# U.S. Army, Stop Kicking Your Wounded Out the Door **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 17, 2005, 7:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-stop-kicking-your-wounded-out-the-door/312895 "2005-07-17T19:28:09Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2005, 1:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-stop-kicking-your-wounded-out-the-door/312895/21 "2005-07-18T01:04:39Z")
> [@Manda JO](#): > > But is 100% disability 100% of your previous pay? I am assuming it is not. 100% disability is 100% of the pay that you are getting at that time. For instance, even though I am eligible for promotion right now, were I to get 100% disability right now I would get E-4 with 4 years service pay for the rest of my life. ---
**Author:** ![Diane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/2acd7d/32.png) [@Diane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diane)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2005, 1:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-stop-kicking-your-wounded-out-the-door/312895/22 "2005-07-18T01:05:34Z")
I have been working for the VA for 17 years. Thank you MLS. There is a lot of bad information in the article posted by the OP as well as some posts in this thread. I would suggest that people look at [www.va.gov](http://www.va.gov) for the truth. A couple of quickies - Reeder - there is a difference between service connected disability rating at 100 percent and 70 - 90% service connected disability considered 100% due to individual unemployability. You can collect 100% disability and still work, VA doesn’t care, it is not based on your ability to hold employment. If you are rated 70 - 90% disabled but those disabilities prevent you from holding gainful employment, you may be qualified to received benefits as if you are rated 100% disabled. You will not be granted this benefit and/or you will be removed from this benefit if you show that you are able to work. (I won’t go into the non-service connected pension. That is another ballgame). Recently VA has started a program called the Pre-Separation Program. In fact, my office is one of only two in the entire national that adjudicates these claims. We are processing the Pre-Sep claims for all of the states on the western side of the U.S. Our tiny office is in the process of multiplying 6 times but until the new people are hired and trained, we have been working many hours of overtime without a light at the end of the tunnel. I know this program well, lemme tell ya. ☹ This program begins the disability compensation claims processing BEFORE the soldier is discharged. In fact, the examination and rating is completed before they are discharged. By the time the military releases them, we finalize their claim and their disability benefits immediately kick in. This prevents even losing one month of pay between the transition of military to VA. The months long claim processing of newly discharged veterans is a thing of the past. Injured or disabled soldiers are immediated switched over to VA care upon their release. The military is most definitely not tossing their wounded out onto the street. :rolleyes: The military is not set up to take care of it’s wounded for more than a temporary basis, that is the function of VA facilities such as Walter Reed and other VA Medical Centers. The military is not, and should not, be capable of paying long term disability and furnish medical treatment for wounded soldiers. Again, that is the function and purpose of VA. A soldier is NOT ELIGIBLE for VA until they are discharged from the military. (On a personal side note - my father lived within walking distance of the military hospital in Landstuhl, Germany. A couple of times I walked from his house to the hospital to visit the soldiers.) ---
**Author:** ![Diane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/2acd7d/32.png) [@Diane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diane)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2005, 1:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-stop-kicking-your-wounded-out-the-door/312895/23 "2005-07-18T01:16:05Z")
> [@Manda JO](#): > > But is 100% disability 100% of your previous pay? I am assuming it is not. Military retired pay depends on your years in, rank, ect. However, 100% VA compensation has NOTHING to do with any previous pay. VA compensation rates are assigned by congress and are the same for everyone. 10% = $108 20% = $210 30% = $324 with spouse $363 And so on. > **[VA.gov | Veterans Affairs](https://www.benefits.va.gov/compensation/Rates/comp01.htm)** > > Apply for and manage the VA benefits and services you’ve earned as a Veteran, Servicemember, or family member—like health care, disability, education, and more. At 30% and higher, VA pays an additional amount for dependents. There are also additional amounts paid for certain conditions such as loss of limbs (among others). Again, a 20% service connected veteran who left the military as a E-3 would receive the same amount as a 20% service connected veteran who left the military as an 0-4. ---
**Author:** ![Diane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/2acd7d/32.png) [@Diane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diane)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2005, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-stop-kicking-your-wounded-out-the-door/312895/24 "2005-07-18T01:17:20Z")
> [@Airman Doors](#): > > 100% disability is 100% of the pay that you are getting at that time. For instance, even though I am eligible for promotion right now, were I to get 100% disability right now I would get E-4 with 4 years service pay for the rest of my life. No. That is not how VA disability compensation works. See above. ---
