guardian lives with someone who isn’t their guardian. (Being related to them doesn’t matter; if they’re not a legal guardian they might as well be a stranger.) Can she sue the state for abandonment or negligence? ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2022, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twisted-florida-ruling-says-pregnant-teen-isn-t-mature-enough-for-abortion/969773/10 "2022-08-16T19:29:16Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > If this is the situation, then a teen who is a legal minor and must be cared for by a guardian lives with someone who isn’t their guardian. I think sometimes a minor can live with someone, but the state can still be their legal guardian. And the state is the one who says she can’t get an abortion. And of course, once she reaches legal age, the state will offer her or the child no support whatsoever. Catch 22. ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2022, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twisted-florida-ruling-says-pregnant-teen-isn-t-mature-enough-for-abortion/969773/11 "2022-08-16T19:29:59Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > Can she sue the state for abandonment or negligence? Make no mistake, they’ll abandon her as soon as she has the child. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2022, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twisted-florida-ruling-says-pregnant-teen-isn-t-mature-enough-for-abortion/969773/12 "2022-08-16T19:31:34Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > > [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > > > I imagine the relative is not her legal guardian. > > That doesn’t make sense. (I’m not saying that you’re wrong, we’re talking about Florida after all, so what you’re saying could very well be true.) If this is the situation, then a teen who is a legal minor and must be cared for by a guardian lives with someone who isn’t their guardian. (Being related to them doesn’t matter; if they’re not a legal guardian they might as well be a stranger.) It may not make sense to you, but according to the article in the OP, that’s the case. > The unnamed teen, according to the appellate ruling, is getting a GED through a program for young people who have experienced traumatic events in their lives. In her petition, the girl—who lives with a relative and has an appointed guardian—argued that she is “still in school” and “is not ready to have a baby,” noting that her guardian was “fine with what [she] wants to do.” ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2022, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twisted-florida-ruling-says-pregnant-teen-isn-t-mature-enough-for-abortion/969773/13 "2022-08-16T19:31:48Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > I think sometimes a minor can live with someone, but the state can still be their legal guardian. Probably some situation where a social worker stops by every now and then to check on her. Still seems really shady to me. How can you leave a child in anyone’s care if they aren’t empowered to make any decisions about her? ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2022, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twisted-florida-ruling-says-pregnant-teen-isn-t-mature-enough-for-abortion/969773/14 "2022-08-16T19:46:42Z")
She didn’t have a lawyer in court either, but was old enough to represent her self. She made the mature decision to terminate the pregnancy. This is just insane. ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2022, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twisted-florida-ruling-says-pregnant-teen-isn-t-mature-enough-for-abortion/969773/15 "2022-08-16T20:04:12Z")
If she goes to another state and gets an abortion, she can’t be prosecuted, for the same “logic”. ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2022, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twisted-florida-ruling-says-pregnant-teen-isn-t-mature-enough-for-abortion/969773/16 "2022-08-16T20:07:07Z")
I think she’d have to go to North Carolina, at least. Georgia and SC are already out, given how far along she is. I don’t know what the rules in NC are in terms of waiting periods, required misinformation by doctors, bullshit exams, etc. Uh oh, NC also requires parental consent or a judicial bypass, plus a three-day waiting period, etc. Maybe Virginia? ---
**Author:** ![Mama\_Zappa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/71e660/32.png) [@Mama\_Zappa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mama_Zappa)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2022, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twisted-florida-ruling-says-pregnant-teen-isn-t-mature-enough-for-abortion/969773/17 "2022-10-12T15:01:47Z")
Virginia’s waiting period (and rape-via-ultrasound) law was repealed a couple years ago. There IS still a parental notification law. This thread is 2 months old, and I presume OBE in this specific case, but the nearest place she could have gone for treatment without consent of a guardian is the District of Columbia (after that, it’s the heathen northeastern states such as NY and VT). The vast majority of states have some kind of consent laws in place - a few are extra-special and require both parents (hey, dad, you raped your daughter, and you get to refuse consent for an abortion!), and/or a NOTARIZED consent form which is, obviously, another deliberate barrier. > **[Parental Consent/Notification Requirements for Minors Seeking Abortions](https://www.kff.org/womens-health-policy/state-indicator/parental-consentnotification/?currentTimeframe=0&sortModel=%7B%22colId%22:%22Requires%20Parental%20Consent%2F%20Notification%22,%22sort%22:%22asc%22%7D)** > > Filling the need for trusted information on national health issues ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2022, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twisted-florida-ruling-says-pregnant-teen-isn-t-mature-enough-for-abortion/969773/18 "2022-10-12T15:18:56Z")
Makes perfect sense, obviously if she’s not mature enough to have an abortion she will be mature enough for the 18+ year responsibility of raising a child on her own and both the mother and child being wards of the state. What could be a better outcome than that? ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2022, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twisted-florida-ruling-says-pregnant-teen-isn-t-mature-enough-for-abortion/969773/19 "2022-10-12T16:27:20Z")
> [@Mama\_Zappa](#): > > This thread is 2 months old, and I presume OBE in this specific case, but the nearest place she could have gone for treatment without consent of a guardian is the District of Columbia (after that, it’s the heathen northeastern states such as NY and VT). Of course if the Republicans take Congress, DC will probably lose its abortion rights (who knows better what the residents of DC want than a Kentucky congressman). On the good side, Maryland’s parental consent law can be waived by a doctor so she could probably stop there. ---
**Author:** ![Mama\_Zappa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/71e660/32.png) [@Mama\_Zappa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mama_Zappa)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2022, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twisted-florida-ruling-says-pregnant-teen-isn-t-mature-enough-for-abortion/969773/20 "2022-10-12T16:35:00Z")
> [@Buck\_Godot](#): > > On the good side, Maryland’s parental consent law can be waived by a doctor so she could probably stop there. As does Delaware’s. Both states say “notification” vs “consent”; I’m not sure how that plays out in real life. “Mrs. Jones, your daughter is here. Just letting you know. We’ll proceed regardless of what you say.” ? [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/twisted-florida-ruling-says-pregnant-teen-isn-t-mature-enough-for-abortion/969773.md?page=2)