# "Two-thousand-three" or "Two-thousand AND three"? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [October 9, 2003, 6:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-thousand-three-or-two-thousand-and-three/206444 "2003-10-09T06:31:02Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 16\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Bippy\_the\_Beardless](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ac8455/32.png) [@Bippy\_the\_Beardless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bippy_the_Beardless)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2003, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-thousand-three-or-two-thousand-and-three/206444/21 "2003-10-09T15:54:41Z")
I thought thousand was a compound word of thous-and, but I see that thou is just slang for thousand. That would render the and as unnecessary but not strictly wrong. 1,234,567,890 is one billion twohundred thirty four million five hundred sixty seven thousand eight hundred nintey. Ands get used in such a number for emphasis or breathing space. Note from darts the high score 180 is allways pronounced one hundred and eighty. For emphasis 666 is often pronounced six hundred and sixty six. ---
**Author:** ![YoudNeverGuess](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/a587f6/32.png) [@YoudNeverGuess](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YoudNeverGuess)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2003, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-thousand-three-or-two-thousand-and-three/206444/22 "2003-10-09T16:18:33Z")
In any list you put the first few words separated by commas, then AND, and then the last word e.g. David, Sally AND John went to the cinema Therefore you say when reading a number like 1,234: One thousand, two hundred and thirty-four (thirty-four being hyphenated counts as one word, so you don’t say thirty and four). Simple rules of grammar kids… If there’s a decimal point we say 1,234.5 as One thousand, two hundred and thirty-four point five (in Ireland and Britain as far as I know anyway). Still, languages develop so whatever comes into common usage where ever you live is ‘right’ I suppose. They’re just different dialects of English - RP (Received Pronounciation I think) English, American-English, Hiberno-English (that’s the Irish version BTW) etc. that’s my two cents worth. ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2003, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-thousand-three-or-two-thousand-and-three/206444/23 "2003-10-09T16:35:29Z")
I’ve lived in Australia, Canada, the UK, and the United States. In my experience, Aussies and Brits nearly always say “and,” Canadians sometimes do, and Americans almost never do. It’s not a matter of right or wrong, just of different usage. ---
**Author:** ![umop\_ap\_sdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/dbc845/32.png) [@umop\_ap\_sdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/umop_ap_sdn)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2003, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-thousand-three-or-two-thousand-and-three/206444/24 "2003-10-09T20:36:11Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Odinoneeye \* > \*\*I call this year Aught 3 \*\* I think Mr. Adams himself explained this one. My 2 cents: call this year Naughty Three. 😃 Think about it - sixties, seventies, eighties, nineties, naughties! At long last our decade has a name. ---
**Author:** ![umop\_ap\_sdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/dbc845/32.png) [@umop\_ap\_sdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/umop_ap_sdn)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2003, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-thousand-three-or-two-thousand-and-three/206444/25 "2003-10-09T20:37:44Z")
Should I say he explained why “aught” is misheard from “naught”. Sorry, I don’t have enough time to search for the article. ---
**Author:** ![Tenebras](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/977dab/32.png) [@Tenebras](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tenebras)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2003, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-thousand-three-or-two-thousand-and-three/206444/26 "2003-10-09T23:48:38Z")
I was taught in the US never to use “and” when talking numbers. Grew up in the 50’s-60’s. We were always admonished if we put an “and” into any number. I do like living in the naughties though. ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2003, 12:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-thousand-three-or-two-thousand-and-three/206444/27 "2003-10-10T00:22:15Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by SirRay \* > \*\*My pronunciation (North East US) > > Normally: > Twenty-Oh-Three\*\* The news director on the station I wake up to says this. It’s annoying. Do those people refer to Stanley Kubrick’s or Arthur C. Clarke’s space odyssey as “Twenty-Oh-One”? ---
**Author:** ![Early\_Out](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/6f9a4e/32.png) [@Early\_Out](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Early_Out)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2003, 4:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-thousand-three-or-two-thousand-and-three/206444/28 "2003-10-10T04:25:11Z")
“Two thousand three” is a number. “Two thousand and three” is the statement of an arithmetic problem, the answer to which is “Two thousand three.” ---
