# U.S. Army Criminal Investigation laboratory – Mickey Mouse in coat of arms?! **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [June 30, 2012, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-criminal-investigation-laboratory-mickey-mouse-in-coat-of-arms/626810 "2012-06-30T15:08:43Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Donnerwetter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b2d939/32.png) [@Donnerwetter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Donnerwetter)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2012, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-criminal-investigation-laboratory-mickey-mouse-in-coat-of-arms/626810/1 "2012-06-30T15:08:43Z")
I was researching a historical topic when I stumbled upon this website: [http://www.cid.army.mil/usacil2.html](http://www.cid.army.mil/usacil2.html) Please correct me if I get this wrong: The official coat of arms of the U.S. Army Criminal Investigation laboratory – which is a part of the United States Army Criminal Investigation Command – is **Mickey Mouse, dressed up as Sherlock Holmes**?! Is this some sort of prank? This can’t possibly be serious! What’s the Straight Dope? ---
**Author:** ![andrewm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c57346/32.png) [@andrewm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andrewm)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2012, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-criminal-investigation-laboratory-mickey-mouse-in-coat-of-arms/626810/2 "2012-06-30T15:26:26Z")
Pretty sure it’s real. I have a business card from somebody there with that logo on it. No idea why they picked it though. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2012, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-criminal-investigation-laboratory-mickey-mouse-in-coat-of-arms/626810/3 "2012-06-30T17:06:03Z")
That’s what happens when you let units choose their own patches. ---
**Author:** ![njtt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ecd19e/32.png) [@njtt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/njtt)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2012, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-criminal-investigation-laboratory-mickey-mouse-in-coat-of-arms/626810/4 "2012-06-30T17:07:14Z")
It is hardly a [coat of arms](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coat_of_arms), a logo maybe. It still seems a bit _infra dig_ for such an august organization, but I don’t think it is quite so bad if you just think of it as a logo. Click on it and you get a copy of the letter giving Disney’s permission to use it. ---
**Author:** ![Oldeb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/ea666f/32.png) [@Oldeb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oldeb)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2012, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-criminal-investigation-laboratory-mickey-mouse-in-coat-of-arms/626810/5 "2012-06-30T19:47:05Z")
[The Air Force has a bunch of Disney patches as well.](http://www.afhra.af.mil/art/mediagallery.asp?galleryID=8783&page=1) ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2012, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-criminal-investigation-laboratory-mickey-mouse-in-coat-of-arms/626810/6 "2012-06-30T20:03:53Z")
I guess we can segue this thread into “when did Mickey Mouse become a denigrating name?” I suspect Mickey was a beloved symbol of all that was good and fun and wholesome in America… until about the mid-70’s, in college, where I started to hear exceptionally easy courses described as “Mickey Mouse courses” (when they weren’t being called “bird courses”). ---
**Author:** ![Donnerwetter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b2d939/32.png) [@Donnerwetter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Donnerwetter)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2012, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-criminal-investigation-laboratory-mickey-mouse-in-coat-of-arms/626810/7 "2012-06-30T20:26:51Z")
> [@md2000](#): > > I guess we can segue this thread into “when did Mickey Mouse become a denigrating name?” > > I suspect Mickey was a beloved symbol of all that was good and fun and wholesome in America… until about the mid-70’s, in college, where I started to hear exceptionally easy courses described as “Mickey Mouse courses” (when they weren’t being called “bird courses”). I too like Walt Disney. My personal favourite since childhood days is Goofy. But I don’t think it would be appropriate to use this image: [http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/a/a6/Goofy.svg](http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/a/a6/Goofy.svg) to represent the mission of, let’s say, the United States Army Training and Doctrine Command. ---
**Author:** ![Alan\_Smithee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/2acd7d/32.png) [@Alan\_Smithee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alan_Smithee)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2012, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-criminal-investigation-laboratory-mickey-mouse-in-coat-of-arms/626810/8 "2012-06-30T20:33:59Z")
Wow, not only is is Mickey Mouse dressed up like Sherlock Holmes, it’s a _really bad rendition_ of Mickey Mouse dressed up like Sherlock Holmes. Maybe they got Uncle Walt himself to do the drawing; he was apparently never very good at drawing Mickey, having stollen him from a more competent animator. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2012, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-criminal-investigation-laboratory-mickey-mouse-in-coat-of-arms/626810/9 "2012-06-30T20:44:51Z")
I want to know who in the 449 Bomb Squadron thought [this](http://www.afhra.af.mil/shared/media/ggallery/webgraphic/AFG-100824-048.jpg) was a good idea. ---
**Author:** ![njtt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ecd19e/32.png) [@njtt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/njtt)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2012, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-criminal-investigation-laboratory-mickey-mouse-in-coat-of-arms/626810/10 "2012-06-30T20:47:25Z")
> [@Oldeb](#): > > [The Air Force has a bunch of Disney patches as well.](http://www.afhra.af.mil/art/mediagallery.asp?galleryID=8783&page=1) :eek: Some of those are downright disturbing! ---
