# U.S. hits debt ceiling **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [May 16, 2011, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-hits-debt-ceiling/582130 "2011-05-16T19:42:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 3\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![wmfellows](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c2a13f/32.png) [@wmfellows](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wmfellows)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2011, 11:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-hits-debt-ceiling/582130/21 "2011-05-18T11:48:57Z")
> [@smiling\_bandit](#): > > Pardon me, but Greece’s problem is that it’s getting grosly overleveraged. Pretending that America will follow because we refuse to get overleveraged is quite the rhetorical feat. Greece is clearly insolvent. The USA is not. There is no “rhetorical feat” - all we need do is look at US debt levels compared to other OECD countries as a _rational fact based comparitive_ - not ideology. It is clear US is in the middle of the pack, no worse than France, Germany. If the US _ **chooses** _ not to raise more debt, that’s a choice, but there is clearly an ability to raise more and pay it down - there are plenty of historical cases. The US is nowhere near insolvent. > [@](#): > > The fact that you _can_ leverage yourself into a hole is no good reason to actually do it. And throwing around the word leverage as a scare word is not analysis either. There are perfectly good arguments for engaging in fiscal stimulus given the current economic conditions. There are reasonable arguments to forgo as well. > [@](#): > > The average contains a ton of countries with ridiculous problems. Which ones? Specifically. Really which ones. > [@](#): > > As it is, the country is in a giant fiscal mess and us evil, stupid right-wingers are the only ones who want to do something practical about it. Whatever mate, I am not a Lefty. I prefer fiscal conservatism. I am also not an ideologue. Ergo I prefer rational economic management, not management by scare words and slogans and illiteracies. Not my economy in the end, but to see the USA start to manage its affaires with all the sophistication and intelligence of Argentina, well. disappointing. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2011, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-hits-debt-ceiling/582130/22 "2011-05-18T19:52:11Z")
> [@Rune](#): > > I think the analogue is incorrect. Children have no responsibility or say in the matter of indebting the nation, and besides education represents an investment in the future which should return a profit. The people who are going to profit from a retirement fund very much have a responsibility for and choice in the matter of indebting the nation. Saving up for your own retirement by taking out loans to be paid for by your children is wrong. There should be no savings for retirement as long as the nation runs a deficit. > > Greece has started selling off state owned land, infrastructure and enterprises big time. Doesn’t the USA have stuff it can sell to cover its expenses? Are you saying that we shouldn’t honor our pension obligations to federal employees if we are running a deficit? Shit, by that analogy, we shouldn’t pay federal employees at all until we get the deficit under control. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2011, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-hits-debt-ceiling/582130/23 "2011-05-18T19:56:21Z")
We can balance the long term budget with medicare reform and tax increases. If now is not the time to raise taxes then its hardly the time to cut spending either. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/u-s-hits-debt-ceiling/582130.md?page=1)