# "Unite the Right" white nationalist march: Ugliness on full display. **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [August 12, 2017, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444 "2017-08-12T15:06:30Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 14
**Author:** ![TokyoBayer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tokyobayer/32/13989_2.png) [@TokyoBayer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TokyoBayer)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2017, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444/261 "2017-08-13T14:47:29Z")
> [@Ann\_Hedonia](#): > > True red-blooded American patriots gotta stick up for each other. Why are conservative here on this site apparently supporting the Nazis? Is the hate for liberals that bad? ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2017, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444/262 "2017-08-13T14:52:08Z")
> [@TokyoBayer](#): > > Why are conservative here on this site apparently supporting the Nazis? Is the hate for liberals that bad? One poster? Two maybe? Are there more I haven’t noticed? Go ahead and put that broad brush away. I’m conservative by what many would measure here and although I will always support the 1st amendment that is not the same as supporting what is said. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2017, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444/263 "2017-08-13T14:53:58Z")
> **[Charlottesville crash suspect James Fields brandished shield for Vanguard...](https://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/charlottesville-suspect-held-hate-group-shield-attack-article-1.3407245)** > > James Fields brandished a shield emblazoned with a white supremacist emblem before plowing his sports car into a crowd protesting his rally. James Alex Fields was photographed (in the link) just a few hours before his vehicle attack wielding a shield with a nazi group’s symbol, with other neo-nazis. I think it’s entirely reasonable now to blame the “white supremacist” side for the death and most of the violence of yesterday. ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2017, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444/264 "2017-08-13T14:58:34Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > [Charlottesville crash suspect James Fields brandished shield for Vanguard America hate group before attack – New York Daily News](http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/charlottesville-suspect-held-hate-group-shield-attack-article-1.3407245) > > James Alex Fields was photographed (in the link) just a few hours before his vehicle attack wielding a shield with a nazi group’s symbol, with other neo-nazis. > > I think it’s entirely reasonable now to blame the “white supremacist” side for the death and most of the violence of yesterday. I thought that was already pretty well established. ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2017, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444/265 "2017-08-13T15:03:38Z")
> [@Loach](#): > > I thought that was already pretty well established. By everyone but Trump and his ilk, I guess. There’s really no excuse for supporting that piece of shit. My hatred for him as an individual is really starting to bleed into visceral rage toward people who don’t agree that he’s a piece of shit. It’s pretty evident by now. I mean, it was evident to most of us from the beginning, but if anyone is not seriously disturbed by his noncommittal stance on the events of Charlottesville, there’s something really wrong with them cognitively and ethically. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2017, 3:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444/266 "2017-08-13T15:07:11Z")
> [@Loach](#): > > I thought that was already pretty well established. Yes, but some in this thread (or maybe it was the Pit thread) were contesting this. ---
**Author:** ![E-DUB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/e-dub/32/403_2.png) [@E-DUB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-DUB)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2017, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444/267 "2017-08-13T15:11:28Z")
Even after something is “well established” they’ll contest it. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2017, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444/268 "2017-08-13T15:16:03Z")
An actual fucking Nazi had the (unintentional)[best summation of the day](https://twitter.com/RichardBSpencer/status/896525516865503233). The place is run by morons. Who the hell thought to let a racial supremacist group protest was a good idea, and did not prepare. ---
**Author:** ![OttoDaFe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ottodafe/32/356_2.png) [@OttoDaFe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OttoDaFe)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2017, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444/269 "2017-08-13T15:17:32Z")
> [@E-DUB](#): > > Even after something is “well established” they’ll contest it. And/or claim that he’s really an “antifa” who was out to tarnish their noble cause. Alex Jones in 3 … 2 … 1 … ---
**Author:** ![Ann\_Hedonia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ann_hedonia/32/319_2.png) [@Ann\_Hedonia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ann_Hedonia)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2017, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444/270 "2017-08-13T15:20:19Z")
> [@TokyoBayer](#): > > Why are conservative here on this site apparently supporting the Nazis? Is the hate for liberals that bad? I hope you realize that my post was sarcasm. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2017, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444/271 "2017-08-13T15:21:43Z")
> [@Spice\_Weasel](#): > > I’m curious why you think chanting for murder is egregious but carrying a symbol that endorses the genocide of millions is not. > > We have a poster whose wife may be dead or seriously injured, and you’re coming at us with this apoloigist bullshit? I’m honestly shocked at your behavior in this thread. I do not like Nazis, or genocide, or chants for murder of people, or assholes who run people over who are exercising their First Amendment rights. That being said, Larry made a pretty specific claim, that people were ‘chanting for the murder of Jews and non-whites’. I hadn’t heard that anywhere else and wanted to know if it was true. As a point of fact, it appears that that did not happen yesterday. His claim, as near as I can tell, is false, or at the very least he meant it in a far more figurative and less literal way than I originally imagined. If you mistook that query for fact as being an “apologist”, I don’t know what to tell you except that it was not meant as such. ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2017, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444/272 "2017-08-13T15:26:23Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > I do not like Nazis, or genocide, or chants for murder of people, or assholes who run people over who are exercising their First Amendment rights. That being said, Larry made a pretty specific claim, that people were ‘chanting for the murder of Jews and non-whites’. I hadn’t heard that anywhere else and wanted to know if it was true. As a point of fact, it appears that that did not happen yesterday. His claim, as near as I can tell, is false, or at the very least he meant it in a far more figurative and less literal way than I originally imagined. If you mistook that query for fact as being an “apologist”, I don’t know what to tell you except that it was not meant as such. You said it would be ‘‘pretty egregious’’ if they were chanting for the murder of Jews. Do you understand that carrying a Nazi flag is the exact same thing, ethically speaking, as chanting for the murder of Jews? There is no ethical distinction between those two things. Why would one disturb you more than the other? That’s what I don’t understand. ---
