# Tyre Nichols death - discussion as the video comes out **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [January 27, 2023, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tyre-nichols-death-discussion-as-the-video-comes-out/978910 "2023-01-27T16:46:02Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 15
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2023, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tyre-nichols-death-discussion-as-the-video-comes-out/978910/281 "2023-02-03T02:09:32Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > That’s true, but IIRC in all of Western the police are usually armed. In the UK they get away with it as few of the perps carry guns. And there was something like 8 or 10? constables there, and they had already cordoned it off so no innocents were in danger. …let’s look at “what’s on the board, Ms Ford”. > **[Killings by law enforcement. Rates and counts by country](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_with_annual_rates_and_counts_for_killings_by_law_enforcement_officers)** > > This is a list of countries with annual rates and counts for killings by law enforcement officers. Sort the list per capita. Look at the countries above the United States. Then compare that to the countries below them. Where Canada comes in at nearly a third of the rate, where New Zealand where the police aren’t even routinely armed is higher than Germany, Portugal and Sweden. ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2023, 2:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tyre-nichols-death-discussion-as-the-video-comes-out/978910/282 "2023-02-03T02:24:55Z")
> [@Max\_S](#): > > If a standard distance is not supported by law or science, maybe we shouldn’t have police rely on it? …the police, the police unions, and consulting companies like Lexipol all argue that the “standard distance” is supported by law and supported by science, so: > [@Max\_S](#): > > Sound reasonable to you? Is kinda irrelevant. What would be reasonable for me is perfectly encapsulated through three words: “defund the police.” If you want to understand what that means, I would suggest you read this: > **[Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez Was Asked About Defunding the Police and Her Answer...](https://ocasio-cortez.house.gov/media/in-the-news/alexandria-ocasio-cortez-was-asked-about-defunding-police-and-her-answer-went)** > >   > [@AOC](#): > > Asked, “What does an America with defunded police look like to you?” > > … > > _t looks like a suburb. Affluent white communities already live in a world where the choose to fund youth, health, housing etc more than they fund police. These communities have lower crime rates not because they have more police, but bc they have more resources to support healthy society in a way that reduces crime._ > > … > > _White communities bend over backwards to find alternatives to incarceration for their loved ones to “protect their future,” like community service or rehab or restorative measures. Why don’t we treat Black and Brown people the same way?_ > [@Max\_S](#): > > I’m not against tactical exercises that improve an officer’s survivability as well as accuracy when firing a weapon. I mean, do you really think the problem here is that American police are insufficiently trained in “movement tactics with firearms training” that this would make any difference at all in how it handles knife crime? If the cops that shot Anthony Lowe had just done a couple of _tactical rolls_, then fired more _precisely_, that Anthony Lowe would be alive right now? [![](https://j.gifs.com/mGlqb0.gif) ](https://j.gifs.com/mGlqb0.gif) ---
**Author:** ![Max\_S](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/46a35a/32.png) [@Max\_S](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_S)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2023, 2:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tyre-nichols-death-discussion-as-the-video-comes-out/978910/283 "2023-02-03T02:27:50Z")
> [@Banquet\_Bear](#): > > consulting companies like Lexipol all argue that the “standard distance” is supported by law and supported by science No. Your cite expressly discounted that. Maybe you missed it? It was the first key takeaway, in the very same paragraph you quoted, in boldface. Lexipol is against the 21-foot rule. > **Key takeaways** > > While most officers would agree that the 21-foot rule is a bad standard in policing, it is important scientific information is used to support its abolition. > > […] > > 1. **Reject the notion of a standardized safe distance.** Police interactions with citizens are fluid and it does not seem practical to set a standard distance for such encounters. Having an officer attempt to keep 32 feet from an individual is not practical in most interactions. ETA: > [@Banquet\_Bear](#): > > I mean, do you really think the problem here is that American police are insufficiently trained in “movement tactics with firearms training” that this would make any difference at all in how it handles knife crime? If the cops that shot Anthony Lowe had just done a couple of _tactical rolls_, then fired more _precisely_, that Anthony Lowe would be alive right now? Back up. I didn’t bring that cite, _you_ did. The problem the study _you_ cited was trying to address was not keeping Anthony Lowe alive, it was keeping _police_ alive in edged blade situations. I thought we pivoted back away from that specific case, the police actions of which I’m not defending. The major takeaway from the citation you provided was that the fixed distance standard needs to go away. Yes, getting rid of it _would_ make a difference in how American police handle knife crimes, because according to your other cite the standard is used to justify police shootings. ~Max ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2023, 2:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tyre-nichols-death-discussion-as-the-video-comes-out/978910/284 "2023-02-03T02:45:04Z")
