# UK: If the Queen were to commit a crime could she be prosecuted? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [May 11, 2008, 11:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uk-if-the-queen-were-to-commit-a-crime-could-she-be-prosecuted/448907 "2008-05-11T11:01:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Mr\_Shine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mr_shine/32/464_2.png) [@Mr\_Shine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr_Shine)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2008, 11:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uk-if-the-queen-were-to-commit-a-crime-could-she-be-prosecuted/448907/1 "2008-05-11T11:01:26Z")
Of course ultimately Parliament has the ability to take matters into their own hands, like with Charles I, but without such measures could the Queen be prosecuted for committing a crime? ---
**Author:** ![Szlater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/90ced4/32.png) [@Szlater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Szlater)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2008, 11:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uk-if-the-queen-were-to-commit-a-crime-could-she-be-prosecuted/448907/2 "2008-05-11T11:07:32Z")
No. The Crown is immune from prosecution and conviction and cannot even be compelled to testify in court. What would happen is that Parliament would have to step in and pass an Act either removing her from the Throne or abolishing the monarchy altogether, she could then be prosecuted. ---
**Author:** ![chowder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/977dab/32.png) [@chowder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chowder)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2008, 11:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uk-if-the-queen-were-to-commit-a-crime-could-she-be-prosecuted/448907/3 "2008-05-11T11:37:32Z")
If Oliver Cromwell II appeared on the scene, if there was another civil war between Royalists and Republicans, if the Republicans won then I guess then Brenda could be put on trial for whatever crime she was alleged to have committed. Leastways I think she could. ---
**Author:** ![Alive\_At\_Both\_Ends](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/73ab20/32.png) [@Alive\_At\_Both\_Ends](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alive_At_Both_Ends)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2008, 11:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uk-if-the-queen-were-to-commit-a-crime-could-she-be-prosecuted/448907/4 "2008-05-11T11:45:43Z")
Prosecutions are carried out by the Crown (the actual prosecution is delegated, of course). That’s why criminal cases are referred to in legalese as, for example, R. v Smith. (R. is _Regina_, that is, the Queen.) If she were not immune, and she committed a crime, the Queen would be in the position of having to prosecute herself. ---
**Author:** ![aldiboronti](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc348/32.png) [@aldiboronti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aldiboronti)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2008, 12:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uk-if-the-queen-were-to-commit-a-crime-could-she-be-prosecuted/448907/5 "2008-05-11T12:10:04Z")
The way the Republicans under Cromwell did it (and the revolutionaries in France) was to depose the monarch first, then try him as a normal citizen. Thus Charles I was tried under the name Charles Stuart and Louis XVI under the name of Citizen Capet. (Marie Antoinette was executed as the Widow Capet). ---
**Author:** ![Szlater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/90ced4/32.png) [@Szlater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Szlater)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2008, 1:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uk-if-the-queen-were-to-commit-a-crime-could-she-be-prosecuted/448907/6 "2008-05-11T13:28:19Z")
[QUOTE=aldiboronti] The way the Republicans under Cromwell [/QUOTE] Is there a difference between the terms “Republican” and “Parliamentarian”? The Commonwealth of England was, but The Protectorate wasn’t a republic, was it? ---
**Author:** ![Lust4Life](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ecc23a/32.png) [@Lust4Life](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lust4Life)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2008, 1:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uk-if-the-queen-were-to-commit-a-crime-could-she-be-prosecuted/448907/7 "2008-05-11T13:45:13Z")
Slightly off topic,Princess Anne,the Queens daughter was prosecuted for speeding and I believe having an unruly dog. ---
**Author:** ![drhess](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/94ad74/32.png) [@drhess](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drhess)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2008, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uk-if-the-queen-were-to-commit-a-crime-could-she-be-prosecuted/448907/8 "2008-05-11T15:54:19Z")
I hear she’s the head of an international drug cartel. ---
**Author:** ![Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2008, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uk-if-the-queen-were-to-commit-a-crime-could-she-be-prosecuted/448907/9 "2008-05-11T16:17:26Z")
[QUOTE=Szlater] What would happen is that Parliament would have to step in and pass an Act either removing her from the Throne or abolishing the monarchy altogether, she could then be prosecuted. [/QUOTE] Assuming that Liz did commit a crime and was deposed by Parliament, does UK law allow for prosecutions for crimes that were committed while she was immune from criminal charges? I’m trying to think of an equivalent situation in the US but (aside from very limited immunity for members of Congress) there isn’t any immunity from prosecution for government officials here that I’m aware of. We do bar ex post facto laws on the federal level but presumably we’re talking about Liz doing something that’s already illegal. ---
**Author:** ![chowder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/977dab/32.png) [@chowder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chowder)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2008, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uk-if-the-queen-were-to-commit-a-crime-could-she-be-prosecuted/448907/10 "2008-05-11T17:58:05Z")
[QUOTE=Szlater] Is there a difference between the terms “Republican” and “Parliamentarian”? The Commonwealth of England was, but The Protectorate wasn’t a republic, was it? [/QUOTE] Following Cromwells appointment to Lord Protector we became a republic. Heil Ollie! ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2008, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uk-if-the-queen-were-to-commit-a-crime-could-she-be-prosecuted/448907/11 "2008-05-11T22:43:54Z")
