# Unarmed Combat Against a Wild Animal **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [August 11, 2004, 11:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unarmed-combat-against-a-wild-animal/259338 "2004-08-11T11:28:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 9\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![b\_anthracis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7ea924/32.png) [@b\_anthracis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/b_anthracis)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2004, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unarmed-combat-against-a-wild-animal/259338/41 "2004-08-12T19:23:50Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > I think we’d get our butts kicked. I have heard that the average chimp could wallop the crap out of anybody. I think if you tried to strangle a member of the large cat family, you’d get your arms sliced by their claws. " When I read this I immediately thought back to the words of the master: [uncle Cecil](http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a1_001b.html)has covered differences between human and animal musculoskeleture (is that a word? Did I spell it correctly??) before. ---
**Author:** ![Carnac\_the\_Magnificent](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ccd318/32.png) [@Carnac\_the\_Magnificent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Carnac_the_Magnificent)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2004, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unarmed-combat-against-a-wild-animal/259338/42 "2004-08-12T20:16:28Z")
> [@Rick](#): > > I’m going to perfectly, bluntly honest here; someday I hope to be as macho as you think you are **smiling bandit** > Throwing off the weight of the cat is not the problem; the problem is throwing off the weight of the cat, when its fangs are sunk into your neck, and all four paws full of very sharp claws are dug into your sides. > Kick and punch all you want your fingernails are no match for the cat’s claws. > I for one would like to see some cites on unarmed man v Grizzly bears, momma elks, momma moose, and mountain lions before I give your any other land predator statement much weight. I agree. **smiling bandit** , I’m sure you’re one hell of a physical specimen and a great guy at Happy Hour, but you’re way, way, waaaaay out there in Dreamland right now. Almost nothing you said is grounded in fact. Go visit a big zoo and check out the leopards, tigers, Kodiak bears, rhinos, elephants, hippo, venemous snakes, etc. Get close. Real close. See what kind of Amway welcome a male leopard or lion gives you. Against a big, aggressive, territorially encroached upon cat, you would last maybe two seconds before it cut you into ribbons and crushed your trachea. The jaw pressure and slashing speed/power/accuracy are beyond your wildest imagining. If still in doubt, hop a plane to Kenya, strap a dozen bloody pork chops to your naked body, and run into the bush with your sharp stick and gung-fu lessons. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![yastobaal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/258eb7/32.png) [@yastobaal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yastobaal)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2004, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unarmed-combat-against-a-wild-animal/259338/43 "2004-08-12T21:01:58Z")
> [@smiling bandit](#): > > Now, you’re likely to die during the process just to put out that even **smiling bandit** doesn’t thing you’ll live. ---
**Author:** ![jawdirk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/df705f/32.png) [@jawdirk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jawdirk)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2004, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unarmed-combat-against-a-wild-animal/259338/44 "2004-08-12T21:14:28Z")
It is true that the strength and speed of a mountain lion is incomparable to a human’s strength and speed, but that is not the entire picture. Certainly, given the right circumstances, a mountain lion could kill a person before the person could react. But I think a person who does the right things could hold his own. It is not about fighting effectively, it is about confusing the animal. I think this is why a spear is so effective. The animal doesn’t really know what to do about a spear. It sees the human behind the spear – the spear head doesn’t look very dangerous – just something in the way to killing the person. As long as you stay within the realm of what the animal understands – wrestling, striking, fleeing, you are dead. If you get outside of that, you have a good chance – throwing stuff, using weapons, acting strange and scary – you will probably be ok. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2004, 9:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unarmed-combat-against-a-wild-animal/259338/45 "2004-08-12T21:32:49Z")
