# Two mean things women do to themselves. **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [August 26, 2009, 12:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-mean-things-women-do-to-themselves/507720 "2009-08-26T00:51:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![mangeorge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d78d45/32.png) [@mangeorge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mangeorge)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2009, 2:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-mean-things-women-do-to-themselves/507720/61 "2009-08-27T14:16:34Z")
> [@SecondJudith](#): > > For “diamonds”, substitute “a good job” or “a nice apartment” or whatever you like. Don’t get me started on diamonds. :rolleyes: For the price of an okay diamond you can get an awsome zirconium and a two week cruise to the Bahamas. Or a house full of SSs and HHs. And the only way an average person can tell the zirconium, if one can, is that it’s so perfect (beautiful)! Go figure. ---
**Author:** ![mangeorge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d78d45/32.png) [@mangeorge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mangeorge)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2009, 2:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-mean-things-women-do-to-themselves/507720/62 "2009-08-27T14:19:31Z")
> [@](#): > > Cashew Bar > Burgundy Patent Sheesh! I give up. ---
**Author:** ![SecondJudith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5ac83/32.png) [@SecondJudith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SecondJudith)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2009, 2:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-mean-things-women-do-to-themselves/507720/63 "2009-08-27T14:25:18Z")
Good thing nobody’s making you buy (or wear) either diamonds or the shoes, then. See? Self-sufficiency benefits everybody! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![DianaG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7ab992/32.png) [@DianaG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DianaG)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2009, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-mean-things-women-do-to-themselves/507720/64 "2009-08-27T14:28:12Z")
> [@SecondJudith](#): > > But I’ve just realized what a hijack this is. Let’s talk about shoes! Very nice! I just had my high school reunion, and couldn’t decide what dress I was going to wear, so I bought a couple of pairs of fabulous shoes to choose from. [These](http://www.6pm.com/product/7307303/color/158) and [these](http://www.dsw.com/dsw_shoes/catalog/product.jsp?productRef=SEARCH&category=&prodId=183483). The silver ones were an unbelievable bargain, they’re gorgeous on, and crazy comfortable. ---
**Author:** ![Swallowed\_My\_Cellphone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9d8465/32.png) [@Swallowed\_My\_Cellphone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Swallowed_My_Cellphone)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2009, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-mean-things-women-do-to-themselves/507720/65 "2009-08-27T14:38:37Z")
> [@Freudian\_Slit](#): > > No, I mean that I wear high heels/short skirts on occasion as a woman and most guys seem pretty turned on. Actually, I’m turned _off_ by high heels. Along with smoking, it’s one of those “Oh, too bad. She would be hot if not for…” High heels are so impractical and bad for your body that I just see it as a sign that the woman wearing them has set her looks as a higher priority than health and fun (she’s compromised her ability to move around naturally). I certainly don’t mind short skirts though. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![scareyfaerie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scareyfaerie/32/3135_2.png) [@scareyfaerie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scareyfaerie)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2009, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-mean-things-women-do-to-themselves/507720/66 "2009-08-27T14:46:51Z")
> [@Swallowed\_My\_Cellphone](#): > > High heels are so impractical and bad for your body that I just see it as a sign that the woman wearing them has set her looks as a higher priority than health and fun (she’s compromised her ability to move around naturally). Let’s just suppose for a moment that the woman wearing the heels has an achilles tendon problem, one that she’s had for many years and that she got from something other than wearing high heels…the upshot of which is that heels are far more comfortable for her to wear than flat shoes. How would that affect your opinion? ---
**Author:** ![DianaG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7ab992/32.png) [@DianaG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DianaG)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2009, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-mean-things-women-do-to-themselves/507720/67 "2009-08-27T14:48:48Z")
Alternatively, let’s just suppose that it’s rather silly to think that a person can’t be healthy and fun in heels, or that one should have to apologize for liking pretty things. ---
