# Um...I think you've gotten that saying wrong **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [August 31, 2010, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/um-i-think-youve-gotten-that-saying-wrong/552130 "2010-08-31T14:15:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Tethered\_Kite](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a5b964/32.png) [@Tethered\_Kite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tethered_Kite)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2010, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/um-i-think-youve-gotten-that-saying-wrong/552130/41 "2010-08-31T18:51:44Z")
It has become common usage to tell someone when you want them to sign something, “Put your John Henry on that.” My understanding is that it should be “John Hancock” after one of the signers of the Constitution. It’s questionable that John Henry could write his name in his historical context. I had a friend who consistently said, “That took the sails out of his wind.” One day I finally commented on it and she told me it was her little joke. I thought about it a moment and then got it. ---
**Author:** ![corkboard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e9bcb4/32.png) [@corkboard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/corkboard)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2010, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/um-i-think-youve-gotten-that-saying-wrong/552130/42 "2010-08-31T18:52:03Z")
I work with a couple people who always say that they’ll make sure we’re in _agreeance_ with [the terms and conditions of our contracts]. Agreeance? Really? Also, our division is a subsidiary of a larger company. Several of my coworkers, including the guy who does all of the outgoing messages for our voicemail, pronounce it _subsiderary_. Way to put our best foot forward, guys. ---
**Author:** ![elfkin477](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/a9a28c/32.png) [@elfkin477](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elfkin477)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2010, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/um-i-think-youve-gotten-that-saying-wrong/552130/43 "2010-08-31T18:52:55Z")
> [@Rafe\_Hollister](#): > > > [@Cliffy](#): > > > > Yeah, hone in is fine. > > > > A perfectly rational course of action of you don’t have kids. But if you do, for gods sake, start correcting her again, or she’ll infect _them_. > > > > –Cliffy > > I make sure the kids are aware of the proper pronunciation. She is a lost cause, however. > > She had a hearing problem that was surgically corrected when she was 8. She’s now 42 and still blames the hearing problem for her mispronunciation and poor spelling. I’ve told her she’s full of shit, because by that reasoning a deaf person wouldn’t be able to spell anything. Uh…the deaf are legendarily bad spellers. There are even books on the subject like [this one](http://www.springerlink.com/content/jx19543x2411j053/). ---
**Author:** ![palindromemordnilap](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/db5fbb/32.png) [@palindromemordnilap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/palindromemordnilap)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2010, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/um-i-think-youve-gotten-that-saying-wrong/552130/44 "2010-08-31T18:54:00Z")
I believe that “carrot-and-stick” used to mean one thing but has been misused so much that it now means something else. The original meaning was akin to “a promised reward that is always out of reach”. The owner of a mule tied a carrot to a stick and dangled it in front of the mule to get it to move forward. As the mule moved forward so did the stick and carrot. Of course, the term now just means “reward and punishment”. It’s possible that this usage of carrot and stick arose from something other than the scenario I describe, but I doubt it. I can think of a lot of nice incentives for good behavior but a carrot isn’t one of them. And there are plenty of words that mean “a stick for punishment,” such as “crop” and “club” and “switch”. ---
**Author:** ![Zeldar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/b77776/32.png) [@Zeldar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeldar)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2010, 7:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/um-i-think-youve-gotten-that-saying-wrong/552130/45 "2010-08-31T19:13:10Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > > [@](#): > > > > And I have shared before how a buddy I used to play chess with would respond to a tricky move or a trap of mine by saying “that’s not cultured” when I’m pretty sure he meant to say “that’s not kosher.” > > Sounds like he’s mixing up a translation of the Russian _Nyekulturny_ insult (“Uncultured!”) with “Not Kosher!”. Unless he’s commenting that he thinks no classy person would make a move like the one you did. It would be great if I could ascribe him that much couth. > [@Sailboat](#): > > Well, there’s a Russian term, nekulturny, an insult which means “uncultured” or “bad mannered.” And the Russians love chess. > > cite > > > [@](#): > > > > One of the worst insults you can hurl at a Russian is that he is nekulturny (uncultured). > > Maybe he picked it up from something he read or saw about Russian chess? > > edit: heh. You nailed it with the edit. His biggest brag was that he had never read a chess book. Everybody he played had no problem believing that, since unorthodox was a gentle way of describing his play. Thing was, he was a lot like the guy who kept playing chess with his dog until one day a friend asked if the dog was any good. The player responded, “Not really. I’ll beat him four out of five times.” ---
**Author:** ![Sauron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce7236/32.png) [@Sauron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sauron)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2010, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/um-i-think-youve-gotten-that-saying-wrong/552130/46 "2010-08-31T19:33:36Z")
Couple of guys on a sports message board I frequent have a derogatory name for players who think they’re too good to do mundane tasks, or the little things that help a team win. They call them “pre-Madonnas.” I’ve given up trying to make them see the error of their ways. ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2010, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/um-i-think-youve-gotten-that-saying-wrong/552130/47 "2010-08-31T19:53:28Z")