[QUOTE=drhess] I hear she’s the head of an international drug cartel. [/QUOTE] I always love that one. Like the Queen is sitting in Buckingham Palace, personally working out distribution and collection. [phony Queen voice] “That’s too bloody bad, Carlos. You shall send the one hundred kilos we agreed upon, or we shall sent out the Royal Marines!” [/pqv] ---
**Author:** ![Pushkin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ee59a6/32.png) [@Pushkin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pushkin)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2008, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uk-if-the-queen-were-to-commit-a-crime-could-she-be-prosecuted/448907/12 "2008-05-11T23:21:57Z")
[QUOTE=Alive At Both Ends] If she were not immune, and she committed a crime, the Queen would be in the position of having to prosecute herself. [/QUOTE] And if imprisoned, would she be “detained at her own pleasure”? ---
**Author:** ![APB](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/8e8cbc/32.png) [@APB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/APB)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2008, 9:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uk-if-the-queen-were-to-commit-a-crime-could-she-be-prosecuted/448907/13 "2008-05-12T09:49:03Z")
[QUOTE=aldiboronti] The way the Republicans under Cromwell did it (and the revolutionaries in France) was to depose the monarch first, then try him as a normal citizen. Thus Charles I was tried under the name Charles Stuart and Louis XVI under the name of Citizen Capet. (Marie Antoinette was executed as the Widow Capet). [/QUOTE] Whereas Louis XVI had indeed been deposed before being tried, Charles I was still king up until the moment of his execution. The [ordinance creating the High Court of Justice](http://www.british-history.ac.uk/report.aspx?compid=56301) called him ‘Charles Stuart, the now King of England’, he was referred to as king during the trial and he was described as ‘Charles Steuart Kinge of England’ in the [death warrant](http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/pathways/citizenship/rise_parliament/making_history_rise.htm). Indeed, part of the point being made by at least some of the regicides was that he could be executed by them even although he was the king. Not that this was necessarily a valid legal argument, then or now. [QUOTE=chowder] Following Cromwells appointment to Lord Protector we became a republic. [/QUOTE] No, England became a republic in 1649, either following Charles I’s execution on 30 January or the abolition of the office of king on 17 March. (Parliament itself was a bit vague on this precise point.) Cromwell did not become lord protector until 16 December 1653. Hence **Szlater** ’s question. Whether the Protectorate is considered a republic depends. On semantics, mostly. ---
**Author:** ![chowder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/977dab/32.png) [@chowder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chowder)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2008, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uk-if-the-queen-were-to-commit-a-crime-could-she-be-prosecuted/448907/14 "2008-05-12T15:40:31Z")
Whatever, it’s still “Heil Ollie” ---
**Author:** ![Apollyon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/apollyon/32/4238_2.png) [@Apollyon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Apollyon)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2008, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uk-if-the-queen-were-to-commit-a-crime-could-she-be-prosecuted/448907/15 "2008-05-12T22:32:10Z")
[QUOTE=drhess] I hear she’s the head of an international drug cartel. [/QUOTE] No, no… she’s the head of a religious cult and has a private army. (I keed, I keed). 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Sunspace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunspace/32/1250_2.png) [@Sunspace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunspace)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2008, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uk-if-the-queen-were-to-commit-a-crime-could-she-be-prosecuted/448907/16 "2008-05-12T22:34:38Z")
[QUOTE=Apollyon] No, no… she’s the head of a religious cult and has a private army. (I keed, I keed). 🙂 [/QUOTE] And she’s got her face on my money! :eek: ---
**Author:** ![Szlater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/90ced4/32.png) [@Szlater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Szlater)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2008, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uk-if-the-queen-were-to-commit-a-crime-could-she-be-prosecuted/448907/17 "2008-05-12T22:36:20Z")
[QUOTE=Apollyon] No, no… she’s the head of a religious cult and has a private army. (I keed, I keed). 🙂 [/QUOTE] You kid now, but you’ll not be laughing when the men in black from NZSIS drag you off! ---
**Author:** ![Apollyon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/apollyon/32/4238_2.png) [@Apollyon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Apollyon)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2008, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uk-if-the-queen-were-to-commit-a-crime-could-she-be-prosecuted/448907/18 "2008-05-12T23:43:50Z")
[QUOTE=Szlater] You kid now, but you’ll not be laughing when the men in black from NZSIS drag you off! [/QUOTE] Have you read about our SIS?! Honestly, least of my concerns. 🙂 Seriously though, I rather like NZ having a distant monarch who is my Queen, and am not terribly in favour of steps towards republic… can’t even get a knighthood here anymore. ☹ (Odd little aside: an ex-UK friend of mine was bemused upon becoming a Kiwi that he was taking an oath of allegiance to the Queen of New Zealand). ---
**Author:** ![Can\_Handle\_the\_Truth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Can\_Handle\_the\_Truth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Can_Handle_the_Truth)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2008, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uk-if-the-queen-were-to-commit-a-crime-could-she-be-prosecuted/448907/19 "2008-05-13T00:09:04Z")
[QUOTE=chowder] If Oliver Cromwell II appeared on the scene, if there was another civil war between Royalists and Republicans, if the Republicans won then I guess then Brenda could be put on trial for whatever crime she was alleged to have committed. Leastways I think she could. [/QUOTE] Who’s Brenda? ---
**Author:** ![Szlater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/90ced4/32.png) [@Szlater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Szlater)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2008, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uk-if-the-queen-were-to-commit-a-crime-could-she-be-prosecuted/448907/20 "2008-05-13T00:15:30Z")
[QUOTE=Can Handle the Truth] Who’s Brenda? [/QUOTE] “Brenda” is how **chowder** refers to Queen Elizabeth II. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uk-if-the-queen-were-to-commit-a-crime-could-she-be-prosecuted/448907.md?page=2)