> [@Max\_S](#): > > No. Your cite expressly discounted that. …Lexipol still advocates and supports the 21 foot rule. The article is all about pushing the window to remove the “standardised distance” so that an officer at any distance could consider themselves at threat. > [@Max\_S](#): > > It was the first key takeaway, in the very same paragraph you quoted, in boldface. It was one of several key takeaways, and out of all of them, that one in particular was the most disingenuous. > [@Max\_S](#): > > The major takeaway from the citation you provided was that the fixed distance standard needs to go away. The main takeaway is that police propaganda is very very good. The 21 foot rule was getting bad press. So they’ve slapped a new name on it, _made it even more lethal_, and have called it a day. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2023, 2:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tyre-nichols-death-discussion-as-the-video-comes-out/978910/285 "2023-02-03T02:57:20Z")
@DrDeth, it’s not about “1% of cops”. When one cop is murdering someone while 20 other cops just stand there, that’s not one bad cop, that’s 21 bad cops. And when it’s possible to have 21 cops in one place and all of them just happen to be bad, that’s not 1%, that’s almost all cops. If you’re trying to claim that you’ve known a lot of good cops, then tell us how many other cops they’ve arrested. Because cops doing things that they need to be arrested for are all over the place. ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2023, 3:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tyre-nichols-death-discussion-as-the-video-comes-out/978910/286 "2023-02-03T03:18:49Z")
> [@Max\_S](#): > > Back up. I didn’t bring that cite, _you_ did. The problem the study _you_ cited was trying to address was not keeping Anthony Lowe alive, it was keeping _police_ alive in edged blade situations. …I missed this, so just adding: Of course, I bought the cite. But it wasn’t so that I could get into further debate about police knife tactics. It was to show how police and police advocacy groups have been so successful in **framing the debate**. It means when a “police shoot man with a knife” incident happens, the conversation immediately turns to “well, it’s bad, but he had a knife.” And when you point out that the man uses a wheel cheer, the response is "well, that doesn’t make it even less deadly. And when you point out "but he wasn’t in the wheel chair at the time he, was on the ground desperately trying to get away the response is “well, he might have thrown the knife. Lets have a debate about how deadly thrown knives can be.” And there you go. Debate successfully reframed. People start to question the 21 foot rule. So the police and advocacy groups change the narrative frame. They do this by “conducting research.” Then establishing that “it shouldn’t be 21 feet. It should be any distance, just in case. This makes is safer.” And people just buy that bullshit up. But its still bullshit. Knives are dangerous. The police’s job should be keeping themselves safe, they should be keeping the public safe, but they should also try to be keeping the suspect _alive_. Police training should be focused on this: instead its focused on “keeping the officer safe at all costs” which often means the subject or the public are put at risk. So when you say this: > [@Max\_S](#): > > Perfect! That’s something tangible. If a standard distance is not supported by law or science, maybe we shouldn’t have police rely on it? Sound reasonable to you? You are completely missing the point. The “standard distance” is the least important thing about any of this. It was never ever really a standard distance anyway, just a rule of thumb. “Getting rid of it” is a matter of semantics. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2023, 4:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tyre-nichols-death-discussion-as-the-video-comes-out/978910/287 "2023-02-03T04:02:59Z")
> [@Banquet\_Bear](#): > > The police’s job should be keeping themselves safe, they should be keeping the public safe, but they should also try to be keeping the suspect _alive_. Police training should be focused on this: instead its focused on “keeping the officer safe at all costs” which often means the subject or the public are put at risk. **Precisely.** When you send out someone whose only tools are a gun, taser, and handcuffs, and the training to use them, they aren’t going to be able to properly serve people in need. They should be crisis managers first and foremost, trained well in that, and only using force to prevent eminent and serious harm. ---
**Author:** ![Max\_S](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/46a35a/32.png) [@Max\_S](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_S)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2023, 4:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tyre-nichols-death-discussion-as-the-video-comes-out/978910/288 "2023-02-03T04:22:55Z")
> [@Banquet\_Bear](#): > > It means when a “police shoot man with a knife” incident happens, the conversation immediately turns to “well, it’s bad, but he had a knife.” And when you point out that the man uses a wheel cheer, the response is "well, that doesn’t make it even less deadly. And when you point out "but he wasn’t in the wheel chair at the time he, was on the ground desperately trying to get away the response is “well, he might have thrown the knife. Lets have a debate about how deadly thrown knives can