> [@palindromemordnilap](#): > > I believe that “carrot-and-stick” used to mean one thing but has been misused so much that it now means something else. > > The original meaning was akin to “a promised reward that is always out of reach”. The owner of a mule tied a carrot to a stick and dangled it in front of the mule to get it to move forward. As the mule moved forward so did the stick and carrot. > > Of course, the term now just means “reward and punishment”. It’s possible that this usage of carrot and stick arose from something other than the scenario I describe, but I doubt it. I can think of a lot of nice incentives for good behavior but a carrot isn’t one of them. And there are plenty of words that mean “a stick for punishment,” such as “crop” and “club” and “switch”. Really, cite? ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2010, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/um-i-think-youve-gotten-that-saying-wrong/552130/48 "2010-08-31T19:53:59Z")
> [@Tethered\_Kite](#): > > It has become common usage to tell someone when you want them to sign something, “Put your John Henry on that.” My understanding is that it should be “John Hancock” after one of the signers of the Constitution. It’s questionable that John Henry could write his name in his historical context. Yeah, putting your John Henry on something should mean hitting it with a hammer. 😛 Is that really a common one now? ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2010, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/um-i-think-youve-gotten-that-saying-wrong/552130/49 "2010-08-31T19:56:16Z")
> [@spark240](#): > > Yeah, putting your John Henry on something should mean hitting it with a hammer. 😛 Is that like a ‘wax job’? (It blows the wax out of your ears! :eek: ) ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2010, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/um-i-think-youve-gotten-that-saying-wrong/552130/50 "2010-08-31T19:57:37Z")
> [@](#): > > It has become common usage to tell someone when you want them to sign something, “Put your John Henry on that.” I don’t doubt you (and it doesn’t surprise me), but I’ve never heard this. Everyone who’s said it to me correctly says “John Hancock.” ---
**Author:** ![Shadowfyre](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shadowfyre/32/9972_2.png) [@Shadowfyre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shadowfyre)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2010, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/um-i-think-youve-gotten-that-saying-wrong/552130/51 "2010-08-31T19:58:43Z")
> [@Sailboat](#): > > > [@Enright3](#): > > > > "\*\*hone in \*\*1. To move or advance toward a target or goal: The missile honed in on the military installation. 2. To direct one’s attention; focus. The lawyer honed in on the gist of the plaintiff’s testimony.. . . . [Hone in, alteration of home in.] > > (The American Heritage Dictionary of the English Language. Houghton Mifflin, 2006) > > But that’s just plain wrong. Maybe they’re describing some level of popular usage they arbitrarily accept as “now it has changed,” but that usage _began_ wrong and IMHO _remains_ wrong. > > It’s also stupid. > > You’ll note even those silly descriptivists admit it’s an “alteration of home in.” A missile (as used by the military) _homes_ in, **it goes _home_** , it seeks a _goal_. No _sharpening_ is involved except as retroactive justification by someone caught saying it wrong. > > It’s always been “homed in” in the past, and that makes sense, and still has utility. “Honed in” is only used by those who don’t think about the origin of the term and only defended by those who are caught making the mistake. I added the bolding. First off, let me say that I agree that “homing in” is the proper term, like all the spies that plant homing signals on their enemies cars to find out where they go. However, after thinking about it while reading **Sailboat’s** post, “home” seems like a bad term in both instances. I’ve always thought that “home” is where someone is from. The only time I’ve heard of “home” being a goal is in baseball, where home plate is where you started and hope to get to again after rounding the bases. And a missile that goes back to where it started isn’t a very effective missile. ---
**Author:** ![congodwarf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e36b37/32.png) [@congodwarf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/congodwarf)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2010, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/um-i-think-youve-gotten-that-saying-wrong/552130/52 "2010-08-31T20:12:01Z")
> [@Tethered\_Kite](#): > > My understanding is that it should be “John Hancock” after one of the signers of the **Constitution**. psst…Declaration of Independence ---