**Author:** ![scareyfaerie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scareyfaerie/32/3135_2.png) [@scareyfaerie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scareyfaerie)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2009, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-mean-things-women-do-to-themselves/507720/68 "2009-08-27T14:51:39Z")
I am certainly not apologising to anyone for liking shiny, pretty things! In fact, I’m really looking forward to my trip to New York in 3 weeks’ time. There’s a Nine West shop there that’s just begging to see me. ---
**Author:** ![MeanOldLady](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanoldlady/32/10737_2.png) [@MeanOldLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanOldLady)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2009, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-mean-things-women-do-to-themselves/507720/69 "2009-08-27T14:52:58Z")
> [@SecondJudith](#): > > Ain’t that the truth! 😃 But I’ve just realized what a hijack this is. Let’s talk about shoes! My birthday is in two weeks, and I’ve bought myself these to wrap up and give myself: > > [These flats](http://www.clarks.co.uk/find/Department-is-women/CustomProductAttribute2-is-pumps/product-is-20334712) > > [The heel in the upper left-hand corner](http://i32.tinypic.com/148lu2h.jpg) > > They’re both super-comfortable, and I found them on sale for less than £20 each. That’s my other favorite part of shopping. 😃 Excellent! As a woman who started walking to work everyday about a year ago, I never quite realized how hard it was to find a shoe that is cute and comfortable until then. I mean _comfortable_ comfortable, not \*they feel fine while I walk to my car then sit at a desk for eight hours \*comfortable. When I’m at the shoe store and the sales lady starts bringing me all these silly four-inch pointy things, I say to her, “Ask yourself if you would want to walk in them outside for 15 minutes each way. If the answer is ‘No,’ then they won’t work.” Then most of the comfortable shoes I find are, well, ugly. I’m not one of “those women,” but I don’t want to wear ugly shoes. I’ve managed to track down an extensive collection of comfortable work flats that don’t look like something I’d go hiking in, plus I have these [Nine West wedges](http://www.heelcandy.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/11/nine-west-tuffy-wedge.jpg) in black, and they’re quite comfortable. ---
**Author:** ![SecondJudith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5ac83/32.png) [@SecondJudith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SecondJudith)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2009, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-mean-things-women-do-to-themselves/507720/70 "2009-08-27T14:54:27Z")
> [@DianaG](#): > > Alternatively, let’s just suppose that it’s rather silly to think that a person can’t be healthy and fun in heels, or that one should have to apologize for liking pretty things. I vote this one. I love the blue pair you linked to! I really like the 1940s styles that are coming back into shops, especially the ones in solid bright colors. ---
**Author:** ![DianaG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7ab992/32.png) [@DianaG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DianaG)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2009, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-mean-things-women-do-to-themselves/507720/71 "2009-08-27T15:02:24Z")
Aren’t they gorgeous? I love that sort of style as well. I have a similar pair in a wine color with a wrapped ankle strap that I can’t find a link to, but they’re almost equally fabulous. \*\* ScareyFaery\*\*, good for you! Commit to Sparkle Motion! 😉 **MeanOldLady** , I love a good wedge. Lots of cobblestone in Boston. ---
**Author:** ![Swallowed\_My\_Cellphone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9d8465/32.png) [@Swallowed\_My\_Cellphone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Swallowed_My_Cellphone)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2009, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-mean-things-women-do-to-themselves/507720/72 "2009-08-27T15:09:21Z")
> [@ScareyFaerie](#): > > Let’s just suppose for a moment that the woman wearing the heels has an achilles tendon problem, one that she’s had for many years and that she got from something other than wearing high heels…the upshot of which is that heels are far more comfortable for her to wear than flat shoes. How would that affect your opinion? If I found that remotely plausible, maybe. But I don’t. Plus, IME most of the women who wear high heels also wear other impractical clothing and fashion elements that suggest they are not in fact wearing heels as a substitute for proper orthodics. Heels, to me, look uncomfortable and unattractive. ---
**Author:** ![SecondJudith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5ac83/32.png) [@SecondJudith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SecondJudith)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2009, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-mean-things-women-do-to-themselves/507720/73 "2009-08-27T15:17:03Z")
> [@Swallowed\_My\_Cellphone](#): > > IME most of the women who wear high heels also wear other impractical clothing and fashion elements that suggest they are not in fact wearing heels as a substitute for proper orthodics. Who the fuck cares? ---
