# Two weird defebrillator/electricity questions
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-weird-defebrillator-electricity-questions/368706
**Category:** Factual Questions
**Created:** [August 14, 2006, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-weird-defebrillator-electricity-questions/368706 "2006-08-14T18:40:26Z")
**Posts on this page:** 11
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@I\_Know\_Nothing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/I_Know_Nothing)
#### Post date: [August 14, 2006, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-weird-defebrillator-electricity-questions/368706/1 "2006-08-14T18:40:26Z")
I was listening to Car Talk the other day and they had a segment where listeners submitted strange stories about people trying to show off. One the letters said that this med student put the two defibrillator plates on his temples and fired, immediately dropping to the floor. Supposedly, the only reason he lived was because the electricty arced over his metal rimmed glasses. From what you know is this story possible?
Secondly, this guy once told me he knew a med student who was playing around with a defibillator by placing the plates on either side of his knees and firing to make his knee kick up(like a docter using his little rubber hammer to test for a reflex). For some reason after doing this a few times he ended up permanently ruining his knee. I think it had something to do with the water in his knee ligaments and tendons heating up and expanding, therefore blowing them all out. How likely is this one?
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### Author:  [@groman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/groman)
#### Post date: [August 14, 2006, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-weird-defebrillator-electricity-questions/368706/2 "2006-08-14T19:11:23Z")
I am not a doctor, but I would assume defibrilating your knee would cause the muscle to freak out. I wouldn’t be surprised if a muscle activated improperly might contract with enough force to tear ligaments or even break bones.
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### Author:  [@astro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astro)
#### Post date: [August 14, 2006, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-weird-defebrillator-electricity-questions/368706/3 "2006-08-14T19:18:47Z")
[Don’t play with defibrillators!](http://www.bookofjoe.com/2006/01/behindthemedspe_7.html) You can kill people & go to jial!
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### Author:  [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)
#### Post date: [August 14, 2006, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-weird-defebrillator-electricity-questions/368706/4 "2006-08-14T19:25:30Z")
Personally I’m a little dismayed that med students this dumb apparantly survive and, presumbly, graduate. If there was any justice, simple Darwininsm would eliminate them permanently.
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### Author:  [@Absolute](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Absolute)
#### Post date: [August 14, 2006, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-weird-defebrillator-electricity-questions/368706/5 "2006-08-14T20:16:12Z")
> [@Bryan Ekers](#):
>
> Personally I’m a little dismayed that med students this dumb apparantly survive and, presumbly, graduate. If there was any justice, simple Darwininsm would eliminate them permanently.
According to the Car Talk guys, the med student who defibrillated his head was expelled.
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### Author:  [@postcards](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/postcards)
#### Post date: [August 14, 2006, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-weird-defebrillator-electricity-questions/368706/6 "2006-08-14T21:43:26Z")
> [@groman](#):
>
> I am not a doctor, but I would assume defibrilating your knee would cause the muscle to freak out. I wouldn’t be surprised if a muscle activated improperly might contract with enough force to tear ligaments or even break bones.
If this is the case, then why don’t the pectoral muscles ‘freak out’ when the instrument is used properly? Unless there’s a warning not to give more than ‘x’ number of hits before deciding someone is gone?
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### Author:  [@groman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/groman)
#### Post date: [August 15, 2006, 12:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-weird-defebrillator-electricity-questions/368706/7 "2006-08-15T00:43:34Z")
> [@postcards](#):
>
> If this is the case, then why don’t the pectoral muscles ‘freak out’ when the instrument is used properly? Unless there’s a warning not to give more than ‘x’ number of hits before deciding someone is gone?
I assume they do, hence the slight jerking (if you’ve ever seen a defibrilator in action you’ll notice it’s nothing like it’s depicted on TV though). I would imagine you could even wind up with broken ribs if not from the pressure then from the muscle spasms.
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### Author:  [@St.Urho](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/St.Urho)
#### Post date: [August 15, 2006, 7:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-weird-defebrillator-electricity-questions/368706/8 "2006-08-15T07:24:16Z")
As far as the first story goes, I’d say it’s highly unlikely at best. It is possible for the energy to arc over the skin if there’s not a good layer of conductive gel between the paddles and the skin. One of the many reasons almost everyone uses [fast patches](http://www.buyemp.com/product/1041711.html) instead of paddles now.
For the second, I’ve heard similar stories, but nothing reliable. I suppose it’s possible **groman** ’s theory is correct as is the description of defibrillation.
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### Author:  [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)
#### Post date: [August 15, 2006, 7:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-weird-defebrillator-electricity-questions/368706/9 "2006-08-15T07:36:00Z")
> [@Bryan Ekers](#):
>
> Personally I’m a little dismayed that med students this dumb apparantly survive and, presumbly, graduate. If there was any justice, simple Darwininsm would eliminate them permanently.
According to a buddy of mine who works at a teaching hospital, at least once a semester, a new med student will accidentally defib themselves and get to spend a few days as a patient. He says that they’re all smart enough to realize that once they’ve defibbed themselves that they’re not cut out for medicine.
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### Author:  [@gigi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gigi)
#### Post date: [August 15, 2006, 1:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-weird-defebrillator-electricity-questions/368706/10 "2006-08-15T13:20:42Z")
I thought the portable units were designed to not fire if a heartbeat is detected??
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### Author:  [@St.Urho](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/St.Urho)
#### Post date: [August 15, 2006, 2:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/two-weird-defebrillator-electricity-questions/368706/11 "2006-08-15T14:14:38Z")
The AEDs commonly found in airports, schools, fire trucks, etc. kinda. They’re specifically designed to recognize and shock ventricular fibrillation and ventricular tachycardia. They don’t actually detect a “heartbeat” but they will not shock a normal sinus rhythm.
However, the manual monitor/defibrillators found in hospitals and ambulances can be used to shock regardless of the rhythm
St. Urho
Paramedic