# "Unite the Right" white nationalist march: Ugliness on full display. **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [August 12, 2017, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444 "2017-08-12T15:06:30Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 28
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 12:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444/541 "2017-08-15T00:40:09Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > The “pedantics regarding neo-nazis and whether or not they were literally or figuratively chanting threats against jews and people of colour” were mostly because I thought we were, at the time in a “breaking news” thread and I wanted the information to be as accurate as possible. Then you should have provided correct information. You didn’t. All you did was square up and challenge people in this thread; you assumed an adversarial stance from the first post you made here. And you’ve mostly continued that stance. > [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > In hindsight, it was probably a bad place to try and make that point, and further points about the possible nuanced meanings of a Nazi flag display were probably not appropriate for the time and venue. I generally hope that Dopers can overcome their emotions and respond logically, but I’ve realized that’s not always the case. Probably less so in any thread regarding Nazis, and even less so when people have been physically harmed by a Nazi, and particularly so when one of those injured is married to one of our own Dopers. > > In the future I’ll try to limit my pedantry to times and places a little less swamped with emotion. IMO you don’t seem to have been trying to make any point in this thread other than “ha! gotcha!” And then you act bemused by the push back to your push. It’s been hilarious to watch. Thanks! ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 12:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444/542 "2017-08-15T00:45:08Z")
> [@Evil\_Economist](#): > > …and we’ll find out what percentage of Americans are down with the Nazis. I **suspect** it’s not a large percentage. You misspelled “hope”. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Stainless\_Steel\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_stainless_steel_rat/32/5727_2.png) [@The\_Stainless\_Steel\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Stainless_Steel_Rat)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 12:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444/543 "2017-08-15T00:47:23Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > [Update: It’s cancelled.](http://reverepress.com/news/texas-cancels-white-lives-matter-rally/) Good. But before I count those chickens, I’ll wait for the inevitable court fight. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444/544 "2017-08-15T01:02:15Z")
> [@The\_Stainless\_Steel\_Rat](#): > > … > What could possibly go wrong? These fucknuts sure seem to prefer college towns for their rallies. I wonder why that is. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 1:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444/545 "2017-08-15T01:50:36Z")
Cannon fodder. Angry young men make great cannon fodder. College campuses are a place to find angry young men. ---
**Author:** ![Defensive\_Indifference](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/defensive_indifference/32/6502_2.png) [@Defensive\_Indifference](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Defensive_Indifference)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 1:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444/546 "2017-08-15T01:58:55Z")
In Durham, NC, a group of protesters has pulled down a monument to Confederate soldiers. > **[WATCH: Protesters pull down Confederate statue in North Carolina](https://www.pbs.org/newshour/nation/watch-protesters-pull-confederate-statue-north-carolina)** > > A group of protesters in Durham, North Carolina, toppled a Confederate monument Monday evening, local media reported. While I empathize with them and share the goal of having Confederate monuments removed, I have to think this is a bad idea. First, I fear it’s an escalation that’s going to fuel some kind of reprisal from the right wing thugs. Second, I’m afraid it’s going to spark more DIY monument removal, and it’s probably only a matter of time before we see some college kid crushed under a couple tons of bronze. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Economist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c89c15/32.png) [@Evil\_Economist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Economist)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 2:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444/547 "2017-08-15T02:14:25Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > Did I say that somewhere? Or is this more false attribution? Well, you tell me. You said, in response to the description of people chanting for the murder of Jews and non-whites, and I quote, “I have no doubt there are despicable people in the world, but I think I missed the part where a crowd in Virginia was “chanting for the murder of Jews and non-whites”” So which group of despicable people were you talking about? Let’s consider the options: [ol] [li]Most, but not all, were white people[/li][li]Most, but not all, were men[/li][li]Many, but not all, were college-aged[/li][li]Many, but not all, were Nazis[/li][li]Many, but not all, were white supremacists [/li][li]Every single one of them was a Trump supporter[/li][/ol] So now you want to go back in time and claim that the people you were calling despicable were Nazis, but “Nazism” isn’t really the common denominator of that group, is it? The only common denominator is support of President Trump; that’s the only thing they all had in common. Now you’re claiming that you were calling Nazis despicable. But you didn’t actually say “Nazis”, did you? In fact, the only logical group that you could have been calling despicable was “Trump supporters”, and I was agreeing with you. Now, it turns out that you did actually intend to mean that Nazis were despicable, and thank you for clearing that up. But to claim that you were clearly referencing Nazis at the time you wrote the post is just not supported by the facts. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 2:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444/548 "2017-08-15T02:25:44Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > One thing that the article touches on, which also surprises me, is that of the 43 wrost mass killings in the U.S. since 1984, a third of them were committed by service members or former service members. I had never heard that before. How much of the population of the US is or has been in the military? … Unca Google took me to see a lady who appears to be Unca Cecil’s long lost sister, [Aunt Mona](https://fivethirtyeight.com/datalab/what-percentage-of-americans-have-served-in-the-military/). She says it’s about 7%; separating by gender it’s 13.4% of men and 1.4% of women. OK, so the ratio for “[del]people[/del]men who have performed mass killings and have military training” is 2.5 times that. But in a way it’s “only” 2.5 times that; it isn’t terribly disproportionate, as ratios go. One of the big problems of military and police forces is “how do you train someone to be ready to shoot at somebody else, but at the same time train them to do it only when the society they live in consider it appropriate.” If the amount of former burger flippers among mass killers were 2.5 times as high as that in the general population I’d be surprised; that this happens to happen with people who’ve had military training saddens me but doesn’t surprise me terribly. ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 2:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444/549 "2017-08-15T02:33:14Z")
> [@Nava](#): > > How much of the population of the US is or has been in the military? > > … Unca Google took me to see a lady who appears to be Unca Cecil’s long lost sister, [Aunt Mona](https://fivethirtyeight.com/datalab/what-percentage-of-americans-have-served-in-the-military/). She says it’s about 7%; separating by gender it’s 13.4% of men and 1.4% of women. > > OK, so the ratio for “[del]people[/del]men who have performed mass killings and have military training” is 2.5 times that. But in a way it’s “only” 2.5 times that; it isn’t terribly disproportionate, as ratios go. One of the big problems of military and police forces is “how do you train someone to be ready to shoot at somebody else, but at the same time train them to do it only when the society they live in consider it appropriate.” If the amount of former burger flippers among mass killers were 2.5 times as high as that in the general population I’d be surprised; that this happens to happen with people who’ve had military training saddens me but doesn’t surprise me terribly. Not only that but it just makes sense that a mentally disturbed person with regular access and experience with a gun would be more likely to use it than a mentally disturbed person with less access and experience. There may also be an element of combat experience normalizing violence, but it’s probably a stretch to assume all of these shooters have combat experience. ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 2:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444/550 "2017-08-15T02:35:24Z")
> [@The\_Stainless\_Steel\_Rat](#): > > Good. But before I count those chickens, I’ll wait for the inevitable court fight. At first blush it sounds like they might have a case. It doesn’t sound like the school anticipated a specific threat, just, ‘‘oh, things might turn violent.’’ Is that a heckler’s veto? I’m no scholar of constitutional law. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 2:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444/551 "2017-08-15T02:36:58Z")
> [@Spice\_Weasel](#): > > Not only that but it just makes sense that a mentally disturbed person with regular access and experience with a gun would be more likely to use it than a mentally disturbed person with less access and experience. There may also be an element of combat experience normalizing violence, but it’s probably a stretch to assume all of these shooters have combat experience. Some of them may, like the guy with the car (now charged with second degree murder), have washed out. Which more often than not seems to mean “was found to be not quite mentally fit”, based on anecdata from both military personnel and washouts. ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 2:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444/552 "2017-08-15T02:37:46Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > But, to offer a different example, there was a young Asian man who gave a rather passionate speech one night during Shia LeBeouf’s failed “He Will Not Divide Us” exhibit about (IIRC) the damage the Left’s identity politics had caused. He concluded with the phrase “Sieg Heil motherf\*\*\*ers”. Is he a Nazi? Do you feel comfortable assuming that he was actually advocating for genocide based off that one ironic use of a Nazi slogan? …are you talking about Ian Miles Cheong? (Not to be confused with Arthur Chu.) Who is on record as saying “Hitler is my fucking idol” and said “holocaust isn’t important enough to capitalize because jews=nothing?” The guy who jumped the gun and doxxed the wrong driver of the car in Charleston? You may have picked the wrong “young Asian man” to ask this question about. ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 2:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444/553 "2017-08-15T02:41:55Z")
> [@Banquet\_Bear](#): > > …are you talking about Ian Miles Cheong? (Not to be confused with Arthur Chu.) Who is on record as saying “Hitler is my fucking idol” and said “holocaust isn’t important enough to capitalize because jews=nothing?” The guy who jumped the gun and doxxed the wrong driver of the car in Charleston? You may have picked the wrong “young Asian man” to ask this question about. Oh, the ironing. So delicious. **Banquet Bear** , I’ve been meaning to ask you about your name. Because I always think of [this](http://images5.fanpop.com/image/photos/30800000/Mystery-solved-people-avatar-the-legend-of-korra-30873195-500-333.gif) fellow. ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 2:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444/554 "2017-08-15T02:43:28Z")