**Author:** ![scareyfaerie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scareyfaerie/32/3135_2.png) [@scareyfaerie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scareyfaerie)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2009, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-mean-things-women-do-to-themselves/507720/74 "2009-08-27T15:19:03Z")
> [@Swallowed\_My\_Cellphone](#): > > Heels, to me, look uncomfortable and unattractive. Don’t you wear them, then. Leave them to those of us who like them, know we look good in them and are quite comfortable. I reckon you’re just jealous… ---
**Author:** ![DianaG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7ab992/32.png) [@DianaG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DianaG)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2009, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-mean-things-women-do-to-themselves/507720/75 "2009-08-27T15:29:53Z")
Hey, it’s every bit as okay to not like heels as it is to like heels. It’s even okay to say that generally, a woman who wears heels probably isn’t a good fit for you. It’s ridiculous to say that a woman who wears heels is just too dumb or shallow to realize how uncomfortable she MUST be, because YOU think so. ---
**Author:** ![MeanOldLady](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanoldlady/32/10737_2.png) [@MeanOldLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanOldLady)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2009, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-mean-things-women-do-to-themselves/507720/76 "2009-08-27T15:45:18Z")
You know, I’m not entirely \*not \*with **Swallowed My Cellphone**. Sometimes I’ll see a woman stuffed into stilettos, walking awkwardly, in an outfit she spend 30 minutes carefully propping her boobs into, barely able to breathe, and I’ll think to myself that she looks ridiculous. Bu the idea that all high heels are painful to wear, so therefore the woman wearing them has compromised health and comfort for style I believe is false. Sure, there’s no shortage of uncomfortable heels out there, but there’s no shortage of comfortable heels either. Some time at around, oh, age 21 I decided I wasn’t going to suffer anymore. I still wear heels though, just different heels. ---
**Author:** ![DianaG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7ab992/32.png) [@DianaG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DianaG)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2009, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-mean-things-women-do-to-themselves/507720/77 "2009-08-27T15:48:46Z")
> [@MeanOldLady](#): > > Sometimes I’ll see a woman stuffed into stilettos, walking awkwardly, in an outfit she spend 30 minutes carefully propping her boobs into, barely able to breathe, and I’ll think to myself that she looks ridiculous. Well of course she does. There’s nothing in the world less sexy than someone trying really, REALLY hard to be sexy. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Awesome](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a698b9/32.png) [@Captain\_Awesome](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Awesome)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2009, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-mean-things-women-do-to-themselves/507720/78 "2009-08-27T15:51:22Z")
> [@ScareyFaerie](#): > > Let’s just suppose for a moment that the woman wearing the heels has an achilles tendon problem, one that she’s had for many years and that she got from something other than wearing high heels…the upshot of which is that heels are far more comfortable for her to wear than flat shoes. How would that affect your opinion? My opinion is that’s unwise, not to say stupid. It would be far better to rehabilitate the condition properly and wear flat shoes, which won’t further aggravate the tendonitis and potentially lead to more serious tearing, not to mention numerous other podiatric problems caused by their use. High heels aren’t about having confidence, they are about trying to project confidence. ---
**Author:** ![DianaG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7ab992/32.png) [@DianaG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DianaG)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2009, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-mean-things-women-do-to-themselves/507720/79 "2009-08-27T15:52:53Z")
No item of clothing is “about” having confidence. Having confidence means wearing whatever you like and feel good in. ---
**Author:** ![SecondJudith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5ac83/32.png) [@SecondJudith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SecondJudith)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2009, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-mean-things-women-do-to-themselves/507720/80 "2009-08-27T15:55:48Z")
> [@Captain\_Awesome](#): > > High heels aren’t about having confidence, they are about trying to project confidence. That’s simply not true. They can be “about” either, but to say that ALL women who wear heels are trying too hard and secretly insecure is as false as saying that ALL women who wear flats are dumpy bores. It turns out that many women wear what we want to wear because we like it! In our next story, we will discuss why not all women who like to wear tank tops are whores. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-mean-things-women-do-to-themselves/507720.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-mean-things-women-do-to-themselves/507720.md?page=5)