# Uh... Iraq behind the OKC bombing? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [April 20, 2011, 7:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uh-iraq-behind-the-okc-bombing/579063 "2011-04-20T07:06:18Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 7\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2011, 4:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uh-iraq-behind-the-okc-bombing/579063/21 "2011-04-22T04:27:42Z")
> [@xtisme](#): > > What does this mean exactly? Could you be a bit more clear? > > -XT If you read post 9, Howye said it was easy to build and to pull off. I disagreed. It was a massive bomb. ---
**Author:** ![Argent\_Towers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e8c25b/32.png) [@Argent\_Towers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Argent_Towers)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2011, 4:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uh-iraq-behind-the-okc-bombing/579063/22 "2011-04-22T04:28:53Z")
Timothy McVeigh was not part of the Michigan Militia or any other militia. There is, however, ample evidence that Terry Nichols, the other conspirator in the bombing, was involved with _Muslim_ groups in the Philippines. Two of his wives were Filipino and he had ties with terrorist groups in Mindanao. Nobody ever talks about this though. It’s a forgotten element of the bombing. ---
**Author:** ![Simplicio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c37758/32.png) [@Simplicio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Simplicio)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2011, 5:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uh-iraq-behind-the-okc-bombing/579063/23 "2011-04-22T05:34:02Z")
> [@Argent\_Towers](#): > > Timothy McVeigh was not part of the Michigan Militia or any other militia. True, but his political views were pretty clearly in-line with the Militia movement, and he wrote and talked about them extensively both before and after the bombing, and during his imprisonment. If you think he was some sort of secret Islamic terrorist, then you have to believe he went to extra-ordinary lengths to make it _seem_ like he was a right-wing extremist. And even if you think that’s plausible, its pretty difficult to think of _why_ an Islamic terrorist would bother to pretend to be a right-wing nut. Usually such people _want_ people to know their motivations, there isn’t much point otherwise. > [@](#): > > There is, however, ample evidence that Terry Nichols, the other conspirator in the bombing, was involved with _Muslim_ groups in the Philippines. Two of his wives were Filipino and he had ties with terrorist groups in Mindanao. Nobody ever talks about this though. It’s a forgotten element of the bombing. According to wikipedia, his first wife was named Lana Walsh, and following the link from wikipedia, she was apparently raised on a dairy farm in Michigan. His second wife was a mail-order bride from the Phillipines. She and Nichols apparently visited her home country frequently. McVeigh’s defense lawyer apparently tried to float a story that Nichols was really making the trips to meet with an Islamic terrorist, but he appears to be the only source for that, and he talked up several different conspiracy theories while trying to defend McVeigh, so I don’t think I’d put much stock in it. And again, if Nichols was really an Islamic terrorist, its pretty bizarre that he spent the years prior to the bombing trying really hard to give people the impression that he was an anti-gov’t tax-protester. ---
**Author:** ![Argent\_Towers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e8c25b/32.png) [@Argent\_Towers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Argent_Towers)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2011, 6:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uh-iraq-behind-the-okc-bombing/579063/24 "2011-04-22T06:10:44Z")
I don’t think they were Islamic terrorists, just that there was a connection there (which is more believable than a connection to Iraq.) They were against the US government and they hated the Jews. This means they were natural allies. A lot of ignorance gets spread about McVeigh. The two biggest falsehoods were that he was a militiamen and that he acted in the name of Christ. McVeigh did take last rites on his deathbed but he was a lifelong atheist and at the time of his bombing he was _not_ affiliated in _any way_ with Christianity or any other religion. ---
