# U.K. General Election December 2019 **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [October 29, 2019, 11:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-k-general-election-december-2019/842639 "2019-10-29T11:51:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![Mk\_VII](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Mk\_VII](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mk_VII)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2019, 12:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-k-general-election-december-2019/842639/161 "2019-12-13T00:19:57Z")
Under a more plausible leader, such as Keir Starmer, Labour would probably have done better. Right now we are waiting to find out how bad it is for them, exit polls are not usually all that wrong. (actually I’m going to bed, whatever the result is, it can keep until 06:00hrs). ---
**Author:** ![Mrs\_McGinty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/6bbea6/32.png) [@Mrs\_McGinty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mrs_McGinty)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2019, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-k-general-election-december-2019/842639/162 "2019-12-13T00:29:14Z")
> [@SciFiSam](#): > > Nope, because those who voted for the Tories voted for a really right wing version of Tories and everyone on here who’s British knows that. > > Johnson is openly racist and sexist and says things like children of working women are more likely to be muggers. He lies, lies, lies, and lies again, and does it so much that it’s hard to keep up. He hid from almost almost all interviews in this election. > > He copied Trump, and Trump won. They even both do the stupid hair thing. > > Umunna wouldn’t have won, Smith wouldn’t have won, Cooper wouldn’t have won, no Labour leader would have won, because when people are literally choosing a person like Johnson, they are not choosing on policies, they’re consciously choosing someone who they know is a vile bastard. > > And every single person who voted Tory voted to make my life much, much more difficult. I do hate them, because it would honestly be a little weird not to hate people like that, right? > > And they’ll turn up at hospital and demand care and complain about not getting it and they fucking voted for it. Keep thinking like that and you’ll keep helping the Tories win. Change is achieved by bringing people onside. Which means separating the irredeemable from the misinformed. So long as you hate people for being wrong, you’ll give the real bastards an easy path to power. ---
**Author:** ![MortSahlFan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/3bc359/32.png) [@MortSahlFan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MortSahlFan)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2019, 1:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-k-general-election-december-2019/842639/163 "2019-12-13T01:26:07Z")
I’m hoping Jeremy Corbyn wins! I’m also rooting for George Galloway, but it looks like its over for him. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Stafford\_Cripps](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_stafford_cripps/32/7167_2.png) [@The\_Stafford\_Cripps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Stafford_Cripps)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2019, 1:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-k-general-election-december-2019/842639/164 "2019-12-13T01:34:16Z")
> [@MortSahlFan](#): > > I’m also rooting for George Galloway, but it looks like its over for him. I’m not even going to bother looking up where he’s standing, but _nobody_ likes George Galloway. ---
**Author:** ![Wesley\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wesley_clark/32/20581_2.png) [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2019, 2:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-k-general-election-december-2019/842639/165 "2019-12-13T02:48:14Z")
As someone who doesn’t understand UK politics, can someone explain to me why the conservatives won so heavily? I thought Brexit barely passed with 52% of the vote when the referendum happened. Was this election a referendum on brexit? Was it a referendum on the NHS? Are there still hard feelings against the labour party due to the Iraq war? Didn’t the conservative party also vote for it though? ---
**Author:** ![The\_Stafford\_Cripps](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_stafford_cripps/32/7167_2.png) [@The\_Stafford\_Cripps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Stafford_Cripps)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2019, 2:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-k-general-election-december-2019/842639/166 "2019-12-13T02:53:30Z")
> [@Wesley\_Clark](#): > > As someone who doesn’t understand UK politics, can someone explain to me why the conservatives won so heavily? > > I thought Brexit barely passed with 52% of the vote when the referendum happened. Was this election a referendum on brexit? Was it a referendum on the NHS? > > Are there still hard feelings against the labour party due to the Iraq war? Didn’t the conservative party also vote for it though? Nothing to do with Iraq war - current Labour leadership were totally against it. 48% voted remain, small percentage now want Brexit to happen as it respects democratic decision, rest split between Labour and LibDems in England; first past the post system allows Tories to win massive majority without significantly increasing vote share. ---
**Author:** ![Wesley\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wesley_clark/32/20581_2.png) [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2019, 2:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-k-general-election-december-2019/842639/167 "2019-12-13T02:56:48Z")
Ok, so did the conservatives win because the leftist vote was split between labour and liberal democrats (the same way republicans win when leftist votes in the US are split between democrats and the green party)? If so, why did people split the vote? Did they feel labour was too conservative? Does the UK have any kind of grassroots pressure to move towards a ranked choice or other voting method where third parties don’t act as spoilers? ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2019, 2:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-k-general-election-december-2019/842639/168 "2019-12-13T02:57:19Z")
There was the anti-semitism thing, but also Labor went far left on economics while the Conservatives also went left and thus captured the center. If the GOP did the same thing here and ixnayed the hate speech they’d win landslides too. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Stafford\_Cripps](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_stafford_cripps/32/7167_2.png) [@The\_Stafford\_Cripps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Stafford_Cripps)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2019, 3:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-k-general-election-december-2019/842639/169 "2019-12-13T03:04:00Z")
> [@Wesley\_Clark](#): > > Ok, so did the conservatives win because the leftist vote was split between labour and liberal democrats (the same way republicans win when leftist votes in the US are split between democrats and the green party)? > > If so, why did people split the vote? Did they feel labour was too conservative? > > Does the UK have any kind of grassroots pressure to move towards a ranked choice or other voting method where third parties don’t act as spoilers? Def not too conservative, too early to say why tactical voting didn’t work/happen. No strong movement towards PR voting, in large part thanks to LibDems totally fucking up the whole issue in 2010. Also people just don’t understand what it means, thanks to deliberate obfuscation on the part of the BBC and the newspapers. ---