be.” > > And there you go. Debate successfully reframed. That was _my_ line of thought, nearly. Except I didn’t want to debate whether thrown knives were deadly. I had assumed they were. I just wanted to know, as a matter of fact, whether the threat of a thrown knife justifies deadly force. In the course of answering that question, it was pointed out that thrown butchers knives aren’t a grave threat. If I had known that at the start I wouldn’t have any need to respond to your post about the Lowe case. I wasn’t motivated by apologism. I gave my own opinions, based on ignorance - which I suspected when I first responded to you, and which ignorance I was specifically motivated to rid myself of. Now you appear to be saying that the way I approach police brutality is wrong because… I’ve been influenced by police propaganda? How does that assertion help me realize the error in my ways? I need something tangible to wrap my head around! I’m not going to assume everything pro-police is motivated by a desire to kill brown people, and I’m sure that’s not what you’re trying to tell me… that’s a standard right-wing strawman. But sometimes it seems like you’re saying something is obviously wrong, and if I assume you are right and try and work out why, that’s the only _obvious_ explanation that I can find on my own! And I _know_ that’s not your view. I’ve read the study you cited multiple times over now, I’m just not seeing what you’re saying is there. It seems perfectly reasonable to me. I’m also getting sick of reading it. Getting rid of the 21 foot rule doesn’t seem disingenuous to me at all. In fact it seems very reasonable to me, and while you haven’t explicitly agreed, it is my impression that you do because when I asked you, you wrote your opinion on that question isn’t important as police unions, Lexipol, etc. The main point of the study as I read it was, > “This study showed that on average 21 feet is not a safe enough distance for an officer to be able to successfully draw and fire their weapon at a charging suspect with an edged weapon.” Therefore officers shouldn’t assume that they have time to draw and fire at 21 feet. Nothing about saying an officer should be justified in shooting a charging suspect from any distance, which I _think_ is the motive you are imparting on firm, but is not something you’ve written explicitly. It said an officer who wants to minimize his or her risk when confronting an individual with an edged blade should avoid standing still. Which seems perfectly reasonable to me. It also says an officer who is constantly moving should be skilled in shooting while moving, which also seems perfectly reasonable to me. It seems to me a good thing for police to have good aim. > [@Banquet\_Bear](#): > > The police’s job should be keeping themselves safe, they should be keeping the public safe, but they should also try to be keeping the suspect _alive_. If possible. I _don’t_ think police should be expected to risk their lives to keep the suspect alive to the same extent that they do to protect the public at large, other police, or themselves. I would think the suspect’s safety, while still a priority, is or should be unambiguously the lowest priority in that list. For example during a raid I would expect medical care to come only after the premises have been cleared, even if that means some of the suspects subdued succumb to their wounds. My uninformed take - as I haven’t previously given any thought to this specific subject - is that some or even many tactical exercises _should_ be focused on keeping the officer safe at all costs, because there are situations where that _is_ the number one priority. For example a standoff situation with no hostages, but where containment is absolutely necessary for public safety. > [@Banquet\_Bear](#): > > You are completely missing the point. Clearly! ~Max ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2023, 4:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tyre-nichols-death-discussion-as-the-video-comes-out/978910/289 "2023-02-03T04:40:46Z")
> [@Max\_S](#): > > How does that assertion help me realize the error in my ways? …I’m not trying to make you realize the error of your ways. I’m just pointing out the error of your ways. > [@Max\_S](#): > > I need something tangible to wrap my head around! That’s a **you** problem. I can’t fix that. > [@Max\_S](#): > > But sometimes it seems like you’re saying something is obviously wrong, and if I assume you are right and try and work out why, that’s the only _obvious_ explanation that I can find on my own! And I _know_ that’s not your view. There are more people locked up in America than anywhere else in the world by orders of magnitude. And 74% of those people haven’t even been convicted of a crime. That’s an obvious problem. That’s just the end-point of a system that is _designed_ to reach the outcome. > [@Max\_S](#): > > It seems perfectly reasonable to me. Of course, it _seems_ reasonable. What else would you even expect? Propaganda always sounds reasonable. Especially when it doesn’t directly affect you. ---
**Author:** ![Max\_S](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/46a35a/32.png) [@Max\_S](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_S)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2023, 5:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tyre-nichols-death-discussion-as-the-video-comes-out/978910/290 "2023-02-03T05:06:04Z")
> [@Banquet\_Bear](#): > > …I’m not trying to make you realize the error of your ways. I’m just pointing out the error of your ways. […] That’s a **you** problem. I can’t fix that. In which case, your point has been made and there is no reason for me to continue my participation in this discussion. So I’ll bow out. ~Max ---