**Author:** ![Horatio\_Hellpop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Horatio\_Hellpop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatio_Hellpop)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2012, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-criminal-investigation-laboratory-mickey-mouse-in-coat-of-arms/626810/11 "2012-06-30T22:45:18Z")
> [@njtt](#): > > :eek: Some of those are downright disturbing! Yeah, but the Air Force (from its US Army Air Corps days in the 40s) has a tradition of cartoony nose cone art, and these are squarely within that tradition. Mickey-as-Sherlock seems to come out of nowhere. ---
**Author:** ![Duckster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/duckster/32/1244_2.png) [@Duckster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duckster)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2012, 12:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-criminal-investigation-laboratory-mickey-mouse-in-coat-of-arms/626810/12 "2012-07-01T00:40:36Z")
> [@Donnerwetter](#): > > Is this some sort of prank? This can’t possibly be serious! What’s the Straight Dope? Click on the image. You can then read [Disney’s 1966 licensing letter](http://www.cid.army.mil/images/USACIL_Disney_letter.jpg). ---
**Author:** ![gunnergoz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e95f7d/32.png) [@gunnergoz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gunnergoz)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2012, 1:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-criminal-investigation-laboratory-mickey-mouse-in-coat-of-arms/626810/13 "2012-07-01T01:50:14Z")
In WW2 Disney studios cooperated with the military branches on all sorts of character-themed projects including distinctive insignia like the one pictured, unit patches and aircraft decorations. The tradition clearly is continuing. ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2012, 1:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-criminal-investigation-laboratory-mickey-mouse-in-coat-of-arms/626810/14 "2012-07-01T01:54:14Z")
> [@Donnerwetter](#): > > I too like Walt Disney. My personal favourite since childhood days is Goofy. But I don’t think it would be appropriate to use this image: > > [http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/a/a6/Goofy.svg](http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/a/a6/Goofy.svg) > > to represent the mission of, let’s say, the United States Army Training and Doctrine Command. Then you obviously have never dealt with TRADOC. Seems very appropriate to me. ---
**Author:** ![Mlutz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/87869e/32.png) [@Mlutz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mlutz)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2012, 4:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-criminal-investigation-laboratory-mickey-mouse-in-coat-of-arms/626810/15 "2012-08-13T16:58:26Z")
TheDisney ckey Mouse is authentic and was designed by Disney Studios and authorized by Wat Disney. The Crime lab has a copy of the letter f approval and should still be on file. There were only a few patches produced and were in the possession of the crime lab workers. ---
**Author:** ![ArmenE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e9bcb4/32.png) [@ArmenE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ArmenE)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2012, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-criminal-investigation-laboratory-mickey-mouse-in-coat-of-arms/626810/16 "2012-08-13T17:15:40Z")
> [@Mlutz](#): > > TheDisney ckey Mouse is authentic and was designed by Disney Studios and authorized by Wat Disney. The Crime lab has a copy of the letter f approval and should still be on file. There were only a few patches produced and were in the possession of the crime lab workers. Actually, if you click on the logo in OP’s link, you’re take to [this copy](http://www.cid.army.mil/images/USACIL_Disney_letter.jpg) of that very letter. ---
**Author:** ![mlees](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba8739/32.png) [@mlees](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mlees)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2012, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-criminal-investigation-laboratory-mickey-mouse-in-coat-of-arms/626810/17 "2012-08-13T17:48:36Z")
> **[VFA-31](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VFA-31)** > > VFA-31 or Strike Fighter Squadron 31 is known as the Tomcatters, callsign "Felix", a United States Navy strike fighter squadron stationed at Naval Air Station Oceana flying the F/A-18E Super Hornet. The Tomcatters are the second oldest Navy Fighter Attack squadron operating today. > The squadron was originally known as the Shooting Stars. The original "Felix the Cat" squadron was VF-3. After the Battle of Midway, VF-3 and VF-6 swapped designations on 15 July 1943, resulting in a three-year controv... Navy squadron that has “Felix the Cat” on it’s insignia patch. ---
**Author:** ![guizot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guizot/32/3636_2.png) [@guizot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/guizot)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2012, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-criminal-investigation-laboratory-mickey-mouse-in-coat-of-arms/626810/18 "2012-08-13T18:12:07Z")
> [@gunnergoz](#): > > In WW2 Disney studios cooperated with the military branches on all sorts of character-themed projects including distinctive insignia like the one pictured, unit patches and aircraft decorations. The tradition clearly is continuing. Not only that, but Disney made propaganda films for the government during WWII, (some of which depicted images that today would be considered racist). ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2012, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-criminal-investigation-laboratory-mickey-mouse-in-coat-of-arms/626810/19 "2012-08-13T18:13:47Z")
Hopefully if the 449 Bomb Squadron still exists, they are not still using that patch! ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2012, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-criminal-investigation-laboratory-mickey-mouse-in-coat-of-arms/626810/20 "2012-08-13T21:58:01Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > I want to know who in the 449 Bomb Squadron thought [this](http://www.afhra.af.mil/shared/media/ggallery/webgraphic/AFG-100824-048.jpg) was a good idea. It’s just a monkey. Honest. Serious. nothing else. I swear. You’re reading too much into into. It’s not what you think it is… 🙂 [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-criminal-investigation-laboratory-mickey-mouse-in-coat-of-arms/626810.md?page=2)