**Author:** ![ISiddiqui](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/97f17d/32.png) [@ISiddiqui](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ISiddiqui)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2019, 3:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-k-general-election-december-2019/842639/170 "2019-12-13T03:06:49Z")
Apparently the Brexit Party only really ran in close races and Labour districts and somehow actually took a good deal of Labour votes (or at least enough), giving those areas to the Conservatives. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2019, 3:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-k-general-election-december-2019/842639/171 "2019-12-13T03:07:19Z")
Also, Labor’s position on the biggest issue of the day for Britain was similar to the Whigs position on slavery. It was a muddled mess when the voters demanded clarity and a real choice. ---
**Author:** ![Wesley\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wesley_clark/32/20581_2.png) [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2019, 3:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-k-general-election-december-2019/842639/172 "2019-12-13T03:12:29Z")
> [@The\_Stafford\_Cripps](#): > > Def not too conservative, too early to say why tactical voting didn’t work/happen. > > No strong movement towards PR voting, in large part thanks to LibDems totally fucking up the whole issue in 2010. Also people just don’t understand what it means, thanks to deliberate obfuscation on the part of the BBC and the newspapers. Well that sucks. I looked at election results so far. The conservative parties (conservative and brexit) have 4.3 million votes right now. The leftist parties (labour, social democrats, scottish nationalist, sinn fein, green) seem to have over 5 million votes so far. It sucks if the vote is just being split on the left and letting the conservatives win. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2019, 3:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-k-general-election-december-2019/842639/173 "2019-12-13T03:24:47Z")
The electoral system working badly for the left is just structural, and it’s worldwide. For one, they tend to concentrate in urban areas, for another, they are more prone to fractures that prevent winning elections or prevent governance once elections are won. ---
**Author:** ![dalej42](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@dalej42](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dalej42)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2019, 3:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-k-general-election-december-2019/842639/174 "2019-12-13T03:45:54Z")
Corbyn will resign but only after a ‘period of reflection.’ In other words, he wants to continue to take over the Labour Party and get his far left cronies into power. I hope the entire PLP turns on him and actively mocks him daily until the scum resigns. ---
**Author:** ![Wesley\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wesley_clark/32/20581_2.png) [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2019, 3:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-k-general-election-december-2019/842639/175 "2019-12-13T03:48:05Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > The electoral system working badly for the left is just structural, and it’s worldwide. For one, they tend to concentrate in urban areas, for another, they are more prone to fractures that prevent winning elections or prevent governance once elections are won. Yeah but it wasn’t always like that. In the modern age the rise of neofascism seems to be occurring in rural areas in the US, UK, Poland, Turkey, France, etc. while the urban areas are more leftist. But in the US at least, the rural areas used to be leftist up until the civil rights movement. But yeah the modern left is at a disadvantage. Especially since they have no real answer to the appeal of identity politics other than ridicule. ---
**Author:** ![chizzuk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e36b37/32.png) [@chizzuk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chizzuk)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2019, 4:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-k-general-election-december-2019/842639/176 "2019-12-13T04:16:21Z")
The DUP’s deputy leader, Nigel Dodds, has lost his seat to Sinn Fein. How embarrassing for him. That seat came into existence in 1885, before the Irish Free State was even a thing, and has been in unionist hands up until now. ---
**Author:** ![Zakalwe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zakalwe/32/270_2.png) [@Zakalwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zakalwe)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2019, 4:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-k-general-election-december-2019/842639/177 "2019-12-13T04:18:00Z")
> [@dalej42](#): > > Corbyn will resign but only after a ‘period of reflection.’ In other words, he wants to continue to take over the Labour Party and get his far left cronies into power. > > I hope the entire PLP turns on him and actively mocks him daily until the scum resigns. Or not: [Jeremy Corbyn to step down as Labour leader after crushing defeat](https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/jeremy-corbyn-to-step-down-as-labour-leader-after-crushing-defeat/ar-AAK4VRY) According to the article, first thing in the morning. ---
**Author:** ![dalej42](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@dalej42](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dalej42)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2019, 4:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-k-general-election-december-2019/842639/178 "2019-12-13T04:18:52Z")
Jo Swinson loses as well so what’s left of the Libs will need a new leader as well as the DUP. ---
**Author:** ![GreenWyvern](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/greenwyvern/32/2834_2.png) [@GreenWyvern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GreenWyvern)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2019, 4:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-k-general-election-december-2019/842639/179 "2019-12-13T04:23:09Z")
Jo Swinson has lost her seat. So much for being the next prime minister. It underlines how wrongheaded the Lib Dems have been in this election. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2019, 4:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-k-general-election-december-2019/842639/180 "2019-12-13T04:29:39Z")
> [@Wesley\_Clark](#): > > Yeah but it wasn’t always like that. In the modern age the rise of neofascism seems to be occurring in rural areas in the US, UK, Poland, Turkey, France, etc. while the urban areas are more leftist. > > But in the US at least, the rural areas used to be leftist up until the civil rights movement. > > But yeah the modern left is at a disadvantage. Especially since they have no real answer to the appeal of identity politics other than ridicule. It’s hard to take the moral high ground when identity politics is pretty much the basis of your party, and now it’s the basis of both parties. If you look at 2nd choice voting in the Democratic primary, ideology seems almost irrelevant. Old white voters will take Biden or Sanders, women will take Harris or Warren, college educated voters like Warren and Buttigieg. It’s all about who you see yourself in or who you think will fight hardest for your group. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-k-general-election-december-2019/842639.md?page=8) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-k-general-election-december-2019/842639.md?page=10)