# Two questions about addressing people in English **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [August 26, 2010, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-questions-about-addressing-people-in-english/551560 "2010-08-26T17:28:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Hello\_Again](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/85e7bf/32.png) [@Hello\_Again](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hello_Again)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2010, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-questions-about-addressing-people-in-english/551560/21 "2010-08-26T19:06:24Z")
> [@KneadToKnow](#): > > As if my 42nd birthday last weekend and just today pulling two really big hairs out of my ear weren’t enough, I learn from this thread that “How do you do?” is antiquated, stodgy, and old fashioned. To be clear, it’s responding to the question “How do you do?” WITH “How do you do?” that’s old-fashioned. The question itself is fine, if you answer responsively (“I’m fine, and you?”) ---
**Author:** ![fuzzypickles](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/9d8465/32.png) [@fuzzypickles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fuzzypickles)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2010, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-questions-about-addressing-people-in-english/551560/22 "2010-08-26T19:08:21Z")
> [@KneadToKnow](#): > > As if my 42nd birthday last weekend and just today pulling two really big hairs out of my ear weren’t enough, I learn from this thread that “How do you do?” is antiquated, stodgy, and old fashioned. > > Ugh. Heh…you’re not alone. Although, come to think, I haven’t heard anyone say “How do you do?” in years… ---
**Author:** ![Sigmagirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c89c15/32.png) [@Sigmagirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sigmagirl)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2010, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-questions-about-addressing-people-in-english/551560/23 "2010-08-26T19:09:25Z")
“How do you do?” “Very well, thank you. And you?” “Fine, thank you.” I always say “Ladies and Gentlemen.” It may be old-fashioned, but it gets the job done. ---
**Author:** ![Zsofia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/7bcc69/32.png) [@Zsofia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zsofia)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2010, 7:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-questions-about-addressing-people-in-english/551560/24 "2010-08-26T19:13:45Z")
> [@Hello\_Again](#): > > > [@KneadToKnow](#): > > > > As if my 42nd birthday last weekend and just today pulling two really big hairs out of my ear weren’t enough, I learn from this thread that “How do you do?” is antiquated, stodgy, and old fashioned. > > To be clear, it’s responding to the question “How do you do?” WITH “How do you do?” that’s old-fashioned. The question itself is fine, if you answer responsively (“I’m fine, and you?”) Nah, “How do you do?” is dead in general. I haven’t heard it in ages. When I don’t have a specific person I’m addressing something to, I generally omit the salutation as well. It isn’t needed and can be awkward. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2010, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-questions-about-addressing-people-in-english/551560/25 "2010-08-26T19:37:13Z")
> [@](#): > > And I said: “My name is ‘Sue!’ How do you do! Now you’re gonna die!!” – Johnny Cash, “Boy Named Sue” ---
**Author:** ![Cliffy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/59ef9b/32.png) [@Cliffy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cliffy)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2010, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-questions-about-addressing-people-in-english/551560/26 "2010-08-26T19:40:07Z")
The answer to the second question is the aforementioned: “To Whom It May Concern.” If you know the person or persons you’re writing to, use their names. Don’t skip the saluation in formal correspondence – it makes you look dopey. (Sorry folks.) –Cliffy ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2010, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-questions-about-addressing-people-in-english/551560/27 "2010-08-26T19:42:17Z")
If you can’t find out the name of the person you are writing at XYZ Company, try “Dear XYZ Company:” ---
**Author:** ![Wakinyan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wakinyan/32/352_2.png) [@Wakinyan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wakinyan)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2010, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-questions-about-addressing-people-in-english/551560/28 "2010-08-26T19:43:19Z")
Great replies, guys; enlightening, intersting and amusing as always. Thanks all! > [@GHO57](#): > > … I’m guessing that’s why it was taught to you as the proper way. Your system is British English based, right? Colour, not color, organise, not organize? … Yes, what we’ve been taught (at least my generation and the generations before me, I’m forty) is what I’d like to call “The BBC English”, which is almost like a second language to us (ask anybody who has had the pleasure of spending time in Sweden). However most movies we watch are American (undubbed) and most music we listen to are American, so pronunciation is usually American nonetheless. But if you don’t actually interact with Americans or modern day British people nuances like the ones I’m asking for in the OP are just beyond reach. ---