**Author:** ![Merneith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/57b2e6/32.png) [@Merneith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merneith)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2017, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444/273 "2017-08-13T15:29:44Z")
Pretending that Nazis chanting “blood & soil” - an historic phrase used to rally support for the institutional murder of anyone who wasn’t a Nazi - is not “calling for murder” is, in fact, supporting the Nazis. For the record, HurricaneDitka, the Nazis weren’t just the ones pulling the levers in the gas houses. Real Nazis were the many thousands of people who never bothered to take action but who quietly made excuses for Nazi atrocities. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2017, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444/274 "2017-08-13T15:30:20Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > I do not like Nazis, or genocide, or chants for murder of people, or assholes who run people over who are exercising their First Amendment rights. That being said, Larry made a pretty specific claim, that people were ‘chanting for the murder of Jews and non-whites’. I hadn’t heard that anywhere else and wanted to know if it was true. As a point of fact, it appears that that did not happen yesterday. His claim, as near as I can tell, is false, or at the very least he meant it in a far more figurative and less literal way than I originally imagined. If you mistook that query for fact as being an “apologist”, I don’t know what to tell you except that it was not meant as such. I don’t know if they were chanting, but the symbols they were carrying can quite reasonably be interpreted as an overt endorsement of genocide. ---
**Author:** ![davidm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidm/32/225_2.png) [@davidm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davidm)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2017, 3:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444/275 "2017-08-13T15:42:29Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > I imagine you can appreciate the significant differences between “you will not replace us” and “murder Jews and non-whites”, right? Just how do you think they want to stop this supposed replacement? At the very least they’re arguing for forced mass deportation. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2017, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444/276 "2017-08-13T15:52:45Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > I’m not well-versed in Nazi terminology, but I certainly wouldn’t try to make the leap to equate “blood and soil” with “murder Jews and non-whites”, but it’s possible I’m just ignorant. And yet you knew it was “Nazi terminology” before being informed that it wasn’t just an obscure catchphrase. Let’s go to the quarry and throw stuff down there! How convenient is that for you? ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2017, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444/277 "2017-08-13T15:58:18Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > I appreciate the information. Did I miss the “murder” bit or was it not in there? Well, as a matter of historical record the Nazi version of eugenics did involve murdering people but that’s something you get from studying history, not isolated phrases. ---
**Author:** ![Sattua](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sattua/32/11906_2.png) [@Sattua](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sattua)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2017, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444/278 "2017-08-13T16:01:22Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > I do not like Nazis, or genocide, or chants for murder of people, or assholes who run people over who are exercising their First Amendment rights. That being said, Larry made a pretty specific claim, that people were ‘chanting for the murder of Jews and non-whites’. I hadn’t heard that anywhere else and wanted to know if it was true. As a point of fact, it appears that that did not happen yesterday. His claim, as near as I can tell, is false, or at the very least he meant it in a far more figurative and less literal way than I originally imagined. If you mistook that query for fact as being an “apologist”, I don’t know what to tell you except that it was not meant as such. This is disingenuous apologism. > [@Merneith](#): > > Pretending that Nazis chanting “blood & soil” - an historic phrase used to rally support for the institutional murder of anyone who wasn’t a Nazi - is not “calling for murder” is, in fact, supporting the Nazis. And this is why. ---
**Author:** ![TokyoBayer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tokyobayer/32/13989_2.png) [@TokyoBayer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TokyoBayer)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2017, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444/279 "2017-08-13T16:04:16Z")
> [@Ann\_Hedonia](#): > > I hope you realize that my post was sarcasm. Of course. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2017, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444/280 "2017-08-13T16:06:50Z")
> [@Spice\_Weasel](#): > > You said it would be ‘‘pretty egregious’’ if they were chanting for the murder of Jews. Do you understand that carrying a Nazi flag is the exact same thing, ethically speaking, as chanting for the murder of Jews? There is no ethical distinction between those two things. Why would one disturb you more than the other? That’s what I don’t understand. I think there are more than one possible interpretation of displaying a Nazi flag. For example, I have a close friend that participates in WWII re-enactment. He happens to participate with an American armor unit, but they re-enact battles with people who are participating as German military units, as Nazis. That sometimes includes the display of a Nazi flag. The people that are displaying those Nazi flags are certainly not, in my opinion, calling for genocide, and I see a vast ethical distinction between what they’re doing and “chanting for the murder of Jews”. YMMV. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444.md?page=13) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444.md?page=15)