> [@jawdirk](#): > > As long as you stay within the realm of what the animal understands – wrestling, striking, fleeing, you are dead. If you get outside of that, you have a good chance – throwing stuff, using weapons, acting strange and scary – you will probably be ok. This has some truth to it. Recently here, a man was able to flummox a grizzly by holding his mountain bike up over his head. All the bear saw was a creature that inexplicably grew to nine feet tall whenever he thought about approaching it. The bluff worked. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2004, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unarmed-combat-against-a-wild-animal/259338/46 "2004-08-12T22:23:37Z")
This really should move into another forum, but I think the key to your survival lies in judging the intent of the critter. Perhaps you’ve startled it into a quick attack and if you ball up defensively, it’ll give up and go away in a few moments. If you misjudge the seriousness of the attack you have to respond more forcefully before you absorb too much damage to respond at all. Or maybe you see it stalking you. If that’s the case, maybe it’s a good idea to attack IT. As far as tactics go, I have a dim recollection of reading a description of a self-defense technique against attack dogs reccommended in some survival manual I came across. I can’t speak for its validity, but it seems plausible. The author simply assumed you would see the dog coming and be facing it, and that the dogs would leap at your chest and throat. IIRC, the instructions amounted to a kind of judo throw with the intent being to break or dislocate or seriously wrench up one of the forelegs. You want to drop to one knee or even lower to let the mass of the dog sail over your body rather than striking into it. As it sails over, you grab one of the front legs with both hands, and basically hold on to let the dog’s weight and speed dislocate the leg. There was some added detail about twisting the leg in some manner to be more damaging. The idea was to injure it but not come to grips with it. If you really damaged it’s leg, odds really favor it slinking away – supposedly. This was the thing I doubted most. And I don’t recall there being any advice about what to do it a dog went for any targets lower down. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Burrido](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/3be4f8/32.png) [@Burrido](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Burrido)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2004, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unarmed-combat-against-a-wild-animal/259338/47 "2004-08-12T23:16:43Z")
Well, I think most of the stories from Boyo Jims links proves that Cougar \> Unarmed Man. Seriously, some of those cougars were shot multiple times and were still kicking. Granted they didn’t live much longer, but all they would need is a couple of seconds to rip your throat out. ---
**Author:** ![Zsofia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/7bcc69/32.png) [@Zsofia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zsofia)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2004, 1:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unarmed-combat-against-a-wild-animal/259338/48 "2004-08-13T01:25:10Z")
> [@](#): > > Now, nearly every animal that could conceivably kill us has been warned quite deliberately never to ever, ever do that by countless receding generations. Most ones willing to attack humans when not preovoked are desperate and quite probbaly weak, anyway. Er, that’s not because you personally are such a big scary danger in your death throes. That’s because all the men of your tribe (plus your mama) go out afterwards and turn the cat into dog chow. One human, unarmed, is not really a threat. Ten humans with spears is a threat. A hundred humans with guns may be an extinction level event for you. ---
**Author:** ![smiling\_bandit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9a140/32.png) [@smiling\_bandit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smiling_bandit)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2004, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unarmed-combat-against-a-wild-animal/259338/49 "2004-08-13T16:19:59Z")
Hey guys, I didn’t say you’d survive in a fight against a tiger or lion or bear - I wouldn’t dream of trying unless I had no other option. But a mountain lion isn’t likely to risk death to kill you - and as I said, a fear-frenzied human is no small threat. A mountain lion probably can’t kill you without risking serious injury. And you don’t have to hurt one very badly to render it unable to hunt, hence “serious”. But even moderately fit individuals can drive one off. If you keep your head or toss it around even mildly, any animal short of a bear will back off. You’re all also overestimating the power of an animal’s teeth and claws. It ain’t easy to kill people. Unless they carve open your stomach or get the inside of your legs (artery) you can walk away from almost any attack a mountain lion can throw at you. You don’t have to be Conan to do it, either. I’ve got dolars to bet my grandma could beat the holy hell out of a mountain lion. of course, I’ve never been brave enough to risk getting her angry, either… ;j [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unarmed-combat-against-a-wild-animal/259338.md?page=2)