# U.S. Authorities strip search Indian diplomat (female). **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [December 17, 2013, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-authorities-strip-search-indian-diplomat-female/676591 "2013-12-17T20:02:35Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 19
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 6:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-authorities-strip-search-indian-diplomat-female/676591/361 "2013-12-20T18:45:54Z")
I can’t help wondering if this matter escalated this way because Indian diplomats have done this before and aren’t responding to U.S. law. The prosecutor doesn’t quite come out and say that, but I wonder if this played out this way because it was an egregious example of an old problem or because they wanted to show the Indian government that minimum wage laws are taken seriously here. > [@truthSeeker2](#): > > The person is wanted and is absconding from the court of law in India my friend. Hope you got the answer. Yup, you’re certainly not answering the question. ---
**Author:** ![Falchion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/a88e57/32.png) [@Falchion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Falchion)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-authorities-strip-search-indian-diplomat-female/676591/362 "2013-12-20T18:53:15Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > I can’t help wondering if this matter escalated this way because Indian diplomats have done this before and aren’t responding to U.S. law. The prosecutor doesn’t quite come out and say that, but I wonder if this played out this way because it was an egregious example of an old problem or because they wanted to show the Indian government that minimum wage laws are taken seriously here. [This article](http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/12/17/us-usa-india-diplomat-idUSBRE9BG0IF20131217) mentions a lawsuit in 2011 for similar issues in the NY consulate. And I remember reading about a third case in the last year or so involving an Indian diplomat and the same basic problem. This sounds very much like a escalation that came about because of the lack of response to the lawsuits. ---
**Author:** ![truthSeeker2](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7cd45c/32.png) [@truthSeeker2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/truthSeeker2)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-authorities-strip-search-indian-diplomat-female/676591/363 "2013-12-20T18:54:17Z")
> [@truthSeeker2](#): > > I do not think so. Actually when the maid reappeared and met Devyani, she demanded $10k, renewed passport and arrangement for her green card. Basically she was blackmailing Devyani. > > Devyani agreed to give $10k and said she can arrange for flight back home(to India). But the Maid says once she goes back to India she knows she can’t get Green Card. > > This is why Delhi High Court has issued arrest warrant against her. India foreign ministry has sent MULTIPLE unanswered email to US state department for that. > > THIS is why narratives are different in US n in India. > > Plus the main thing also is - we don’t believe public arrest, strip and cavity search are respectable treatment for Consul general. About the on going case n FIR in Delhi HC > [@](#): > > Lack of cooperation by Philip Richard prompts Ministry of External Affairs (MEA) to advise Khobragade on filing a First Information Report in Delhi against the Richard family for wilful deceit and attempt to cheat to illegally immigrate to the US by wrongful means. Based on the MEA’s advice, Khobragade also files for an anticipatory anti-suit injunction in the Delhi High Court so as to prevent filing of any case in the US by Richard to avoid ensuing litigation in the US. > > … > > SEPTEMBER 20, 2013: Delhi High Court issues an ex-parte ad interim injunction against Philip and Sangeeta Richard, restraining them from initiating any legal action or proceedings against Khobragade in any Court / Tribunal / Forum outside India with regard to her employment. The final hearing in the matter is scheduled December 13, 2013. > > … > **[Khobragade: How a visa row sparked a full-scale diplomatic incident](https://www.dailymail.co.uk/indiahome/indianews/article-2526067/Decoding-Khobragade-controversy-How-row-maids-visa-sparked-scale-diplomatic-incident.html)** > > MAIL TODAY EXCLUSIVE: A Mail Today investigation has revealed how the Devyani Khobragade saga unfolded, with the Indian Deputy Consul General finding it difficult even to lodge a missing person's report for her maid Sangeeta Richard. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-authorities-strip-search-indian-diplomat-female/676591/364 "2013-12-20T18:56:12Z")
The prosecution in New York, however, seems to have found Richards’ version of events more credible than Khobragade’s. **truthseeker2** seems to think they just didn’t know what was happening in the Indian courts, but I think they probably did. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-authorities-strip-search-indian-diplomat-female/676591/365 "2013-12-20T18:59:04Z")