**Author:** ![Irishlove](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/3da27b/32.png) [@Irishlove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Irishlove)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2003, 6:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-thousand-three-or-two-thousand-and-three/206444/29 "2003-10-10T06:03:56Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Jeff Olsen \* > \*\*The news director on the station I wake up to says this. It’s annoying. > > Do those people refer to Stanley Kubrick’s or Arthur C. Clarke’s space odyssey as “Twenty-Oh-One”? \*\* No, but they should. Do you refer to the year 1901 as one thousand nine hundred one? I didn’t think so. 1901 = nineteen oh one. Why should 2001 be any different? ---
**Author:** ![umop\_ap\_sdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/dbc845/32.png) [@umop\_ap\_sdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/umop_ap_sdn)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2003, 6:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-thousand-three-or-two-thousand-and-three/206444/30 "2003-10-10T06:39:52Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Early Out \* > \*\*“Two thousand and three” is the statement of an arithmetic problem, the answer to which is “Two thousand three.” \*\* Not quite. 2000 = 0x11111010000; 3 = 0x11; 0x11111010000 ^ 0x00000000011 = 0x00000000000 Therefore two thousand and three equals zero. However, two thousand or three equals two-thousand-three. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2003, 8:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-thousand-three-or-two-thousand-and-three/206444/31 "2003-10-10T08:26:59Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by mhendo \* > \*\*It’s not a matter of right or wrong, just of different usage. \*\* Which is why these kind of threads (the other ones of the kind being those about regional accent and national spelling conventions, sometimes religion too) are often so amusing - it is really very easy to imagine that the usage to which _you personally_ are accustomed, is objectively the best and only true and logical way. ---
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2003, 11:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-thousand-three-or-two-thousand-and-three/206444/32 "2003-10-10T11:11:38Z")
Two-thousand-three is a number Two-thousand AND three is a math problem As I see **Early Out** agreed with too ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2003, 11:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-thousand-three-or-two-thousand-and-three/206444/33 "2003-10-10T11:56:48Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by kanicbird \* > **Two-thousand-three is a number > Two-thousand AND three is a math problem** This is true in some localities, including America, but elsewhere (such as in the UK… Two throusand AND three is a number Two thousand three is a _list_ comprising two numbers; 2000, 3 ---
**Author:** ![Early\_Out](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/6f9a4e/32.png) [@Early\_Out](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Early_Out)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2003, 1:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-thousand-three-or-two-thousand-and-three/206444/34 "2003-10-10T13:35:01Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Mangetout \* > \*\*Two thousand three is a _list_ comprising two numbers; 2000, 3 \*\* Well, no. A list with only two members would be spoken as “two thousand and three.” A list with three members would be “two thousand, one hundred, and three.” And where’s Opal when we need her?! ---
**Author:** ![sultana\_of\_slash](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bbe5ce/32.png) [@sultana\_of\_slash](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sultana_of_slash)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2003, 2:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-thousand-three-or-two-thousand-and-three/206444/35 "2003-10-10T14:17:37Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Ataraxy \* > \*\*Why say two thousand AND three? Does anyone express “33” as thirty AND three. I’ve always heard thirty three with no AND. Since that is the case with smaller numbers, it should also hold true for large numbers. \*\* It’s a beat. It’s a rhythm thing. Part of the natural rhythms of speech. Holds the place mentally for speaker and listener; warns listener on almost unconscious level to expect last number. That helps listener organize memory to keep the whole number in short-term memory. Small numbers don’t need a beat because they don’t approach the seven-number limit of things you can keep in short-term memory. None of this is science. All my two cents’ worth. But I feel the need for the “beat” very strongly in a long number. If you approach talking as a form of music instead of a subset of math transfer, it all makes more sense. ---
**Author:** ![Bippy\_the\_Beardless](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ac8455/32.png) [@Bippy\_the\_Beardless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bippy_the_Beardless)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2003, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-thousand-three-or-two-thousand-and-three/206444/36 "2003-10-10T23:48:51Z")
Two thousand plus three and two thousand add three, are two maths problems. The answer to each problem is two thousand and three 😉 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-thousand-three-or-two-thousand-and-three/206444.md?page=1)