# Unauthorized use of sperm **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [February 24, 2005, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unauthorized-use-of-sperm/291748 "2005-02-24T19:24:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![ratatoskK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ratatoskk/32/2987_2.png) [@ratatoskK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ratatoskK)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2005, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unauthorized-use-of-sperm/291748/1 "2005-02-24T19:24:13Z")
This AP story found on the [NY Times](http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/national/AP-Sperm-Theft.html) web site was pretty interesting. This couple had oral sex and the woman secretly saved the semen and used it to impregnate herself. The guy didn’t find out until two years later, when she filed a paternity suit, and he was ordered to pay $800 per month in child support. The court said she was not guilty of theft, but the guy could sue her for causing extreme distress… > [@](#): > > Phillips sued Irons, claiming he has had trouble sleeping and eating and has been haunted by ``feelings of being trapped in a nightmare,’’ court papers state. > > Irons responded that her alleged actions weren’t ``truly extreme and outrageous’’ and that Phillips’ pain wasn’t bad enough to merit a lawsuit. The circuit court agreed and dismissed Phillips’ lawsuit in 2003. > > But the higher court ruled that, if Phillips’ story is true, Irons ``deceitfully engaged in sexual acts, which no reasonable person would expect could result in pregnancy, to use plaintiff’s sperm in an unorthodox, unanticipated manner yielding extreme consequences.’’ > > The judges backed the lower court decision to dismiss the fraud and theft claims, agreeing with Irons that she didn’t steal the sperm. > > `She asserts that when plaintiff 'delivered' his sperm, it was a gift -- an absolute and irrevocable transfer of title to property from a donor to a donee,'' the decision said. `There was no agreement that the original deposit would be returned upon request.’’ ---
**Author:** ![archmichael](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/bb73d2/32.png) [@archmichael](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/archmichael)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2005, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unauthorized-use-of-sperm/291748/2 "2005-02-24T19:32:11Z")
Hurry up with that damn male contraceptive pill, so I cant stop having to do tongue checks. ---
**Author:** ![Ephemera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8baadc/32.png) [@Ephemera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ephemera)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2005, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unauthorized-use-of-sperm/291748/3 "2005-02-24T19:37:22Z")
Wow. That is a nightmare and I would seriously lose it if I were in the same scenario. ---
**Author:** ![Rufus\_Xavier](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/eada6e/32.png) [@Rufus\_Xavier](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rufus_Xavier)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2005, 8:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unauthorized-use-of-sperm/291748/4 "2005-02-24T20:09:59Z")
_when plaintiff ‘delivered’ his sperm, it was a gift – an absolute and irrevocable transfer of title to property from a donor to a donee_ I predict that within two weeks, a standard form will become available to avoid these kinds of things from happening again: Man: Darling, before we get all hot and heavy, I have a pre-ejaculational agreement for you to sign. Woman: What is it? Man: Well, it’s a legally binding document that just states that once I transfer ownership of my sperm to you, that you agree not to hold me responsible for any subsequent action the sperm takes once the transfer is completed. Woman: Oh. Okay. ---
**Author:** ![GorillaMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/50afbb/32.png) [@GorillaMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GorillaMan)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2005, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unauthorized-use-of-sperm/291748/5 "2005-02-24T20:13:17Z")
Perhaps the worst possible reason to ask somebody if she swallows?.. ---
**Author:** ![iamthewalrus\_3](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/258eb7/32.png) [@iamthewalrus\_3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iamthewalrus_3)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2005, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unauthorized-use-of-sperm/291748/6 "2005-02-24T20:36:19Z")
> [@Rufus Xavier](#): > > _when plaintiff ‘delivered’ his sperm, it was a gift – an absolute and irrevocable transfer of title to property from a donor to a donee_ > > I predict that within two weeks, a standard form will become available to avoid these kinds of things from happening again: > > Man: Darling, before we get all hot and heavy, I have a pre-ejaculational agreement for you to sign. > > Woman: What is it? > > Man: Well, it’s a legally binding document that just states that once I transfer ownership of my sperm to you, that you agree not to hold me responsible for any subsequent action the sperm takes once the transfer is completed. > > Woman: Oh. Okay. I realize this is a joke, but an agreement like this wouldn’t protect you from anything. Courts have decided that parents cannot contract away support for the child. ---
**Author:** ![TonyF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/9de053/32.png) [@TonyF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TonyF)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2005, 9:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unauthorized-use-of-sperm/291748/7 "2005-02-24T21:24:57Z")
BS! Even supposing the “gift” argument is valid, why was he held responsible for her child? It’d be like buying a car for a friend, then losing in court when he sues you for gas. It’d be like getting thrown in jail for giving chef’s knives as a housewarming gift - knives that were later used in murder. :smack: ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2005, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unauthorized-use-of-sperm/291748/8 "2005-02-24T22:21:55Z")
> [@TonyF](#): > > BS! Even supposing the “gift” argument is valid, why was he held responsible for her child? Because the child needs someone responsible, and the courts have decided that the biological parents are by default the folks responsible for the kid. Daniel ---
**Author:** ![ratatoskK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ratatoskk/32/2987_2.png) [@ratatoskK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ratatoskK)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2005, 10:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unauthorized-use-of-sperm/291748/9 "2005-02-24T22:28:20Z")
If the woman does something as bizarre as this one did, why is it fair to extract money from the “father”? Just because he’s the most convenient person available to extract money from? Why not go after the woman’s relatives? Or force the baby to be given up for adoption? ---