**Author:** ![Diane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/2acd7d/32.png) [@Diane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diane)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2005, 1:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-stop-kicking-your-wounded-out-the-door/312895/25 "2005-07-18T01:19:31Z")
> [@Meaty Beaty Big and Bouncy](#): > > It’s not called 100% for nothin (says the unemployable 100% disabled veteran) Not sure what you mean here. Have you applied for VA compensation? Has VA given you a disability rating? Are you rated 100% service connected disabled or 100% based on Individual Unemployability? They are two completely different animals. ---
**Author:** ![Diane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/2acd7d/32.png) [@Diane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diane)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2005, 1:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-stop-kicking-your-wounded-out-the-door/312895/26 "2005-07-18T01:20:54Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > But if you know someone who’s considering enlistment, feel free to pass my rant, and link, on to them. Except that the rant and link are based on erroneous information. ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2005, 1:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-stop-kicking-your-wounded-out-the-door/312895/27 "2005-07-18T01:38:53Z")
> [@Diane](#): > > No. That is not how VA disability compensation works. See above. Well, how about that? Sorry for spreading disinformation. I have a couple guys going through that riht now and one of them told me that. I’ll pass it on to him. ---
**Author:** ![Meaty\_Beaty\_Big\_and\_Bouncy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c57346/32.png) [@Meaty\_Beaty\_Big\_and\_Bouncy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meaty_Beaty_Big_and_Bouncy)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2005, 1:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-stop-kicking-your-wounded-out-the-door/312895/28 "2005-07-18T01:40:49Z")
I’m rated as having a 100% service connected disability. I failed a test by 1 point (my first ☹ ) that the VA had paid for. When I asked about taking it again, my VA counselor was told I was unemployable so it didn’t make any difference(if I passed, I would have my A+ certification). ---
**Author:** ![Diane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/2acd7d/32.png) [@Diane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diane)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2005, 1:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-stop-kicking-your-wounded-out-the-door/312895/29 "2005-07-18T01:41:10Z")
> [@MLS](#): > > And, if a person is still in rehab and unable to work just yet, isn’t he then eligible for various disability payments? Certainly Social Security disability if nothing else. I feel like I am hogging the thread, I apologize. Another VA benefit for veterans with service connected disabilities is Vocational Rehabilitation - a program that again, is not available until a soldier is “put out on the street” er. . . I mean. . . discharged from active duty. > **[VA.gov | Veterans Affairs](https://www.benefits.va.gov/vocrehab/index.asp)** > > Apply for and manage the VA benefits and services you’ve earned as a Veteran, Servicemember, or family member—like health care, disability, education, and more. This program not only trains veterans in a career field better suited to their needs now that they are disabled, but pays then an additional amount each month on top of their disability payments. Again, a program that is not, and should not, be administered through the U.S. military. ---
**Author:** ![Meaty\_Beaty\_Big\_and\_Bouncy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c57346/32.png) [@Meaty\_Beaty\_Big\_and\_Bouncy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meaty_Beaty_Big_and_Bouncy)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2005, 1:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-stop-kicking-your-wounded-out-the-door/312895/30 "2005-07-18T01:44:57Z")
At the time I was going through VA Rehabilitation. ---
**Author:** ![Diane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/2acd7d/32.png) [@Diane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diane)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2005, 1:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-stop-kicking-your-wounded-out-the-door/312895/31 "2005-07-18T01:49:19Z")
> [@Airman Doors](#): > > Well, how about that? Sorry for spreading disinformation. I have a couple guys going through that riht now and one of them told me that. I’ll pass it on to him. No problem! 🙂 Point him to the VA website. ---
**Author:** ![Meaty\_Beaty\_Big\_and\_Bouncy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c57346/32.png) [@Meaty\_Beaty\_Big\_and\_Bouncy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meaty_Beaty_Big_and_Bouncy)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2005, 1:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-stop-kicking-your-wounded-out-the-door/312895/32 "2005-07-18T01:49:50Z")
The Vocational Rehabilitation benefit expires after your out 12 years though. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2005, 1:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-stop-kicking-your-wounded-out-the-door/312895/33 "2005-07-18T01:52:38Z")