> [@truthSeeker2](#): > > About the on going case n FIR in Delhi HC > > [Decoding the Devyani Khobragade controversy: How a row over a maid's visa sparked a full-scale diplomatic incident | Daily Mail Online](http://www.dailymail.co.uk/indiahome/indianews/article-2526067/Decoding-Khobragade-controversy-How-row-maids-visa-sparked-scale-diplomatic-incident.html) > > > [@](#): > > > > SEPTEMBER 20, 2013: Delhi High Court issues an ex-parte ad interim injunction against Philip and Sangeeta Richard, restraining them from initiating any legal action or proceedings against Khobragade in any Court / Tribunal / Forum outside India with regard to her employment. The final hearing in the matter is scheduled December 13, 2013. How does the Indian court have jurisdiction over Philip and Sangeeta’s actions in the United States? Can the Delhi High Court enjoin me from suing someone? Anyone? Or just an Indian? ---
**Author:** ![Enginerd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/bcef8e/32.png) [@Enginerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enginerd)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-authorities-strip-search-indian-diplomat-female/676591/366 "2013-12-20T19:07:40Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > Yup, you’re certainly not answering the question. Answer enough for me, I guess. A few pages ago, **AK84** noted that contracts for domestic help are unheard of in India, and that it was likely that the consulate itself prepared the contract rather than Khobragade. Given the 2011 suit, I guess it’s something they’ve done before. If the embassy and consulate routinely violate US labor laws for people who do have immunity, I can certainly understand the US Attorney’s response when it’s done on behalf of somebody who doesn’t have immunity. ---
**Author:** ![truthSeeker2](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7cd45c/32.png) [@truthSeeker2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/truthSeeker2)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-authorities-strip-search-indian-diplomat-female/676591/367 "2013-12-20T20:05:12Z")
Watch following in full if you care, Videos present Indian version of this saga and details revealed by Devyani’s father (pls do not mind the USA bashing) - [part 1](http://www.timesnow.tv/Debate-Bias-and-prejudice---1/videoshow/4444287.cms) [part 2](http://www.timesnow.tv/Debate-Bias-and-prejudice---2/videoshow/4444287.cms) [part 3](http://www.timesnow.tv/Debate-Bias-and-prejudice---3/videoshow/4444287.cms) I will also give more details of FIR in India when I get them. ---
**Author:** ![Eva\_Luna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e495f1/32.png) [@Eva\_Luna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eva_Luna)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-authorities-strip-search-indian-diplomat-female/676591/368 "2013-12-20T20:22:45Z")
> [@Enginerd](#): > > A few pages ago, **AK84** noted that contracts for domestic help are unheard of in India, and that it was likely that the consulate itself prepared the contract rather than Khobragade. Given the 2011 suit, I guess it’s something they’ve done before. If the embassy and consulate routinely violate US labor laws for people who do have immunity, I can certainly understand the US Attorney’s response when it’s done on behalf of somebody who doesn’t have immunity. I haven’t followed this saga closely enough to know what kind of visa the maid had exactly, but for a B-1 visa (which is typical for domestic employees of someone on a temporary U.S. visa) [a written labor contract is a normal requirement:](http://www.state.gov/documents/organization/87206.pdf) “A personal or domestic employee who accompanies or follows to join an employer who is seeking admission into, or is already in, the United States in B, E, F, H, I, J, L, M, O, P, or Q nonimmigrant status, must meet the following requirements: (1) The employee has a residence abroad which he or she has no intention of abandoning (notwithstanding the fact that the employer may be in a nonimmigrant status which does not require such a showing); (2) The employee can demonstrate at least one year’s experience as a personal or domestic employee; (3) The employee has been employed abroad by the employer as a personal or domestic employee for at least one year prior to the date of the employer’s admission to the United States; OR If the employee-employer relationship existed immediately prior to the time of visa application, the employer can demonstrate that he or she has regularly employed (either year-round or seasonally) personal or domestic employees over a period of several years preceding the domestic employee’s visa application for a nonimmigrant B-1 visa; (4) The employer and the employee have signed an employment contract which contains statements that the employee is guaranteed the minimum or prevailing wages, whichever is greater, and free room and board, and the employer will be the only provider of employment to the employee; (5) The employer must pay the domestic’s initial travel expenses to the United States, and subsequently to the employer’s onward assignment, or to the employee’s country of normal residence at the termination of the assignment.” ---
