# Undeniably talented, undeniably insane musicians **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [January 16, 2011, 5:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/undeniably-talented-undeniably-insane-musicians/567800 "2011-01-16T05:29:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 16\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2011, 8:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/undeniably-talented-undeniably-insane-musicians/567800/61 "2011-01-18T08:17:55Z")
Warren Zevon. He had very bad OCD, depression, and a bunch of other mental and behavioral issues. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2011, 11:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/undeniably-talented-undeniably-insane-musicians/567800/62 "2011-01-18T11:26:27Z")
> [@antonio107](#): > > Robert Schumann > Alexander Scriabin > Carlo Gesualdo > > Other classical HMs include Beethoven (who had a strange fixation with his nephew), Liszt (who cut the webbings of his hands out to increase his reach), and Edward MacDowell, who descended into madness after an accident involving a Hanson’s cab. Curse you - I was going to mention Gesualdo. Apart from the cross-dressing, the murder (including an infant, whom he “rocked to death”) and the weird music, he’s famous for employing six men to beat him with sticks, which he needed in order to take a crap. Full on crazy. I think Bjork is more than a little fruitloops but I still like her music. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2011, 11:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/undeniably-talented-undeniably-insane-musicians/567800/63 "2011-01-18T11:35:06Z")
> [@antonio107](#): > > While I don’t think she’s insane, I always wondered how an epigone of Madonna somehow became known as an “insanely” creative genius, either. Easy, the people who buy her that way are too young to remember the young Madonna. ---
**Author:** ![PunditLisa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/4af34b/32.png) [@PunditLisa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PunditLisa)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2011, 12:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/undeniably-talented-undeniably-insane-musicians/567800/64 "2011-01-18T12:29:37Z")
> [@Alice\_The\_Goon](#): > > A huge and highly successful 30+ year career as one of the best musicians of all time? We should all be so crazy. I didn’t deny that he was a great musician (see thread title). But being highly successful does not mean that he’s mentally healthy. ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2011, 3:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/undeniably-talented-undeniably-insane-musicians/567800/65 "2011-01-18T15:49:18Z")
Everything I’ve read about Richard Farina suggests he was really out there, but that was part of his charm. ---
**Author:** ![stpauler](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9d8465/32.png) [@stpauler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/stpauler)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2011, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/undeniably-talented-undeniably-insane-musicians/567800/66 "2011-01-18T16:03:50Z")
[Roky Erickson](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roky_Erickson) > [@](#): > > n 1968, while doing a stint at HemisFair, Erickson started speaking nonsense. He was diagnosed with paranoid schizophrenia and sent to a Houston psychiatric hospital, where he involuntarily received electroconvulsive therapy.[2] > > The Elevators were vocal proponents of LSD, mescaline (peyote), DMT and marijuana use, and were subject to extra attention from police. In 1969, Erickson was arrested for possession of one marijuana joint in Austin. Facing a ten-year prison term, Erickson pled not guilty by reason of insanity. He was first sent to the Austin State Hospital. After several escapes, he was sent to the Rusk State Hospital for the Criminally Insane, where he was subjected to more electroconvulsive therapy and Thorazine treatments, ultimately remaining in custody until 1972. ---
**Author:** ![Contrapuntal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e274bd/32.png) [@Contrapuntal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Contrapuntal)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2011, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/undeniably-talented-undeniably-insane-musicians/567800/67 "2011-01-18T16:05:59Z")
> [@John\_DiFool](#): > > Vliet was “insane” in the same way Salvador Dali was: “The only difference between myself and a madman is that I am not mad.” Beefheart’s Dadaesque musical style wasn’t the result of mental illness, but of his idiosyncratic creative muse. And he spent the last 30 or so years of his life painting quietly in the desert. I hadn’t realized he had died. That saddens me. ---
**Author:** ![Gray\_Ghost](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/c0e974/32.png) [@Gray\_Ghost](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gray_Ghost)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2011, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/undeniably-talented-undeniably-insane-musicians/567800/68 "2011-01-18T16:21:51Z")
[Daniel Johnston.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Johnston) ---
**Author:** ![scabpicker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scabpicker/32/8268_2.png) [@scabpicker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scabpicker)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2011, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/undeniably-talented-undeniably-insane-musicians/567800/69 "2011-01-18T16:53:59Z")
> [@Gray\_Ghost](#): > > [Daniel Johnston.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Johnston) Yep, that’s who I came in to mention. ---
