# Underpowered cars **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [June 17, 2021, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/underpowered-cars/944481 "2021-06-17T18:53:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![OldOlds](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/a3d4f5/32.png) [@OldOlds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OldOlds)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2021, 1:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/underpowered-cars/944481/61 "2021-06-23T13:10:55Z")
Time for a little pedantry: A muscle car is not just any fast car, nor is it a sports car. It’s an intermediate car with a powerful engine. While I’m sure some would argue something else was first (maybe Chrysler 300), it was “invented” when Pontiac put the large-car engine into a mid-sized Tempest. At one time, the Big Three prohibited putting the big engines from the full-size cars into smaller vehicles. Though this could sometimes be overcome by ordering through fleet channels (ie, CPO cars) which had fewer restrictions. In general, a muscle car didn’t have the upgrades to handling, brakes, etc. that would be expected from a sports car. It was just a family car that accelerated really fast. Naturally, things evolved over time, and after a few years it gets blurry. ---
**Author:** ![wguy123](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wguy123/32/3161_2.png) [@wguy123](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wguy123)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2021, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/underpowered-cars/944481/62 "2021-06-23T15:09:48Z")
> [@jnglmassiv](#): > > A coworker/friend of mine had a Mustang convertible, probably about a 1991 with the 5.0l V8. She let me drive it pretty often when we hung our in the the 90s. It probably wasn’t exactly underpowered but it was quite disappointing, performance-wise. Vanilla Ice led me to believe it was a better car than it was That 225hp was absolutely dominating compared to the 90hp in my 88 Mustang with the 2.3l 4-cylinder. Not enough power to even really test the shitty handling. My brother had a 90 Ford Escort. It had a smaller 4-cylinder which produced more power, got way better gas mileage, and weighed a lot less. It was far sportier than that Mustang. Also, manual transmission over the Mustangs crap auto. ---
**Author:** ![BrickBat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ac91a4/32.png) [@BrickBat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrickBat)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2021, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/underpowered-cars/944481/63 "2021-06-23T15:52:57Z")
The Olds 260 had a 2-BBL carburetor, but it used the body of a Quadrajet 4 barrel, but with the rear 2 secondaries blanked out. Not that it would matter, since the engine was strangled with restrictive porting, super-mild camshaft, and single exhaust with the old pellet-style catalytic converter, it’s airflow requirements could never even nearly approach the need for more carburetion. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2021, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/underpowered-cars/944481/64 "2021-06-23T16:13:35Z")
> [@wguy123](#): > > That 225hp was absolutely dominating compared to the 90hp in my 88 Mustang with the 2.3l 4-cylinder. Not enough power to even really test the shitty handling. There was that odd period in Mustang history where Ford thought of it as a 2-seat econobox with zippy styling and a well-known name. What were they thinking? ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2021, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/underpowered-cars/944481/65 "2021-06-23T16:29:23Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > There was that odd period in Mustang history where Ford thought of it as a 2-seat econobox with zippy styling and a well-known name. What were they thinking? ‘Let’s make a cheap-ass car and trick the rubes into buying it by calling it a Mustang.’ ---
**Author:** ![wguy123](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wguy123/32/3161_2.png) [@wguy123](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wguy123)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2021, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/underpowered-cars/944481/66 "2021-06-23T16:38:48Z")
In my defense, it was given to me. I can be a bit on the daft side at times, but not daft enough to give someone money for a vehicle like that. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2021, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/underpowered-cars/944481/67 "2021-06-23T16:44:33Z")
I apologise. I did not intend to cast dispersions upon anybody present. ---
**Author:** ![wguy123](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wguy123/32/3161_2.png) [@wguy123](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wguy123)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2021, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/underpowered-cars/944481/68 "2021-06-23T16:46:28Z")
I did give perfectly good money for my rusted, wore out VM bug. That was a lot more fun than that Mustang though. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2021, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/underpowered-cars/944481/69 "2021-06-23T16:47:45Z")
I’d rather have a Beetle than a… What did they call it? A Mustang II? ---
**Author:** ![wguy123](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wguy123/32/3161_2.png) [@wguy123](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wguy123)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2021, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/underpowered-cars/944481/70 "2021-06-23T16:57:16Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > A Mustang II I think the Mustang IIs are becoming collectible. Well, I’ve seen car shows with Pintos, Gremlins, Pacers, etc, so why wouldn’t the Mustang II? ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2021, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/underpowered-cars/944481/71 "2021-06-23T17:06:54Z")
> [@wguy123](#): > > I think the Mustang IIs are becoming collectible. I’d say the one year only, 302-powered King Cobra version is definitely collectible. [https://www.hemmings.com/stories/article/1978-ford-mustang-king-cobra](https://www.hemmings.com/stories/article/1978-ford-mustang-king-cobra) ---