**Author:** ![Hello\_Again](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/85e7bf/32.png) [@Hello\_Again](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hello_Again)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-authorities-strip-search-indian-diplomat-female/676591/369 "2013-12-20T20:27:23Z")
Do I understand that the Indian government accuses the maid of an immigration scheme… A scheme which could not be successful unless the Indian government intentionally defrauded the US government? Clever one, isn’t she, to force the consulate to lie to immigration officials like that. Or maybe, just maybe, they routinely lie to immigration to import house-servants, demonstrating the Indian government doesn’t give a fuck about human trafficking as long as socially important people get the nearly-free housemaid they consider their right. And is trying virtually any tactic that will shut her up. So sad for them, on US soil she’s an asylee due solely to the consulate’s dumbfuck illegal actions. ---
**Author:** ![bldysabba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ecccb3/32.png) [@bldysabba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bldysabba)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-authorities-strip-search-indian-diplomat-female/676591/370 "2013-12-20T20:58:28Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > I’m curious about something. India was close to the Soviet union throughout the Cold War. Did they not pick up even a smidgen of socialism along the way? In other words, does the concept of workers’ rights mean nothing to Indians? Hahah. We picked up a lot. By the time 40 years of socialism was done with us, 42% of the country was below the poverty line. 20 years after we turned only partly into a market based economy, that number, measured the same way, has dropped to less than half that. And in fact, as I mentioned to LHOD earlier, the strict labour regulations that are still leftover from the socialist era are a significant stumbling block in reducing poverty even further. The perfect being an enemy of the good again. ---
**Author:** ![bldysabba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ecccb3/32.png) [@bldysabba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bldysabba)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-authorities-strip-search-indian-diplomat-female/676591/371 "2013-12-20T21:19:26Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > Paying someone who lives in New York $3-something dollars an hour and having them work excessive hours is mistreatment. Add to that the secret contract in which the maid apparently signed away the protections of US courts, and I can’t see how you can claim this wasn’t mistreatment. No worker of any national origin should be treated like that in the United States. My perspective is that, if with ‘mistreatment’ someone is better off than they are without it, then it isn’t mistreatment. The law may define it to be so, and I have ever acknowledged the right of the US to do so. All I ask is lets not pretend that the woman would have been better off had she not been ‘mistreated’. She would have been worse off. You are, in your questionable wisdom, taking someone who would have been worse off had ‘X’ not happened, and then calling ‘X’ mistreatment. This is a woman who earned double what she would normally make, all living expenses paid for. That it is less than some hypothetical perfect standard which was never a real option does NOT make it mistreatment. It does make it illegal, and I agree with that. All I’ve asked is that the moral outrage on behalf of the ‘victim’ be toned down. It’s stupid. Of course if it is established that the woman was treated badly, or her passport was confiscated, or there was other abuse, I’m all for some outrage. Right now, there are allegations from a person who has proven to be untrustworthy in not honouring an agreement that made her better off, and who stands to gain immensely by making precisely the sort of allegations - of abuse - that she has been making. ---
**Author:** ![bldysabba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ecccb3/32.png) [@bldysabba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bldysabba)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-authorities-strip-search-indian-diplomat-female/676591/372 "2013-12-20T21:25:44Z")
> [@PhillyGuy](#): > > No. But it is not the place of a employer who is violating your rights by paying you a sub-minimum wage to stop you from violating other US labor laws outside your 40 hours a week. And that’s what Devyani Khobragade is saying in her own defense! We haven’t yet heard what housekeeper Sangeeta Richard told the US authorities that led them to issue [T (trafficing) visas](https://boards.straightdope.com/wiki/T_visa) in this case, [as has been reported.](https://boards.straightdope.com/2013-12-18/news/45338377_1_maid-whereabouts-government) But surely the housekeeper