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2011, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/undeniably-talented-undeniably-insane-musicians/567800/70 "2011-01-18T17:15:01Z")
> [@PunditLisa](#): > > I didn’t deny that he was a great musician (see thread title). But being highly successful does not mean that he’s mentally healthy. Look, there’s a difference between weird and insane. Prince may be weird, but he’s not undeniably insane. And to prove my contention, I hereby deny that Prince is insane. ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2011, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/undeniably-talented-undeniably-insane-musicians/567800/71 "2011-01-18T17:37:28Z")
> [@irishgirl](#): > > Joan Baez is crazy cakes. > I’m not entirely sure Bob Dylan is the most balanced either. Both Baez & Dylan have had fifty year careers in music. Hard to do if you’re insane. ---
**Author:** ![PunditLisa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/4af34b/32.png) [@PunditLisa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PunditLisa)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2011, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/undeniably-talented-undeniably-insane-musicians/567800/72 "2011-01-18T17:57:41Z")
> [@Lemur866](#): > > Look, there’s a difference between weird and insane. Prince may be weird, but he’s not undeniably insane. And to prove my contention, I hereby deny that Prince is insane. First of all, I was the first to declare him undeniably insane, so you cannot deny his insanity without a 2/3 majority vote. Secondly, to prove MY contention, I hereby admit that the man once decided to change his name to a _symbol_. ---
**Author:** ![NDP](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ndp/32/55_2.png) [@NDP](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NDP)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2011, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/undeniably-talented-undeniably-insane-musicians/567800/73 "2011-01-18T18:13:04Z")
> [@PunditLisa](#): > > Secondly, to prove MY contention, I hereby admit that the man once decided to change his name to a _symbol_. But wasn’t that due to the fight he was having with his record company? (Maybe somebody can provide the details.) If so, there was a definite method to his “madness.” ---
**Author:** ![cjepson](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a9adbd/32.png) [@cjepson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cjepson)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2011, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/undeniably-talented-undeniably-insane-musicians/567800/74 "2011-01-18T18:18:16Z")
Phil Ochs spent the last few years of his life more or less incapacitated by mental illness. Skip Spence, originally of Moby Grape, fell apart mentally, managing to record one solo LP, _Oar_, which is now considered a lost gem of psychedelia. Rock tends to attract extreme personalities, and it can be hard to tell where eccentricity leaves off and insanity begins. Some who have trod that borderline include: Brian Jones – certainly a mess psychologically and may have been clinically insane. Steve Weber of the Holy Modal Rounders – seems to have a great deal of difficulty functioning normally. Arthur Lee of Love – possibly paranoid. Jamie Muir (percussionist, was with King Crimson for one LP) and Davy Graham (British folk guitarist) – I would put them more on the “eccentric” side. Another British folkie, Nick Drake, suffered from depression. (Of course, both James and Livingston Taylor have struggled with depression but have managed to have quite good careers anyway.) ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2011, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/undeniably-talented-undeniably-insane-musicians/567800/75 "2011-01-18T18:42:26Z")
Agree that most comments in the thread have an extremely low bar for insanity. Idiosyncratic artists (or people) need not be, and usually aren’t, crazy. Even one of the clearer examples, Roky Erickson, only sometimes wobbled over the line, as best I can tell. The rest of the time he was just… interesting… but smart and cool enough to deliberately mine his moments of crazy for art; “I think up demons _for you_.” > [@cantara](#): > > I love Sinead, but I do think she is [loony](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sin%C3%A9ad_O%27Connor#Personal_life). What’s **undeniably insane** there? Serial relationships? Waffling about sexuality? A shaved head? Sinéad is hardly unique in these aspects. ---
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2011, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/undeniably-talented-undeniably-insane-musicians/567800/76 "2011-01-18T18:55:18Z")
> [@PunditLisa](#): > > First of all, I was the first to declare him undeniably insane, so you cannot deny his insanity without a 2/3 majority vote. > > Secondly, to prove MY contention, I hereby admit that the man once decided to change his name to a _symbol_. If someone is undeniably insane, that means that no one denies the person is insane. Therefore, if one person denies the insanity of the artist formerly known as the artist formerly known as Prince, then Prince’s insanity has been denied by one person, and therefore Prince is not undeniably insane. He may, in fact, be insane but he is no longer _undeniably_ insane. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/undeniably-talented-undeniably-insane-musicians/567800.md?page=3)