# Unarmed Combat Against a Wild Animal **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [August 11, 2004, 11:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unarmed-combat-against-a-wild-animal/259338 "2004-08-11T11:28:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![P\_T](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a587f6/32.png) [@P\_T](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/P_T)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2004, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unarmed-combat-against-a-wild-animal/259338/21 "2004-08-11T20:38:48Z")
> [@Thaumaturge](#): > > This isn’t true. Just because a housecat can jump 5 times it’s hight, doesn’t mean that a human sized cat can. In general, an object’s volume and mass go up as the cube of it’s size, but it’s strength and area only go up as the square. > > For example, a human sized ant couldn’t even move, but an ant sized ant can lift many times its own weight. > > Big cats have a different strength advantage besides their on average better toned muscles. Their arms are leveraged for strength, like a monkey’s, as opposed to a human who is leveraged for speed. The muscles attach farther from the joints, which gives them more torque. Human muscles evolved to throw things, by having the muscles attach closer to the joints for less torque but more speed. > [@](#): > > When it comes to the long-jump and the high-jump events, cats are back in the winner’s circle. The same pliable muscles and flexible spine that make them great sprinters allow them to jump vertically or horizontally up to six times their own body length. Wildcats need a well-developed ability to pounce in order to survive, especially those solitary hunters that base successful dining on an element of surprise. Tigers can leap more than 30 feet through the air onto unsuspecting prey. With its exceptionally long hind legs, the puma effortlessly jumps distances of more than 40 feet. Even the relatively short-legged lion, a pack hunter without much need for jumping, can spring as far as four-and-a-half times the length of its body, i.e., some 40 feet. Humans measure in at the low end of the big-cat scale. The average person can barely jump twice his or her body length. [Link](http://animal.discovery.com/guides/cats/behavior/jumping.html) Ok, it’s not straight up, but it’s still alot more than a human can do. ---
**Author:** ![TheLoadedDog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/35a633/32.png) [@TheLoadedDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TheLoadedDog)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2004, 11:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unarmed-combat-against-a-wild-animal/259338/22 "2004-08-11T23:42:02Z")
I wouldn’t want to get into a blue with even a _domestic_ cat. I’d probably win that one, but if the cat was scared, angry, or otherwise pumping on adrenaline, I wager I’d come away looking like a barber pole. Any sort of wild cat coming at you with intent to do you harm would (if you even saw it coming) be a high speed blur of toned muscular limbs, slashing claws, and sharp teeth. A mountain cat leaping at me, biting my face, slashing my neck, and kick-slashing my abdomen with its incredibly powerful hind legs? And all before I had a chance to say, “Oooh shi…”? No thanks. I’d rather take my chances with a drunken biker. ---
**Author:** ![Duckster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/duckster/32/1244_2.png) [@Duckster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duckster)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2004, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unarmed-combat-against-a-wild-animal/259338/23 "2004-08-11T23:46:49Z")
> [@bienville](#): > > O.K. O.K. O.K. but the mountain lion attacks _do happen_ every once in a while. What are my chances as a 5’7" 155lb male of kicking some major mountain lion ass? I take it you’ve never been around an angry average house cat? A angry house cat can kick your ass. A mountain lion can do much worse. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2004, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unarmed-combat-against-a-wild-animal/259338/24 "2004-08-12T00:07:45Z")
Moron story #2: I’m talking to this guy who is new to the state. He tells me he’s going to Kodiak with his wife to “camp in the woods”. Being a friendly type, I ask him “You do know that Kodiak has the highest bear density per square mile in the world, right?” “Yeah, no problem, I’ve got a .44 mag.” ::disbelieving stare:: “Hey, if a bear jumps on my back, I’ll just point the pistol over my shoulder and shoot him in the fuckin’ head!” “Good plan!” ::walks away, shaking head:: ---
**Author:** ![Laughing\_Lagomorph](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/6bbea6/32.png) [@Laughing\_Lagomorph](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Laughing_Lagomorph)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2004, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unarmed-combat-against-a-wild-animal/259338/25 "2004-08-12T00:15:47Z")
> [@bienville](#): > > …What are my chances as a 5’7" 155lb male of kicking some major mountain lion ass? Huh. You and I are exactly the same size and weight! **Chefguy** , did they ever find the bodies? ---