**Author:** ![Nzinga\_Seated](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/b5ac83/32.png) [@Nzinga\_Seated](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nzinga_Seated)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2010, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/um-i-think-youve-gotten-that-saying-wrong/552130/53 "2010-08-31T20:32:35Z")
> [@treis](#): > > > [@palindromemordnilap](#): > > > > I believe that “carrot-and-stick” used to mean one thing but has been misused so much that it now means something else. > > > > The original meaning was akin to “a promised reward that is always out of reach”. The owner of a mule tied a carrot to a stick and dangled it in front of the mule to get it to move forward. As the mule moved forward so did the stick and carrot. > > > > Of course, the term now just means “reward and punishment”. It’s possible that this usage of carrot and stick arose from something other than the scenario I describe, but I doubt it. I can think of a lot of nice incentives for good behavior but a carrot isn’t one of them. And there are plenty of words that mean “a stick for punishment,” such as “crop” and “club” and “switch”. > > Really, cite? I don’t have a cite, but that is what I have always thought it meant. I actually didn’t even understand it the other way (in other words, when people used it the other way, I didn’t understand that stick = beating…I just thought they were misunderstanding the original usage). I seem to dimly remember an old fable or something about a mule with a stick and carrot tied in front of him. I’m not at all sure, though. ( I did find [this cartoon](http://www.cartoonstock.com/lowres/cga0172l.jpg)on google images) ---
**Author:** ![The\_Hamster\_King](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8edcca/32.png) [@The\_Hamster\_King](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Hamster_King)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2010, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/um-i-think-youve-gotten-that-saying-wrong/552130/54 "2010-08-31T20:38:33Z")
“Hone in on” drives me crazy. As does “Let’s take a different tact.” No, no, no! “Take a different TACK!” It’s a sailing metaphor. I also hate it when people call a lectern a “podium”, but that’s a lost cause … . ---
**Author:** ![Khadaji](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Khadaji](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Khadaji)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2010, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/um-i-think-youve-gotten-that-saying-wrong/552130/55 "2010-08-31T20:39:27Z")
I have a friend who mangles phrases on purpose all the time. He claims I’m the only one who ever notices, but I believe I’m the only one who doesn’t mind calling him on it. Two of his favorites: We’ll burn that bridge when we come to it. Six of one a dime a dozen. ---
**Author:** ![Zeldar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/b77776/32.png) [@Zeldar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeldar)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2010, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/um-i-think-youve-gotten-that-saying-wrong/552130/56 "2010-08-31T20:47:57Z")
> [@Khadaji](#): > > … We’ll burn that bridge when we come to it. It had quit being funny a long time ago, but I can’t refrain from deliberate botching of this one by saying, “We can drive off that bridge when we come to it.” Others I botch on purpose: A bargain at half the price. A fool and his gold weigh more than just the gold. It is better to sit idle than to do nothing at all. Little things come in small packages. In numbers there is quantity. ---
**Author:** ![FairyChatMom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fairychatmom/32/21825_2.png) [@FairyChatMom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FairyChatMom)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2010, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/um-i-think-youve-gotten-that-saying-wrong/552130/57 "2010-08-31T20:50:07Z")
My dad mixed a couple and came up with a gem once. He was leading a school fund-raising effort and he wanted to let everyone know that if we came up a little short, the principal had a plan to help us hit our goal. I think he meant to say “Ace up his sleeve” but he was also thinking “Ace in the hole.” He wound up declaring that the principal had an “ace up his hole.” :eek: 😃 Lucky for everyone, we met the goal and didn’t need that ace. ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2010, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/um-i-think-youve-gotten-that-saying-wrong/552130/58 "2010-08-31T20:53:17Z")
One deliberate botch I like (not mine) is “Seven of one, half-dozen of the other,” which makes the point that two choices are rarely _exactly_ equivalent. The keys to a good botch are that (a) it’s clear the speaker understands what he’s saying, and is _referring_ to the established phrase rather than corrupting it, and (b) the revision itself carries an additional relevant meaning. ---
**Author:** ![Nzinga\_Seated](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/b5ac83/32.png) [@Nzinga\_Seated](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nzinga_Seated)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2010, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/um-i-think-youve-gotten-that-saying-wrong/552130/59 "2010-08-31T20:54:30Z")
> [@The\_Hamster\_King](#): > > I also hate it when people call a lectern a “podium”, but that’s a lost cause … . Aaand, ignorance fought. Ah. Feels good to shake off a bit of ugly ignorance. Refreshing really. [Lectern.](http://www.indiana.edu/~ucstm/images/floor_lectern.jpg) [Podium.](http://photos.igougo.com/images/p197218-Sydney-2000_Olympic_Medal_Podium.jpg) Had it fucked up my whole life. I’m one of those folks that believes if the language shifts and evolves, and people are still making themselves plainly understood, then it’s all good. I don’t dare correct them, and I don’t flinch when they use the ‘wrong’ words. But, secretly, I like to know and use the so-called ‘right’ word or phrase. ---
**Author:** ![Machine\_Elf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/82dd89/32.png) [@Machine\_Elf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machine_Elf)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2010, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/um-i-think-youve-gotten-that-saying-wrong/552130/60 "2010-08-31T20:58:15Z")
> [@Khadaji](#): > > We’ll burn that bridge when we come to it. Ted Kennedy: “We’ll drive off that bridge when we come to it.” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/um-i-think-youve-gotten-that-saying-wrong/552130.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/um-i-think-youve-gotten-that-saying-wrong/552130.md?page=4)