**Author:** ![TeaElle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8491ac/32.png) [@TeaElle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TeaElle)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2005, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unauthorized-use-of-sperm/291748/10 "2005-02-24T22:32:22Z")
And more justification is given to the position that sexual acts should be reserved for those in committed relationships based on mutual trust, honesty and openness. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2005, 10:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unauthorized-use-of-sperm/291748/11 "2005-02-24T22:42:42Z")
I think the judge erred in saying the woman didn’t steal anything from the man. It’s true that he “gave” her the semen, but it’s obvious the semen isn’t the issue here (no pun intended). The reason the man had cause to sue is the fact of discovering he was a father. I think most people would agree that being the parent of a child is a emotional burden and it was one this man had no reason to think he was going to assume from this situation. So the woman is responsible for imposing that stress upon him and “stole” his status as a non-parent from him. ---
**Author:** ![Rufus\_Xavier](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/eada6e/32.png) [@Rufus\_Xavier](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rufus_Xavier)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2005, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unauthorized-use-of-sperm/291748/12 "2005-02-24T22:48:31Z")
> [@TeaElle](#): > > And more justification is given to the position that sexual acts should be reserved for those in committed relationships based on mutual trust, honesty and openness. With a quailifier to also include those for whom sexual acts cannot possibly result in the birth of a child? ---
**Author:** ![buttonjockey308](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bcef8e/32.png) [@buttonjockey308](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/buttonjockey308)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2005, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unauthorized-use-of-sperm/291748/13 "2005-02-24T22:54:59Z")
> [@TeaElle](#): > > And more justification is given to the position that sexual acts should be reserved for those in committed relationships based on mutual trust, honesty and openness. Either that, or have better aim. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2005, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unauthorized-use-of-sperm/291748/14 "2005-02-24T23:28:38Z")
At least she didn’t pan-fry it. ---
**Author:** ![Dark\_Side\_of\_the\_Floyd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/bb73d2/32.png) [@Dark\_Side\_of\_the\_Floyd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dark_Side_of_the_Floyd)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2005, 12:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unauthorized-use-of-sperm/291748/15 "2005-02-25T00:04:42Z")
> [@Mangetout](#): > > At least she didn’t pan-fry it. I’ll take “Best Dopername/Thread Subject Reply combination” for 1000, Alex! 😛 ---
**Author:** ![The\_Devil\_s\_Grandmother](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/74df32/32.png) [@The\_Devil\_s\_Grandmother](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Devil_s_Grandmother)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2005, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unauthorized-use-of-sperm/291748/16 "2005-02-25T00:06:39Z")
> [@Rufus Xavier](#): > > With a quailifier to also include those for whom sexual acts cannot possibly result in the birth of a child? I’d \*like \* to admit this qualifier, but last I checked oral sex was not a good way to conceive a child. Suppose this was GayManA who received a blow job from GayGuyB who for some bizarre reason gave the condom of ejaculate to a woman who later gave birth. Would GayManA still be on a legal hook for child support? [There’s a CNN article you don’t have to register to read](http://www.cnn.com/2005/LAW/02/24/sperm.theft.ap/index.html). It says (I added some parenthicals for clarity): > [@CNN's AP article](#): > > But the higher court ruled that, if Phillips’ \*(the father’s) \* story is true, Irons _(the mother)_ “deceitfully engaged in sexual acts, which no reasonable person would expect could result in pregnancy, to use plaintiff’s sperm in an unorthodox, unanticipated manner yielding extreme consequences.” I’m curious how Phillips intends to prove they never had sex that could result in procreation. ---
**Author:** ![Antigen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/848f3c/32.png) [@Antigen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Antigen)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2005, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unauthorized-use-of-sperm/291748/17 "2005-02-25T00:06:59Z")
> [@TeaElle](#): > > And more justification is given to the position that sexual acts should be reserved for those in committed relationships based on mutual trust, honesty and openness. Permits! They should have to pass a test and qualify for a permit! ---
**Author:** ![Rufus\_Xavier](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/eada6e/32.png) [@Rufus\_Xavier](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rufus_Xavier)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2005, 12:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unauthorized-use-of-sperm/291748/18 "2005-02-25T00:19:56Z")
> [@The Devil's Grandmother](#): > > I’d \*like \* to admit this qualifier, but last I checked oral sex was not a good way to conceive a child. > Suppose this was GayManA who received a blow job from GayGuyB who for some bizarre reason gave the condom of ejaculate to a woman who later gave birth. Would GayManA still be on a legal hook for child support? I meant sex acts that do not involve viable sperm, such as women having sex with each other, and/or men who are sterile. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Devil\_s\_Grandmother](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/74df32/32.png) [@The\_Devil\_s\_Grandmother](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Devil_s_Grandmother)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2005, 12:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unauthorized-use-of-sperm/291748/19 "2005-02-25T00:34:17Z")
> [@Rufus Xavier](#): > > I meant sex acts that do not involve viable sperm, such as women having sex with each other, and/or men who are sterile. Ah, I see. I thought you were talking about queersex in general. Or heteros having oral/manual/anal sex. I sure agree with your implication, if I were a man I’d be considering every drop of sperm sacred, and destined only for the porcelain goddess. ---
**Author:** ![danceswithcats](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9e8a1a/32.png) [@danceswithcats](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/danceswithcats)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2005, 12:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unauthorized-use-of-sperm/291748/20 "2005-02-25T00:36:28Z")
Didn’t we beat this issue up [here](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=298837&page=1&pp=50&highlight=child+support)? [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unauthorized-use-of-sperm/291748.md?page=2)