**Author:** ![Carnac\_the\_Magnificent](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ccd318/32.png) [@Carnac\_the\_Magnificent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Carnac_the_Magnificent)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2004, 12:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unarmed-combat-against-a-wild-animal/259338/26 "2004-08-12T00:24:24Z")
> [@TheLoadedDog](#): > > Any sort of wild cat coming at you with intent to do you harm would (if you even saw it coming) be a high speed blur of toned muscular limbs, slashing claws, and sharp teeth. Yep, this is the problem. The cat has a huge advantage in speed, strength, stealth, ferocity, and killing experience. The speed differential alone would be amazing. It would look like you’re in slow motion. You would have no chance at all of landing a hard blow and any blow you landed, the cat could easily absorb and counterattack with devastating slashes. Unless this is a competition to run calculations on an Excel spreadsheet, an aggressive cat will win 1,000 out of 1,000. ---
**Author:** ![Ilsa\_Lund](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/a6a055/32.png) [@Ilsa\_Lund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ilsa_Lund)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2004, 12:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unarmed-combat-against-a-wild-animal/259338/27 "2004-08-12T00:50:05Z")
> [@Chefguy](#): > > Moron story #2: > > I’m talking to this guy who is new to the state. He tells me he’s going to Kodiak with his wife to “camp in the woods”. Being a friendly type, I ask him “You do know that Kodiak has the highest bear density per square mile in the world, right?” > > “Yeah, no problem, I’ve got a .44 mag.” > > ::disbelieving stare:: > > “Hey, if a bear jumps on my back, I’ll just point the pistol over my shoulder and shoot him in the fuckin’ head!” > > “Good plan!” ::walks away, shaking head:: You obviously weren’t feeling too friendly, otherwise you would have advised him to file the front sight of his gun.😃 ---
**Author:** ![rburget](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/73ab20/32.png) [@rburget](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rburget)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2004, 12:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unarmed-combat-against-a-wild-animal/259338/28 "2004-08-12T00:51:29Z")
I would go with the bluff move if needed. Cats are generally solitary hunters and will avoid the risk of injury unless they are really hungry. I would avoid backing one into a corner, though. When they are upset or frightened and fighting for survival, things can go bad quickly. I had to tell the vet assistant to dump my cat out of his carrier instead of sticking her hand in to pull him out. [Here](http://fvjohnson.typepad.com/f...y.wmv) is some video of an officer with an orange tomcat that did not like being on a leash. Here is some footage of a human versus a [Big Cat](http://www.serveroptions.com/humor/thecat.mpg) Some humans were injured during the production of these videos. ---
**Author:** ![rburget](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/73ab20/32.png) [@rburget](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rburget)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2004, 12:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unarmed-combat-against-a-wild-animal/259338/29 "2004-08-12T00:58:23Z")
Sorry bad link above. [Here](http://fvjohnson.typepad.com/freds_blog/files/pinkey.wmv) is a better link to the orange tomcat that did not like being on a leash. ---
**Author:** ![Zsofia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/7bcc69/32.png) [@Zsofia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zsofia)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2004, 1:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unarmed-combat-against-a-wild-animal/259338/30 "2004-08-12T01:29:39Z")
I’d like to point out that the one with the orange domestic cat had a guy who clearly had some experience with pissed off animals, knew better than to grab the cat, and still was screaming like a little girl at the end of the clip. (Can’t say I blame him.) Of course, the instructive part is to watch the cat whipping itself through the air just because it dosen’t like the leash. Picture the same thing on a much bigger, deadlier animal. “Oh, mommy, let’s adopt _that_ one! It’s animal of the week!” ---
**Author:** ![bughunter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/aeb1de/32.png) [@bughunter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bughunter)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2004, 1:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unarmed-combat-against-a-wild-animal/259338/31 "2004-08-12T01:43:35Z")
> [@rburget](#): > > [Here](http://fvjohnson.typepad.com/freds_blog/files/pinkey.wmv) > is some video of an officer with an orange tomcat that did not like being on a leash. _Pinky!_ (If I was a girl, I’d be squealing…) Pinky the Cat is my _all time favorite_ animal Funniest Home Video. I laugh so hard my stomach hurts every time I see it. And I have a 22-lb tomcat at home with a very similar disposion to that jaguar. If he decides he’s going to tear you a new one, you better be ready, and you better be quick, cause otherwise he’s gonna be done and you’re gonna be bleeding before you even know it. And if you’re gonna take him on, you gotta be first, too. If you don’t get him by the scruff of the neck before he goes into fully spun up Tazmanian Devil Mode, you aren’t getting a hand on him without losing some blood. I once decided it would be possible to get him out from under a bed by reaching in, grabbing a leg, and pulling. I still have the scars. However, the worst laceration I’ve ever gotten from a cat was not from a large Tom, but from a vicious little 7 lb lass. Her little claws were like razors, and I tried to block a swipe with my hand… she cut my hand wide open. :eek: ---