**Author:** ![Mijin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mijin/32/9369_2.png) [@Mijin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mijin)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2023, 11:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tyre-nichols-death-discussion-as-the-video-comes-out/978910/291 "2023-02-03T11:35:14Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Look you cant claim that policing in America absolutely _sucks_, when all it is anecdotal, and the anecdotes picked by Mainstream Media as they were “newsworthy.” Firstly of course, I didn’t say that policing absolutely sucks, that was someone else. But secondly, _of fucking course_ it’s newsworthy when officers beat a man to death (while barking nonsensical and/or contradictory instructions at him, and still with no clear offense even claimed). A plane crash is newsworthy. You don’t get to say “Hey, look at all the planes which _don’t_ crash”. ---
**Author:** ![Eonwe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eonwe/32/240_2.png) [@Eonwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eonwe)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2023, 1:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tyre-nichols-death-discussion-as-the-video-comes-out/978910/292 "2023-02-03T13:01:44Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Look you cant claim that policing in America absolutely _sucks_, when all it is anecdotal, and the anecdotes picked by Mainstream Media as they were “newsworthy.” What are two or three non “Mainstream Media” sources I should look to to keep me informed without wasting time reporting on non “newsworthy” stories? ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2023, 1:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tyre-nichols-death-discussion-as-the-video-comes-out/978910/293 "2023-02-03T13:17:57Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Neither. Look you cant claim that policing in America absolutely _sucks_, when all it is anecdotal, and the anecdotes picked by Mainstream Media as they were “newsworthy.” There are plenty of statistics to back it up as well. But I guess you are saying that the media _shouldn’t_ report on police shootings? > [@DrDeth](#): > > That’s true, but IIRC in all of Western the police are usually armed. In the UK they get away with it as few of the perps carry guns. What you say here has merit. So many guns out there that it puts cops in danger. If only there was anyone trying to do anything about that. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2023, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tyre-nichols-death-discussion-as-the-video-comes-out/978910/294 "2023-02-03T22:47:44Z")
> [@Eonwe](#): > > What are two or three non “Mainstream Media” sources I should look to to keep me informed without wasting time reporting on non “newsworthy” stories? Reuters, BBC, and a few others, but the Mainstream media does do good reporting. Except, if you relied upon them, you’d wonder why only attractive blond females are abducted. Sure, they really have been, but males, and minorities are not very “newsworthy”. > [@k9bfriender](#): > > But I guess you are saying that the media _shouldn’t_ report on police shootings? Not at all. But dont just judge how bad or good American cops are based upon that. Just like if you followed just the national news, the only shootings reported are Mass shootings or VIPs. You have to know that mass shooting by an assault weapon (for example) are only about 1 or 2% of all homicides. But of course they have to cover the Monterey Park shooting, that’s fine. But that sort of murders are quite rare. > [@k9bfriender](#): > > What you say here has merit. So many guns out there that it puts cops in danger. If only there was anyone trying to do anything about that. Biden just rammed thru some laws that will help keep guns out of the hands of criminals and violent abusers. It is a decent bill. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2023, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tyre-nichols-death-discussion-as-the-video-comes-out/978910/295 "2023-02-03T22:59:33Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > @DrDeth, it’s not about “1% of cops”. When one cop is murdering someone while 20 other cops just stand there, that’s not one bad cop, that’s 21 bad cops. That’s pretty rare. I mean the George Floyd killing only had four cops, two of which were trainees.Tyre Nichols had five officers. Oh on that- [4 of the officers charged with Tyre Nichols' death had prior violations at work : NPR](https://www.npr.org/2023/02/01/1153151044/tyre-nichols-memphis-police-violations) _Four of the five former Memphis Police officers who have been charged in the death of Tyre Nichols had previous infractions with the department, according to Memphis police personnel records shared with NPR._ _Former officers Demetrius Haley, Desmond Mills, Emmitt Martin, Justin Smith and Tadarrius Bean were fired Jan. 20 and are now being [charged with murder.](https://www.npr.org/2023/01/30/1152543165/6th-officer-tyre-nichols-preston-hemphill)Video of the Jan. 7 incident was released [Friday](https://www.npr.org/2023/01/27/1152029954/memphis-police-tyre-nichols-body-camera-footage-release)._ Now in at least one case it was for not reporting damage to his police car. But two were about use of force. _Four of those officers — Haley, Martin, Mills and Smith — were reprimanded or suspended earlier for their failure to report when they used physical force, failure to report a domestic dispute, or for damages sustained to their squad cruisers, according to the files from Memphis police. Bean did not have any reprimands or suspensions in the files._ But yeah, the “thin blue wall” is not always a Good Thing. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2023, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tyre-nichols-death-discussion-as-the-video-comes-out/978910/296 "2023-02-03T23:16:35Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > That’s pretty rare. I mean the George Floyd killing only had four cops, two of which were trainees.Tyre Nichols had five officers. There were more than five officers there. Did any on the others report the incident as being wrong? ---