is making a more serious charge than what the consular official already admits to. One of the conditions for her passport was that she work for the Indian government. If you’re not ok with her violating American laws, why’re you ok with her violating Indian ones? Just because they seem wrong to you? Do you notice anything off about that perspective? > [@](#): > > This gets to the real issue for me. I don’t have a tremendous problem with lying on the visa form. I don’t have a tremendous problem with paying a sub-minimum wage if you are a consular official from a developing country employing your own national. But if the Sangeeta Richard case amounts to an indentured servant running away from her master, I’m totally OK with Preet Bharara creating an international incident. I have seen absolutely no evidence that there is anything ‘indentured’ about this whole business. If the maid simply wanted to quit her job, I have seen no evidence that she could not. She could quit her job(which would require her to turn in her passport - a special category given to her only because she was accompanying an Indian diplomat), fly back to India, and go through the normal procedure for getting a passport and visa if she wanted to go and work in the US. Apparently, she wanted to short circuit the process that every other Indian has to go through. ---
**Author:** ![bldysabba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ecccb3/32.png) [@bldysabba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bldysabba)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 9:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-authorities-strip-search-indian-diplomat-female/676591/373 "2013-12-20T21:27:01Z")
> [@muldoonthief](#): > > Wait a second - the consul’s sister released a letter that the maid wrote? Who did the maid write the letter to? It says “her family” - does that mean Sangeeta’s family or Devyani’s family? Why would she write a letter to Devyani’s family? If it was to her own family, how did Devyani’s sister get the letter? This sounds like a huge setup. One easy possibility is that the letter was scanned and emailed to be printed out and given to the husband. I’m not saying it necessarily isn’t a setup. It could be. But it’s entirely possible that it isn’t. ---
**Author:** ![bldysabba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ecccb3/32.png) [@bldysabba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bldysabba)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 9:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-authorities-strip-search-indian-diplomat-female/676591/374 "2013-12-20T21:45:26Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > She may have known that. That still wouldn’t make the arrangement moral. Ha. So leaving the maid (and thus her family) with much less income than what she is voluntarily agreeing to is somehow _more_ moral with respect to the maid? It may be the more honest thing to do with respect to American laws, sure. > [@](#): > > Exactly! This woman was being made to work long hours for somewhere between half- and one-third of the wage she was legally entitled to, but if you think about it, by quitting, isn’t she just as bad as the boss who made her work under those conditions? > > No, not even close. Ha. The boss who _made_ her work for more than double the pay that she would have otherwise gotten after being approached by the maid asking for work. Why is it not important that the American legal minimum wage was never an option that was on the table? > [@](#): > > If everything happened as alleged, Khobragade got a servant she couldn’t afford by paying her an illegally low wage. That would count as a benefit. She didn’t get the servant for as long as she wanted and she got arrested, but those are both consequences of failing to pay a legal wage. I have never said that the employer did not benefit. Sitting in India, both the employer and the maid benefit from the agreement that they made. Which is why they made it. Again, do you suppose that the US embassy did not conduct a visa interview at all for the maid? That the maid didn’t know what to say if asked? She knew what she was getting into and she got into it because it was a great deal for her. It was also a great deal for the employer, of course. They were both going to be better off by breaking the law with this agreement. Once in the USA however, only the maid benefits from the deviation from their agreement that she has made, and from making accusations of abuse. It’s like a brilliant game theory example in fact, and had Khobragade ever studied any, she would have known not to have made the arrangement in which there was such a strong incentive for her maid to break it. She definitely did behave stupidly and illegally. There is no question about it, and I have never said she didn’t. ---
**Author:** ![Gopalan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/96bed5/32.png) [@Gopalan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gopalan)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 9:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-authorities-strip-search-indian-diplomat-female/676591/375 "2013-12-20T21:45:53Z")
I do not see how the maid was “blackmailing” Khobargade. Khobargade violated US law - lied on visa application and underpaid the maid. For underpayment the maid has the right, per American law, to go to Court and file a civil suit. The criminal case against Khobargade is a separate one and between the State and Khobargade. To waive her right to go to Court, the maid makes an offer of settlement to Khobargade. Indian elite establishment calls the offer of settlement blackmail and gets sundry orders from compliant courts in India - it smacks of an attempt to teach the maid a lesson. I have not heard or seen anything on this board or elsewhere about what specific Indian law the maid violated. The Indian establishment is far from dumb - so the silence is eloquent. ---
**Author:** ![bldysabba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ecccb3/32.png) [@bldysabba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bldysabba)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 9:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-authorities-strip-search-indian-diplomat-female/676591/376 "2013-12-20T21:48:46Z")
> [@Gopalan](#): > > Indian elite establishment calls the offer of settlement blackmail and gets sundry orders from compliant courts in India - it smacks of an attempt to teach the maid a lesson. I have not heard or seen anything on this board or elsewhere about what specific Indian law the maid violated. The Indian establishment is far from dumb - so the silence is eloquent. The Indian law that she has been booked under is Section 420 - Cheating. ETA - And I can absolutely see how that Indian law is violated too. They have an agreement under which the maid gets a passport and agrees to work for Khobragade. The maid then breaks the agreement, demands more money and asks for a new passport. If she wanted to break the agreement without cheating, she could have quit, and come back to India. ---
**Author:** ![Hello\_Again](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/85e7bf/32.png) [@Hello\_Again](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hello_Again)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-authorities-strip-search-indian-diplomat-female/676591/377 "2013-12-20T21:57:03Z")
> [@bldysabba](#): > > The Indian law that she has been booked under is Section 420 - Cheating. > ETA - And I can absolutely see how that Indian law is violated too. They have an agreement under which the maid gets a passport and agrees to work for Khobragade. The maid then breaks the agreement, demands more money and asks for a new passport. If she wanted to break the agreement without cheating, she could have quit, and come back to India. Under Anerican law, a contract to break the law is void ab initio - it doesn’t exist and can’t be enforced. You can’t cheat such a contract. It’s a nulliity. The US court will never ever enforce a contract to do a crime, particularly not when the crime is against the US government. How was their agreement not a contract to break the law? Or are contracts to break the law treated as valid in Indian law? ---
**Author:** ![Ruken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f475e1/32.png) [@Ruken](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ruken)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-authorities-strip-search-indian-diplomat-female/676591/378 "2013-12-20T21:57:30Z")
> [@bldysabba](#): > > The maid then […] demands more money… Isn’t she entitled to more money? ---
**Author:** ![bldysabba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ecccb3/32.png) [@bldysabba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bldysabba)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-authorities-strip-search-indian-diplomat-female/676591/379 "2013-12-20T22:03:55Z")
> [@Hello\_Again](#): > > Under Anerican law, a contract to break the law is void ab initio - it doesn’t exist and can’t be enforced. You can’t cheat such a contract. It’s a nulliity. The US court will never ever enforce a contract to do a crime, particularly not when the crime is against the US government. > > How was their agreement not a contract to break the law? Or are contracts to break the law treated as valid in Indian law? Do Indian contracts have to consider American laws? The maid can be guilty of cheating in India, and the employer in America. Everybody wins! ---
**Author:** ![bldysabba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ecccb3/32.png) [@bldysabba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bldysabba)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-authorities-strip-search-indian-diplomat-female/676591/380 "2013-12-20T22:06:36Z")
> [@Ruken](#): > > Isn’t she entitled to more money? Under Indian law, which is the context you’re taking that from, no. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-authorities-strip-search-indian-diplomat-female/676591.md?page=18) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-authorities-strip-search-indian-diplomat-female/676591.md?page=20)