**Author:** ![TheLoadedDog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/35a633/32.png) [@TheLoadedDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TheLoadedDog)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2004, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unarmed-combat-against-a-wild-animal/259338/32 "2004-08-12T02:39:20Z")
> [@bughunter](#): > > And I have a 22-lb tomcat at home with a very similar disposion to that jaguar. If he decides he’s going to tear you a new one, you better be ready, and you better be quick, cause otherwise he’s gonna be done and you’re gonna be bleeding before you even know it. > > {snip} > > However, the worst laceration I’ve ever gotten from a cat was not from a large Tom, but from a vicious little 7 lb lass. Her little claws were like razors, and I tried to block a swipe with my hand… she cut my hand wide open. :eek: Indeed. As a kid, we had an elderly, sedentary, unhealthy and overweight, desexed female cat. She was very tame and friendly, however, being a young boy, I managed to do _something_ to piss her off (as I recall just wanting to play when she wanted to sleep), and she punched a paw _into my freakin’ eye_. The whole action took a nanosecond (after warnings such as tail-tip flicking), then she curled up again and went back to sleep. Seconds later and I thought, "woah. I am in debt to that old cat in that she saw me merely as an annoying friend and not as a true enemy. She kept her claws _sheathed_. She could have blinded me otherwise, and done so before I would have known what had hit me. As it was, I didn’t see the paw approaching my face at light speed… and this was a _very old domestic cat_. RIP Susie. You were cool. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2004, 3:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unarmed-combat-against-a-wild-animal/259338/33 "2004-08-12T03:21:18Z")
, I didn’t see the paw approaching my face at light speed… and this was a _very old domestic cat_. RIP Susie. You were cool. 🙂 [/QUOTE] You may find [this site about](http://www.cougarinfo.com/attacks3.htm) moutain lion attacks. I especially reccommend the story of Aigust 1, 2002, which I heard about on the news at the time. This guy had his scalp _ripped loose and dragged over his face_, yet managed to kill the cat with a knife. Unarmed he would have been absolute dead meat. There are, however, numerous cases where the cats were beaten off in one manner or another, which says to me more an about their interest or desperation than than any particular things the humans did. ---
**Author:** ![Inigo\_Montoya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inigo_montoya/32/124_2.png) [@Inigo\_Montoya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inigo_Montoya)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2004, 4:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unarmed-combat-against-a-wild-animal/259338/34 "2004-08-12T04:11:54Z")
> [@MGibson](#): > > There was a photographer attacked by one of the large cats while in Africa. I think it was a leopard but I know it wasn’t something as big as a lion. Anyway, he stick his arm down it’s throat and choked it to death. Seems like as good a plan as any to me. > > Marc I can only imagine the look of complete humiliation in the eyes of the cat: **Leopard** : Hey, it’s one of those things with no claws, dull teeth and no scales. Think I’ll eat it! **Photographer** : Zounds! A leopard doth advance hither! I shall defeat it with fisticuff to the jaw. Observe, good Fallstaff! **Fallstaff** : : hic : Aye, but a kick to the nethers would avail you more good sir photolimner. **Leopard** : GOTCHA **Photographer** : Have at you, foul fuzzball! :whiff: **Leopard** : WTF! I’ve been impaled gutterally by mine repast! alas & alack! ---
**Author:** ![xcheopis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/bc8723/32.png) [@xcheopis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/xcheopis)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2004, 8:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unarmed-combat-against-a-wild-animal/259338/35 "2004-08-12T08:14:29Z")
[Park bicyclist conquers cat.](http://www.chainreaction.com/squirrels.htm) (The story is near the end of the page.) ---
**Author:** ![brane\_damaj](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a587f6/32.png) [@brane\_damaj](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brane_damaj)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2004, 2:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unarmed-combat-against-a-wild-animal/259338/36 "2004-08-12T14:02:29Z")
As my grandpappy used to say, “If a wild animal is charging at you, just throw shit in its face. Reach around, it’ll be there.” ---