**Author:** ![Simplicio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c37758/32.png) [@Simplicio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Simplicio)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2011, 6:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uh-iraq-behind-the-okc-bombing/579063/25 "2011-04-22T06:38:32Z")
> [@Argent\_Towers](#): > > I don’t think they were Islamic terrorists, just that there was a connection there (which is more believable than a connection to Iraq.) They were against the US government and they hated the Jews. This means they were natural allies. They may have been “natural allies”, but they weren’t actual allies. And even the ‘natural allies’ thing is a stretch, they were both “enemies of the US gov’t”, but that didn’t really mean the same thing to both parties: McVeigh wanted the Federal government to tax him less and not regulate guns, Al-Queda wanted the US gov’t to stay out of the Middle East. > [@](#): > > A lot of ignorance gets spread about McVeigh. The two biggest falsehoods were that he was a militiamen and that he acted in the name of Christ. McVeigh did take last rites on his deathbed but he was a lifelong atheist and at the time of his bombing he was _not_ affiliated in _any way_ with Christianity or any other religion. I agree, but the evidence McVeigh was in league with various radical Christian groups is stronger then that Nichols was nipping off to meet with Islamic terrorists. Which isn’t to say that I think McVeigh was secretly in league with radical Christians, but that both theories are equally silly. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2011, 1:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uh-iraq-behind-the-okc-bombing/579063/26 "2011-04-22T13:23:45Z")
> [@gonzomax](#): > > If you read post 9, Howye said it was easy to build and to pull off. I disagreed. It was a massive bomb. Doesn’t seem all that hard to me. From [Wiki](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oklahoma_City_bombing): > [@](#): > > Building the bomb > > On April 17–18, 1995, McVeigh and Nichols removed their supplies from their storage unit in Herington, Kansas, where Nichols lived. They loaded 108 bags of high-grade ammonium nitrate fertilizer weighing 50 pounds (23 kg) each, three 55-U.S.-gallon (46 imp gal; 210 l) drums of liquid nitromethane, several crates of explosive Tovex, seventeen bags of ANFO, and spools of shock tube and cannon fuse into a Ryder rental truck.[52] The two then drove to Geary County State Lake, where they nailed boards onto the floor of the truck to hold the thirteen barrels in place and mixed the chemicals using plastic buckets and a bathroom scale.[53] Each filled barrel weighed nearly 500 pounds (230 kg).[54] McVeigh added more explosives to the driver’s side of the cargo bay, which he could ignite (killing himself in the process) at close range with his Glock 21 pistol in case the primary fuses failed.[55] During McVeigh’s trial, Lori Fortier (the wife of Michael Fortier) stated that McVeigh claimed to have arranged the barrels in order to form a shaped charge.[42] This was achieved by tamping the aluminum side panel of the truck with bags of ammonium nitrate fertilizer to direct the blast laterally towards the building.[56] Specifically, McVeigh arranged the barrels in the shape of a backwards J; he said later that for pure destructive power, he would have put the barrels on the side of the cargo bay closest to the Murrah Building; however, such an unevenly distributed 7,000-pound (3,200 kg) load might have broken an axle, flipped the truck over, or at least caused it to lean to one side, which could have drawn attention.[54] > > McVeigh then added a dual-fuse ignition system accessible from the truck’s front cab. He drilled two holes in the cab of the truck under the seat, while two holes were also drilled in the body of the truck. One green cannon fuse was run through each hole into the cab. These time-delayed fuses led from the cab of the truck, through plastic fish-tank tubing conduit, to two sets of non-electric blasting caps.[54] The tubing was painted yellow to blend in with the truck’s livery, and duct-taped in place to the wall to make them harder to disable by yanking from the outside.[54] The fuses were set up to initiate, through shock tubes, the 350 pounds (160 kg) of Tovex Blastrite Gel “sausages”, which would in turn set off the configuration of barrels. Of the thirteen filled barrels, nine contained ammonium nitrate and nitromethane, and four contained a mixture of the fertilizer and about 4-U.S.-gallon (3.3 imp gal; 15 L) of diesel fuel.[54] Additional materials and tools used for manufacturing the bomb were left in the truck to be destroyed in the blast.[54] After finishing the truck bomb, the two men separated; Nichols returned home to Herington and McVeigh with the truck to Junction City. You couldn’t whip it up in a few minutes, but for two men who were reasonably fit I don’t think it’s all that big of a job. Would have been a lot of carrying and grunt work, sure. -XT ---
**Author:** ![Derleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Derleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Derleth)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2011, 1:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uh-iraq-behind-the-okc-bombing/579063/27 "2011-04-22T13:37:28Z")
> [@Steve\_MB](#): > > You need the [official goggles](http://i163.photobucket.com/albums/t291/smbrinich/Humor/ConspiraSeeGoggles.png) to see the proof… And if you don’t put them on, we got an alley and a whole lot of time to fill. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uh-iraq-behind-the-okc-bombing/579063.md?page=1)