> [@Diane](#): > > Except that the rant and link are based on erroneous information. I’m open to correction if I’m wrong. But saying “go to [www.va.gov](http://www.va.gov) for more information” isn’t adequate as a rebuttal, let alone a refutation. ---
**Author:** ![Diane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/2acd7d/32.png) [@Diane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diane)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2005, 2:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-stop-kicking-your-wounded-out-the-door/312895/34 "2005-07-18T02:19:01Z")
> [@Meaty Beaty Big and Bouncy](#): > > At the time I was going through VA Rehabilitation. I am not as familiar with the VA Voc Rehab Program as I am with the disability and homeless vet programs, but I do know that a finding of unemployability by Voc Rehab is very different than a disability unemployability rating. Did you appeal your counselors decision? RTFirefly - What exactly would you like a rebuttal to? The fact that the military is not set up to treat and compensate disabled soldiers over an extended period? That they are not tossing them out on the street without further medical care? That VA was established for just this purpose? That the latest program established by VA to ensure that soldiers are taken care of immediately upon discharge, medical care as well as compensation payments, is now up and running? (the dark circles under my eyes from too much overtime and too little sleep can attest to that). I’m really not trying to be difficult and I will provide a cite. I know that around this here joint my claim of 17 years working in this exact field means squat unless there is a webpage to back me. I am just not sure what you want that isn’t available on the [www.va.gov](http://www.va.gov) website. ---
**Author:** ![Diane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/2acd7d/32.png) [@Diane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diane)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2005, 2:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-stop-kicking-your-wounded-out-the-door/312895/35 "2005-07-18T02:51:00Z")
This is the program that I am personally involved in, although I work at the office that covers the western area of the U.S., not Roanoke. “The Benefits Delivery at Discharge (BDD) Program is part of a joint VA-DoD venture to ensure a smooth transition for separating service members and to share valuable medical resources. This initiative originated in 1998 and is known in other areas as the Pre-Discharge Program or the Pre-Separation Program. This program allows separating service members to begin the process of applying for VA compensation for service connected disabilities prior to separation. Applying before discharge can cut months off the process.” Actually, this program goes further than cutting off months, it picks up **immediately** where the military leaves off. > **[VA.gov | Veterans Affairs](https://www.benefits.va.gov/roanoke/)** > > Apply for and manage the VA benefits and services you’ve earned as a Veteran, Servicemember, or family member—like health care, disability, education, and more. > **[VA.gov | Veterans Affairs](https://www.benefits.va.gov/roanoke/)** > > Apply for and manage the VA benefits and services you’ve earned as a Veteran, Servicemember, or family member—like health care, disability, education, and more. Army program to help transition soldiers to the VA system - Disabled Soldier Support System (DS3) [http://www.armyds3.org/skins/WBLO/display.aspx?Action=display\_page&mode=User&ModuleID=8cde2e88-3052-448c-893d-d0b4b14b31c4&ObjectID=78d06b62-2da9-4c15-a739-a38aa13404e9&AllowSSL=true](http://www.armyds3.org/skins/WBLO/display.aspx?Action=display_page&mode=User&ModuleID=8cde2e88-3052-448c-893d-d0b4b14b31c4&ObjectID=78d06b62-2da9-4c15-a739-a38aa13404e9&AllowSSL=true) Walter Reed Hospital which treats the war injured soldiers until the VA Medical System is able to pick up. VA also has a support staff based in the center to assist them in filing a claim for disability, which is then expedited through the system. At no time are these soldiers tossed out to fend for themselves. [http://www.wramc.amedd.army.mil/](http://www.wramc.amedd.army.mil/) This is the TAP/DTAP Program which “Provide information which will help you make the transition to civilian life easier by identifying many of the VA benefits available to you.” [http://www.seamlesstransition.va.gov/transition.asp](http://www.seamlesstransition.va.gov/transition.asp) ---
**Author:** ![Meaty\_Beaty\_Big\_and\_Bouncy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c57346/32.png) [@Meaty\_Beaty\_Big\_and\_Bouncy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meaty_Beaty_Big_and_Bouncy)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2005, 2:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-stop-kicking-your-wounded-out-the-door/312895/36 "2005-07-18T02:57:57Z")
> [@](#): > > \*originally posted by \ ***Diane** > Did you appeal your counselors decision? No, it really wasn’t that important to me. I really would have liked to pass that test, though. ---
**Author:** ![Diane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/2acd7d/32.png) [@Diane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diane)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2005, 3:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-stop-kicking-your-wounded-out-the-door/312895/37 "2005-07-18T03:01:13Z")
From the “MEMORANDUM OF UNDERSTANDING BETWEEN VETERANS AFFAIRS AND USAFE” "The BDD program’s focus is to conduct the examination; evaluate the medical evidence of record (including the ETS examination and SMRs); make a disability determination; and process the service member’s claim at the Germany BDD site. This process is intended to ensure service members a seamless transition from military service to veteran status and to receive VA disability compensation and associated medical treatment proximal to service separation. " ---