**Author:** ![smiling\_bandit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9a140/32.png) [@smiling\_bandit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smiling_bandit)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2004, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unarmed-combat-against-a-wild-animal/259338/37 "2004-08-12T18:20:47Z")
I’m going to perfectly, bluntly hoenst here: while you do’t want to piss of a bear, tiger, or grown lion, humans can sucessfully take down pretty much any other land predator mano-a-mano unaided. Now, you’re likely to die during the process, but you’ll at least inflict enough damage to cause said animal to die slowly of stavation, if not sooner. Humans can’t slash and claw but we can break bones and pop joints. Animals have to kill us fast, and we’re big enough with fewer vital areas (its a lot easier to get a grip on a big, wide deer neck than a small, thin human one) If they can’t do that, humans tend to go berzerk with fury and punch and kick like there’s no tommorow. Humans may not look like much (and would be much more dangerous if more of us actually worked out and got muscles rather than turn into blobs). Now, nearly every animal that could conceivably kill us has been warned quite deliberately never to ever, ever do that by countless receding generations. Most ones willing to attack humans when not preovoked are desperate and quite probbaly weak, anyway. So, my answer is yes. Taking on a moutain lion isn’t something I’d want to do asually, but very few of them are willing to risk death to kill a man, and I can quite easily hurt it enough to guarrantee its death. If it drops out a tree on me, then I may be in more trouble, but then, its going to be attacking my back through thick hiking clothing, while I’ve just gone into panic! mode. Even a weak human can quite handily toss a 150 lb cat off his/her back if there’s eough adrenaline. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2004, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unarmed-combat-against-a-wild-animal/259338/38 "2004-08-12T19:01:21Z")
> [@micco](#): > > This strategy might work if the big cat swaggered out in front of you on the trail and said “let’s throw down biped”. Unfortunately for you, the first indication you’re going to have that the cat is even interested is when it hits you from behind and it’s jaws lock on your neck. The initial pounce of even a moderate-sized cat will take you to the ground, so you better brush up on your juijutsu ground fighting if you want to last long enough to even get a punch in. Right- the Puma will pounce- most humans will panic- and you’re breakfast. If it was “mano a gato”- then yes- you’d have a decent chance. Primates are stronger than Felines, and you likely outwiegh him. If you were in good shape (Mr. Puma is in tip-top shape) had martial arts training and plenty of fight experience (the Catamount has had both)- then you’d win- but you’d be plenty hurt. Same with a small bear. A weapon will up your chances a LOT- Lions are killed with just a spear and there are very few deaths on the human side. Chefguy- with a boar spear instead of an axe, and a smallish bear- he could likely do it… IF he was very brave and skilled. :dubious: Duckster- the reason why the house cat kicks your ass- is because you are likely not trying to kill the kitty. A human can easily kill a house cat. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2004, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unarmed-combat-against-a-wild-animal/259338/39 "2004-08-12T19:07:20Z")
> [@rburget](#): > > Sorry bad link above. > [Here](http://fvjohnson.typepad.com/freds_blog/files/pinkey.wmv) is a better link to the orange tomcat that did not like being on a leash. Holy crap, that’s hilarious! What was the guy thinking to let that cat between his legs? He’s lucky he didn’t lose the family fortune! Here’s something to consider: we took our cat to the vet for teeth cleaning, which meant she had to stay overnight. Went back in the morning to retrieve her, the vet goes into the kennel to get her, we hear a blood-curdling cat shriek from the other room, vet comes out hastily and says “Perhaps you should go get her.” Our cat has no front claws. It says something about the respect an experienced animal handler has even for the pointy-impaired animal. ---
**Author:** ![Rick](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/9f8e36/32.png) [@Rick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2004, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unarmed-combat-against-a-wild-animal/259338/40 "2004-08-12T19:14:44Z")
I’m going to perfectly, bluntly honest here; someday I hope to be as macho as you think you are **smiling bandit** Throwing off the weight of the cat is not the problem; the problem is throwing off the weight of the cat, when its fangs are sunk into your neck, and all four paws full of very sharp claws are dug into your sides. Kick and punch all you want your fingernails are no match for the cat’s claws. I for one would like to see some cites on unarmed man v Grizzly bears, momma elks, momma moose, and mountain lions before I give your any other land predator statement much weight. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unarmed-combat-against-a-wild-animal/259338.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unarmed-combat-against-a-wild-animal/259338.md?page=3)