**Author:** ![Mijin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mijin/32/9369_2.png) [@Mijin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mijin)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2023, 1:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tyre-nichols-death-discussion-as-the-video-comes-out/978910/297 "2023-02-04T01:42:54Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Oh on that- [4 of the officers charged with Tyre Nichols’ death had prior violations at work : NPR](https://www.npr.org/2023/02/01/1153151044/tyre-nichols-memphis-police-violations) > > _Four of the five former Memphis Police officers who have been charged in the death of Tyre Nichols had previous infractions with the department, according to Memphis police personnel records shared with NPR._ Are they outliers or is that typical? Oh right, we don’t know, and that’s why transparency is one of the things that groups like BLM are campaigning for. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2023, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tyre-nichols-death-discussion-as-the-video-comes-out/978910/298 "2023-02-04T16:30:32Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > But dont just judge how bad or good American cops are based upon that. I don’t. My mother was in a car accident yesterday. I left work to help her out, and the cops on the scene were extremely nice and courteous. I know a couple of cops, and have more as clients, and I have no problem with them. But just as I may eat apples out of a barrel and find them delicious, that doesn’t mean I should ignore the rotten ones at the bottom. I am also a white middle class business owner who is well known in my community. My experience with the same exact cops is probably very different from those who do not enjoy my privilege. And media bias goes both ways. Do you actually think that they report on every time that a cop abuses their authority? It really only makes it to national news if someone is dead due to police misconduct, and then only if there is video showing it. There is much less reporting on “lesser” incidents of dehumanizing and degrading conduct. If Mr. Nichols had survived his assault by the police, or there was not such clear video, we wouldn’t be talking about them, and they’d be out “policing” their beat right now. > [@DrDeth](#): > > Just like if you followed just the national news, the only shootings reported are Mass shootings or VIPs. And if you followed just the national news, there’d be no car accidents that weren’t multi-car pileups. And just like car accidents, gun homicides are just _so common_ that the media doesn’t report on them unless they involve large numbers or children. > [@DrDeth](#): > > Biden just rammed thru some laws that will help keep guns out of the hands of criminals and violent abusers. It is a decent bill. Could be better, and I guarantee it will end up in front of SCOTUS, where I suspect it will be struck down. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2023, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tyre-nichols-death-discussion-as-the-video-comes-out/978910/299 "2023-02-04T16:43:26Z")
> [@Max\_S](#): > > If possible. I _don’t_ think police should be expected to risk their lives to keep the suspect alive to the same extent that they do to protect the public at large, other police, or themselves. A “suspect” is “the public at large”. The people the police endanger and kill are precisely the people they’re supposed to be protecting. As for the common police refrain that “going home alive is the #1 priority”, or “Cops need to keep themselves alive”, well, if that’s really your number one priority, then you can achieve that by retiring from police work. ---
**Author:** ![PastTense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pasttense/32/14550_2.png) [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2023, 7:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tyre-nichols-death-discussion-as-the-video-comes-out/978910/300 "2023-02-04T19:00:48Z")
Unfortunately paywalled: > Since its formation in November 2021, the specialized squad of some 40 officers that was deployed to deter violence in some of the city’s most troubled neighborhoods was responsible for repeated acts of intimidation, harassment and violence by some of its officers, according to interviews with dozens of people in the community, including several arrested by the unit’s officers. “Police out here riding around like hound dogs,” said Lareta Johnson Ray, whose family members wound up in a violent encounter with the unit’s officers after running from them last summer. > **[Muscle Cars, Balaclavas and Fists: How the Scorpions Rolled Through Memphis](https://www.nytimes.com/2023/02/04/us/memphis-police-scorpion.html)** > > Residents say the street crime unit was an intimidating and sometimes violent presence in the city. Five Scorpion officers are charged with murdering Tyre Nichols during an arrest. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tyre-nichols-death-discussion-as-the-video-comes-out/978910.md?page=14) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tyre-nichols-death-discussion-as-the-video-comes-out/978910.md?page=16)