**Author:** ![Hedda\_Rosa](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hedda_rosa/32/1204_2.png) [@Hedda\_Rosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hedda_Rosa)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2010, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-questions-about-addressing-people-in-english/551560/29 "2010-08-26T20:04:40Z")
To me “how do you do” would be spoken at the same time as a handshake, upon first meeting, and the proper answer is either “how do you do” back or something like “Hi so nice to meet you”. It doesn’t imply a question about the other person’s wellbeing so replying “I’m well” would be a nonsequitor. “Hi how are you?” does pretend to be asking about the other person’s wellbeing, even though the only socially appropriate answer with a stranger or acquaintance is “Fine, thanks, how are you?” I get resumes a lot and they are often addressed to Dear Company. Or Dear Hiring Manager. ---
**Author:** ![Lynn\_Bodoni](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e47c2d/32.png) [@Lynn\_Bodoni](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lynn_Bodoni)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2010, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-questions-about-addressing-people-in-english/551560/30 "2010-08-26T20:26:32Z")
> [@](#): > > The usual rule of thumb for business correspondence that I’ve heard is: > > - Nobody should complain if you write “Dear Sirs,” to an unknown audience. The English grammar rule, like in French, is “when desirable, the male embraces the female”. (Ha ha) Actually, quite a few people WILL complain if your greeting is “Dear Sirs”, no matter what the old grammar rule says. Those rules were made when people in business were almost all men, with only a very few exceptions (it’s hard to run a business when the law doesn’t recognize you as a full adult). Nowadays, it’s quite likely that a woman will be the one who’s in charge of your situation…and I assure you, many women don’t like being “embraced by the male”. If you live in the Star Trek universe, it’s OK to address women as “sir”. Otherwise, don’t. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Tildrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e95f7d/32.png) [@Tom\_Tildrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Tildrum)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2010, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-questions-about-addressing-people-in-english/551560/31 "2010-08-26T20:37:15Z")
> [@md2000](#): > > I would say that “How do you do?” sounds a little bit antiquated - formal; sort of like what you would hear from someone’s high-society grandmother. There’s a scene in _Bonfire of the Vanities_ where the protagonist, an investment banker who’s in trouble with the law, has to introduce his old-money neighbor to his outer-borough criminal lawyer. The neighbor says, “Howd-j-do,” and the lawyer responds, “Howaya.” ---
**Author:** ![Myglaren](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f1d935/32.png) [@Myglaren](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Myglaren)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2010, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-questions-about-addressing-people-in-english/551560/32 "2010-08-26T20:38:52Z")
It’s practically the same as Swedish. “How are you?” (“Hur är det?”): “Fine thank you!” (Bara bra, tack"!) ---
**Author:** ![matt\_mcl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ab992/32.png) [@matt\_mcl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/matt_mcl)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2010, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-questions-about-addressing-people-in-english/551560/33 "2010-08-26T21:34:08Z")
In Canada, we also say “how are you doing,” even at a first meeting, and “how do you do” seems archaic. You can also say “nice to meet you” if you’re being introduced. So you’re correct when you say that “how do you do” or “how are you” or “how are you doing” should not be answered by a recitation of how you actually doing. It’s purely a formula (just like “yours truly” doesn’t mean you’re theirs, or for that matter “Dear Sir or Madam” doesn’t mean the unknown person is dear to you). The answer is always some variant on “Fine, thanks.” If you actually want to know how the person is, you could say something like: Tell me, how have you been lately? What’s new in your life? How are you feeling? What seems to be the problem? as appropriate to the circumstance. Also, “Dear Sir or Madam:” is always correct for correspondence to an unknown person. “Dear Sirs:” or “Gentlemen:” is definitely archaic, for the reasons **Lynn Bodoni** stated (call it “politically correct” if you want; I call it “reality” to notice that women exist and may be found in the workplace). ---
**Author:** ![amarone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e0b2c6/32.png) [@amarone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/amarone)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2010, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-questions-about-addressing-people-in-english/551560/34 "2010-08-26T21:40:44Z")
> [@Giles](#): > > Possible answers to “How are you?”: > – How are you? > – I’m fine. > – Never better. > – Can’t complain. > – Could be worse. > – Do you want the whole story, or just “I’m fine, how are you?”? > > Any of the above could be used in response to “How do you do?”, since it means exactly the same thing. The most common response around here is “Good.” Followed by “how are you?” or similar. This is the wrong forum to rant about how much I hate the use of “good” instead of “well”. “You played good today”, “You did good in school”. Ugh. ---