> [@Nava](#): > > Some of them may, like the guy with the car (now charged with second degree murder), have washed out. Which more often than not seems to mean “was found to be not quite mentally fit”, based on anecdata from both military personnel and washouts. Okay, so we might also theorize that people who like violence might view joining the army as an easy way to be violent. Then the army realizes they are bugnuts and washes them out. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 2:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444/555 "2017-08-15T02:52:02Z")
> [@Evil\_Economist](#): > > …Every single one of them was a Trump supporter… I’m curious how you ascertained this. Mind reading? Did you or someone poll every single protester? There are all sorts of crazy folks that show up at virtually any large gathering or rally. People trying to promote their anti-vaxxing views, or their flat-earth views, or their evil-white-people views. I think it’s an unsupported claim that “every single one of them was a Trump supporter”, unless you’ve got some evidence to support it. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 2:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444/556 "2017-08-15T02:57:23Z")
> [@Banquet\_Bear](#): > > …are you talking about Ian Miles Cheong? (Not to be confused with Arthur Chu.) Who is on record as saying “Hitler is my fucking idol” and said “holocaust isn’t important enough to capitalize because jews=nothing?” The guy who jumped the gun and doxxed the wrong driver of the car in Charleston? You may have picked the wrong “young Asian man” to ask this question about. I have no idea about the young man’s name or background. It was a ~5-minute video of a speech I saw concluding with the Nazi slogan I mentioned earlier. I seem to remember reading a MSM story about the young man later, in which he said he hoped people understood it was intended ironic. Perhaps you know about the young video I’m talking about and he really is a Nazi. I don’t know. ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 3:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444/557 "2017-08-15T03:00:50Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > I’m curious how you ascertained this. Mind reading? Did you or someone poll every single protester? There are all sorts of crazy folks that show up at virtually any large gathering or rally. People trying to promote their anti-vaxxing views, or their flat-earth views, or their evil-white-people views. I think it’s an unsupported claim that “every single one of them was a Trump supporter”, unless you’ve got some evidence to support it. Do you think most of the people there supported Trump? The rally was, after all, called Unite the Right, and David Duke announced the gathering was intended as a realization of Trump’s goals, or whatever. If you can agree that _most_ of the people there supported Trump, then this nitpicking is probably a pointless diversion. (Remember? Responding to the spirit of what people say? That whole thing?) ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 3:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444/558 "2017-08-15T03:06:02Z")
> [@Spice\_Weasel](#): > > Do you think most of the people there supported Trump? The rally was, after all, called Unite the Right, and David Duke announced the gathering was intended as a realization of Trump’s goals, or whatever. If you can agree that _most_ of the people there supported Trump, then this nitpicking is probably a pointless diversion. (Remember? Responding to the spirit of what people say? That whole thing?) Yes, I think most of them probably did vote for Trump. And I really was trying to focus on the main point (ETA: the “spirit”) of Evil Economist’s post. He said, “The only common denominator is support of President Trump; that’s the only thing they all had in common.” I took that as the central point of his post. He was drawing a very clear distinction between what most of them were, and, in his view, the one thing that they _ALL_ were. It’s one that I think is probably inaccurate. It would have seemed more accurate to say “Most, but not all, were Trump supporters”. ---
**Author:** ![Okrahoma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/90db22/32.png) [@Okrahoma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Okrahoma)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 3:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444/559 "2017-08-15T03:18:24Z")
> [@Banquet\_Bear](#): > > …are you talking about Ian Miles Cheong? (Not to be confused with Arthur Chu.) Who is on record as saying “Hitler is my fucking idol” and said “holocaust isn’t important enough to capitalize because jews=nothing?” The guy who jumped the gun and doxxed the wrong driver of the car in Charleston? You may have picked the wrong “young Asian man” to ask this question about. > [@Spice\_Weasel](#): > > Oh, the ironing. So delicious. The “ironing” is wrong. The name is Eugene Li, and the video in question is [here](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iz2NfmRSQc4). The original video that he’s talking about is [here](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y7wHGDYabq0). Sorry to spoil your delicious “gotcha”. ---
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 3:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444/560 "2017-08-15T03:21:26Z")
Google and Go Daddy have banned the Daily Stormer after their website attacked Charlottesville victim Heather Heyer and made derogatory statements about her. > **[GoDaddy, Google ban neo-Nazi site Daily Stormer for 'violating' terms of service](https://www.chicagotribune.com/business/ct-godaddy-bans-daily-stormer-20170814-story.html)** > > After months of criticism that GoDaddy was providing a platform for hate speech, the Web hosting company announced late Sunday that it will no longer house the [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444.md?page=27) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/unite-the-right-white-nationalist-march-ugliness-on-full-display/793444.md?page=29)