**Author:** ![Diane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/2acd7d/32.png) [@Diane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diane)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2005, 3:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-stop-kicking-your-wounded-out-the-door/312895/38 "2005-07-18T03:03:24Z")
> [@Diane](#): > > From the “MEMORANDUM OF UNDERSTANDING BETWEEN VETERANS AFFAIRS AND USAFE” > > "The BDD program’s focus is to conduct the examination; evaluate the medical evidence of record (including the ETS examination and SMRs); make a disability determination; and process the service member’s claim at the Germany BDD site. This process is intended to ensure service members a seamless transition from military service to veteran status and to receive VA disability compensation and associated medical treatment proximal to service separation. " I should mention that this was taken from the agreement with the Landstuhl facility, but the memorandum for all agreements are the same including the “seamless transition from military service to veteran status and to receive VA disability compensation and associated medical treatment proximal to service separation” statement. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2005, 3:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-stop-kicking-your-wounded-out-the-door/312895/39 "2005-07-18T03:04:26Z")
> [@](#): > > There used to be a saying in the military - “We take care of our own.” What a coincidence. They have that same saying in the Bush administration. Remember when Clinton was President and every cheap right wing mouthpiece was bitching about how he hated military people? Well, I don’t know what Bill’s personal feelings were about American servicemen but at least he wasn’t killing a hundred of them every month. ---
**Author:** ![Ashes\_Ashes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/db5fbb/32.png) [@Ashes\_Ashes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ashes_Ashes)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2005, 6:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-stop-kicking-your-wounded-out-the-door/312895/40 "2005-07-18T06:06:34Z")
I’m sure there are plenty of people working for the VA, like Diane, who do great jobs, but there are either not enough of them or they were hiding the year my father was dying of cancer. We were shuffled around, misled, ignored, and just generally screwed with when we tried to get help from the VA. It didn’t help that we lived so far from a VA hospital or offices, but proximity to a VA hospital wasn’t tops on the list of considerations when my parents looked for employment forty years ago (and I’ll bet most other vets don’t either). That, coupled with having to deal with everything that attends someone in the process of fighting for his life, and then losing that battle, made it even easier for my Dad to fall through the very big gaps in the system. In the end, all we got was a big phone bill, a flag we had to fold ourselves, a display box so cheap it fell apart the first time we tried to use it, and a hell of a lot of bitterness. My dad’s case was my first encounter and I’ve since seen others mishandled as well. I shudder to think what someone who is going to spend many years in the system, needing a great deal of care, would have to go through. I sincerely believe those who work for the VA are doing their damnedest, and maybe my experiences are an anomaly, but I have my doubts on the rarity of such occurances. It shouldn’t be so hard, for so many veterans to get help. I didn’t want this war because I don’t want _any_ war, but we’ve started it, so let’s do it right. As a citizen of this country I feel it is my _duty_ to provide-- and provide well-- for those who’ve served, as well as their families. I’m ashamed of how we’re treating too many of our servicemen and -women, how we are in effect turning our backs on their families when they need our support the most. Receiving the benefits due them is one battle our veterans shouldn’t have to fight. I believe there is funding for the VA to be able to provide better than they have, but it doesn’t seem to me it’s getting to the right places efficiently. Our government could be much more lean in order to provide those funds, but I’ve much doubt that will happen to any appreciable degree. That likely means more taxes, and though I already hand over a third of my paycheck each month, I’ll pay a little more to do the right thing and be happy to do it. I know honor is a bargain at almost any price, why can’t our government (and I’ll be bi-partisan while slinging the blame around) figure it out? Where’s the faith in the American public, they in particular, should have in spades? Please tell me what’s happening now isn’t a true reflection of America and our representatives are _actually_ representing us. I think my musings above aptly demonstrate why, no matter how many courses in political science I take, I still just don’t understand that particular creature. The individual _words_ make sense, just not how they’re put together, you know? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-stop-kicking-your-wounded-out-the-door/312895.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-army-stop-kicking-your-wounded-out-the-door/312895.md?page=3)