**Author:** ![Dallas\_Jones](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dallas_jones/32/3277_2.png) [@Dallas\_Jones](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dallas_Jones)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2010, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-questions-about-addressing-people-in-english/551560/35 "2010-08-26T22:03:27Z")
How do you do? How are you? Correct response: I am fine, thanks. Incorrect response: Finer than frog’s hair! ---
**Author:** ![UDS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecae2f/32.png) [@UDS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UDS)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2010, 1:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-questions-about-addressing-people-in-english/551560/36 "2010-08-27T01:07:52Z")
In British English, the only really correct response to “how do you do?” is to ignore the question and say “how do you do?”, which your interlocutor will likewise ignore. “How do you do?” is functionally equivalent to “hello”, and is spoken without the rising inflection that a question would normally get. The only really correct response to “how are you?” is “fine, thanks” or “very well” or something of the kind, regardless of how you actually are. “I’ve got a slight cold” or “I’m miserable because my girlfriend dumped me” are not appropriate responses. ---
**Author:** ![Arrendajo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e0b2c6/32.png) [@Arrendajo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Arrendajo)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2010, 1:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-questions-about-addressing-people-in-english/551560/37 "2010-08-27T01:32:02Z")
I’m a bit surprised at the assertion that “How do you do?” is antiquated. I use it all the time, upon introductions, and I hear it often too. It doesn’t sound at all strange to my ears. And of course, the proper response is “How do you do what?” ---
**Author:** ![Superhal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b4bc9f/32.png) [@Superhal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Superhal)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2010, 2:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-questions-about-addressing-people-in-english/551560/38 "2010-08-27T02:05:27Z")
> [@Arrendajo](#): > > I’m a bit surprised at the assertion that “How do you do?” is antiquated. I use it all the time, upon introductions, and I hear it often too. It doesn’t sound at all strange to my ears. And of course, the proper response is “How do you do what?” “What’s up?” “The ceiling, you idiot.” ---
**Author:** ![GameHat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/ed655f/32.png) [@GameHat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GameHat)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2010, 3:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-questions-about-addressing-people-in-english/551560/39 "2010-08-27T03:35:32Z")
Midwesterner here, “How do you do?” is a bit antiquated. To use it in normal business exchanges would seem a bit silly. A foreign speaker using it wouldn’t faze me, but if a native English speaker uses it they better be at least 60 years old or it sounds false and pretentious. “How are you?” is perfectly normal. A response other than “Fine, how are you?” is only for close colleagues or friends. i.e., my close friend greets me with “How are you?” To this close friend I could reply, “Not good. My dog just died and I’m broken up.” But for most business interchanges I should simply reply “Fine, how are you?” “How ya doin?” is ok for close friends and colleagues. Never use this with people with whom you don’t have a close relationship. In business only with people you know well on a friendly level. “What’s up?” or “'sup?” – I use this all the time, but only with friends and close colleagues. It’s very informal. Fine for what it is, but avoid in regular business exchanges. ---
**Author:** ![Floater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/dc4da7/32.png) [@Floater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Floater)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2010, 10:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-questions-about-addressing-people-in-english/551560/40 "2010-08-27T10:15:19Z")
> [@Wakinyan](#): > > > [@GHO57](#): > > > > … I’m guessing that’s why it was taught to you as the proper way. Your system is British English based, right? Colour, not color, organise, not organize? … > > Yes, what we’ve been taught (at least my generation and the generations before me, I’m forty) is what I’d like to call “The BBC English”, which is almost like a second language to us … I’d say “sort of”. That is what I was taught as well, but as a teacher you are allowed to use whatever variant of the English language you feel best at home with (although standard British English is taught at teacher’s training colleges), but you have to be consistent and not teach americanisms with British spelling pronounced with an Australian accent. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-questions-about-addressing-people-in-english/551560.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-questions-about-addressing-people-in-english/551560.md?page=3)