**Author:** ![control-z](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/eada6e/32.png) [@control-z](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/control-z)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2021, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/underpowered-cars/944481/72 "2021-06-23T17:07:46Z")
5.0 Mustangs were good cars at the time, and 225 HP was decent for that time as well. They competed well with other affordable muscle cars like Camaros, Firebirds, and the Monte Carlo SS. The look, sound, and torque were the main advantages in the 2 Mustang GTs I owned. OTOH, my parents had a 1979 Mustang 6-cylinder. It was floaty on the road, the tires were skinny, the brakes locked up easily, and the engine when pressed would just roar but nothing would happen. ---
**Author:** ![OldOlds](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/a3d4f5/32.png) [@OldOlds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OldOlds)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2021, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/underpowered-cars/944481/73 "2021-06-23T19:14:37Z")
Agreed. This was a time when many other 5L engines (Olds 307, Chevy 305) and even 5.7L engines were making 135-155HP. I’ve always seen the 5.0 Mustang as the first to exit the Malaise era. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2021, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/underpowered-cars/944481/74 "2021-06-23T19:21:55Z")
> [@OldOlds](#): > > Naturally, things evolved over time, and after a few years it gets blurry. - I don’t think they ever got _that_ fast. ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2021, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/underpowered-cars/944481/75 "2021-06-23T19:31:22Z")
Maybe it if has [a 7.2L out of a flat bottom boat.](https://mikebrewermotoring.com/news/wheeler-dealer/wheeler-dealers-tame-the-dodge-coronet/)😃 ---
**Author:** ![Gatopescado](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gatopescado/32/5711_2.png) [@Gatopescado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gatopescado)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2021, 6:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/underpowered-cars/944481/76 "2021-06-24T06:17:29Z")
> [@jnglmassiv](#): > > Vanilla Ice led me to believe it was a better car than it was. Now, this is funny right here! ---
**Author:** ![digs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/digs/32/14889_2.png) [@digs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/digs)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2021, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/underpowered-cars/944481/77 "2021-06-27T00:09:50Z")
> [@Acierocolotl](#): > > Jalopnik fan? We are everywhere… (Well, actually, I’m really only here. [Jalopnik.com](http://Jalopnik.com) is the only other web site I read, but I don’t dare sign up so I can leave comments or I’ll have NO free time). By the way, I have the slowest car. The first Honda Insight (indeed, the first hybrid). It’s cool and eco-everything, but it has ONE trick: gas mileage. Other tricks like acceleration? Forget it. I go out of my way to a freeway entrance that’s on a downslope, otherwise, I’ll have a line of angry motorists IN THE SLOW LANE as I try to do 0-60 in 12 parsecs. It’s not safe, as I can’t avoid a problem by accelerating. I’ll bet part of the problem is that mine has a crappy CVT transmission and an aging hybrid battery. I’m assuming the manual has some pep. My car guy keeps tempting me with engine swaps he’d love to do to it. Got to admit, there are days I’d trade all my green cred for stomping on the GO pedal and having something happen… ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2021, 1:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/underpowered-cars/944481/78 "2021-06-27T01:45:20Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > When I was a kid Dad had a '66 T-Bird and later a '68 Olds Toronado. Both of the so-called “personal luxury car” or “executive luxury car” ilk. Not exactly muscle cars but with big V8s they could haul ass by the standards of the day. Much better at straight line speed than at curves though. > [@sitchensis](#): > > From what I remember from shows and magazines, the early T-Birds were aimed at soldiers returning from Europe after seeing all the fun little European sports cars. By the mid 60’s everything was a muscle car or had a muscle car option. > [@Skywatcher](#): > > Yeah, the Thunderbird had muscular options but was classified as a personal luxury car. Similar to the [Lincoln Continental Mark series.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lincoln_Mark_series) Interestingly I saw much of the above related in [this YouTube installment](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yxk-04nC5c8) just days before I came upon this thread. BTW that channel was also the first place I heard of “malaise era” cars. ---
**Author:** ![Mama\_Zappa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/71e660/32.png) [@Mama\_Zappa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mama_Zappa)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2021, 4:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/underpowered-cars/944481/79 "2021-06-29T04:20:32Z")
> [@kenobi\_65](#): > > I suspect that may be part of why you see so few PT Cruisers still on the road – Chrysler was still struggling to build a car that would last. Have they succeeded yet? I’ve owned two Chryslers: a 1982 Dodge Omni which was a lemon (but its predecessor was a Fiat 128 - i.e. before they quit marketing in the US in the early 1980s) - and it was an improvement over the Fiat. It did not have a lot of get up and go and major things failed on it during the less than 3 years I owned it. Subsequent cars were a Mazda 626, a Honda Civic, and a Saturn - all more reliable. We sold the Saturn when we bought a Dodge Caravan in 1996 (still had the Civic) and it was actually the first car I’d owned that had enough oomph that I had to watch the speed on the highway lest I go too fast. It too turned out to have some lemonish tendencies though we got 10 years out of it. All the compact cars we’ve owned have felt like they had trouble accelerating fast enough when merging into heavy highway traffic - to the point where we would always turn off the AC briefly. I don’t think we had that issue with the Caravan, nor with either of our two CRVs, but I still did it on our second Civic (which retired last year at 22…) ---
**Author:** ![Gatopescado](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gatopescado/32/5711_2.png) [@Gatopescado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gatopescado)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2021, 5:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/underpowered-cars/944481/80 "2021-06-29T05:44:34Z")
PT Cruisers are so thick in the Junkyard, you can … Uh, search for hours before you find a worthwhile part. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/underpowered-cars/944481.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/underpowered-cars/944481.md?page=5)