# United airlines brutally removes passenger after overbooking flight **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [April 10, 2017, 2:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/united-airlines-brutally-removes-passenger-after-overbooking-flight/784171 "2017-04-10T14:04:06Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 12
**Author:** ![Musicat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/musicat/32/20189_2.png) [@Musicat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Musicat)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2017, 9:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/united-airlines-brutally-removes-passenger-after-overbooking-flight/784171/221 "2017-04-10T21:32:22Z")
Onceuponatime, longlongago, I recall an airline that initiated a new booking policy for a popular route. They promised that if you showed up at the gate in time and paid your fare, you would have a seat on a plane to the planned destination, no advance bookings needed or accepted. On the first day of the new policy, exactly one more passenger arrived at the gate than the plane could hold. The airline made good on their promise, and rolled out another plane. The news article said he rode in “solitary splendor” to his destination. The favorable publicity was priceless. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2017, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/united-airlines-brutally-removes-passenger-after-overbooking-flight/784171/222 "2017-04-10T21:38:29Z")
> [@Musicat](#): > > Onceuponatime, longlongago, I recall an airline that initiated a new booking policy for a popular route. They promised that if you showed up at the gate in time and paid your fare, you would have a seat on a plane to the planned destination, no advance bookings needed or accepted. > > On the first day of the new policy, exactly one more passenger arrived at the gate than the plane could hold. The airline made good on their promise, and rolled out another plane. The news article said he rode in “solitary splendor” to his destination. > > The favorable publicity was priceless. 1. What airline did this? 2. Did they ever do it again? ---
**Author:** ![Idle\_Thoughts](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/838e76/32.png) [@Idle\_Thoughts](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Idle_Thoughts)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2017, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/united-airlines-brutally-removes-passenger-after-overbooking-flight/784171/223 "2017-04-10T21:43:28Z")
> [@stpauler](#): > > Man sues cat has 3,240,000 results. Hey, I was one of those, buddy! > [@Czarcasm](#): > > If you were to guess how many of those were actual flyers instead of anonymous me-tooers, then how many of _those_ flew that airline, then how many of _those_ would carry through on their threat instead of just doing whatever was cheapest and/or most convenient when the time came to book a flight, what would be your best guess? I’m not bothering to read anything you wrote here, because it’s all beside the point. The statement made was “Nobody is going to stop flying” and my answer is “So far, we have at least 20,000 people saying they will here…whether or not they’re actually telling the truth”. So “nobody” (I.E. zero) and “20,000” is a pretty big difference in numbers. That’s the only point I was making and care to make. Beyond that, I don’t wish to get involved in any debate or arguing about it. You can go away from this “winning”, for all I care. Feel free to massively pick apart and question this post too, while you’re at it. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2017, 9:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/united-airlines-brutally-removes-passenger-after-overbooking-flight/784171/224 "2017-04-10T21:48:38Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > About there being no cases where people were wrongly deplaned under deboarding rules? > Where did he say that? He said “That’s a compelling suit”. “”\*It’s pretty outrageous," said Jim Keindler an aviation lawyer with Kreindler & Kreindler in New York for 34 years… Kreindler has seen just about everything over the course of three and a half decades representing air travelers, so when I saw the video, I called to ask what he thought. “That’s a compelling suit,” he told me explaining, “For United to decide an employee’s presence is more important than a doctor seeing patients is pretty wild…But even if the passenger isn’t a doctor, Kreindler says the airline does not have the right to evict passengers without cause. “First of all its wrong, it’s their problem to get their people where they have to be to work, work from even if it means flying them on another carrier. They shouldn’t be forcibly removing people by lottery,” he said.”" \* ---
**Author:** ![Beren\_Erchamion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/90ced4/32.png) [@Beren\_Erchamion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beren_Erchamion)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2017, 9:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/united-airlines-brutally-removes-passenger-after-overbooking-flight/784171/225 "2017-04-10T21:52:58Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > He said “That’s a compelling suit”. “”\*It’s pretty outrageous," said Jim Keindler an aviation lawyer with Kreindler & Kreindler in New York for 34 years… Kreindler has seen just about everything over the course of three and a half decades representing air travelers, so when I saw the video, I called to ask what he thought. “That’s a compelling suit,” he told me explaining, “For United to decide an employee’s presence is more important than a doctor seeing patients is pretty wild…But even if the passenger isn’t a doctor, Kreindler says the airline does not have the right to evict passengers without cause. “First of all its wrong, it’s their problem to get their people where they have to be to work, work from even if it means flying them on another carrier. They shouldn’t be forcibly removing people by lottery,” he said.”" > \* [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/mwWAsNZTnug/hqdefault.jpg "Bob Loblaw - English") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mwWAsNZTnug) ---
**Author:** ![Okrahoma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/90db22/32.png) [@Okrahoma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Okrahoma)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2017, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/united-airlines-brutally-removes-passenger-after-overbooking-flight/784171/226 "2017-04-10T21:58:17Z")
> [@Bone](#): > > I’ve never had to do that so that’s news to me! Lately I’ve only flown Southwest for work and there was usually tiered pricing for the options you mentioned. The lowest fare was always the, no choice or changes, no cancellations or refunds. That’s the one I get for work since if I miss that…it’s just me. When I go on family vacations I tend to get the insurance. AFAIK (and I used that several times) Southwest is one of the few (only?) airlines where canceling the ticket will get you full credit for the value of the ticket on your future purchases of tickets, I think, for one year. ---
**Author:** ![rat\_avatar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rat_avatar/32/255_2.png) [@rat\_avatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rat_avatar)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2017, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/united-airlines-brutally-removes-passenger-after-overbooking-flight/784171/227 "2017-04-10T21:58:22Z")
While I am not justifying the passengers actions at all, why didn’t the airline offer the $800 deal over the intercom asking for volunteers? Note I don’t buy the idea that overbooking is required for cheap fares, they could simply move to a penally for no shows without just cause. They couldn’t do so during the days of paper tickets due to the agreements to honor other airlines tickets but that ship sailed a long time ago. (I use to abuse that privilege volunteering to be bumped on an economy airline and walking over to United gate back in the day) ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2017, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/united-airlines-brutally-removes-passenger-after-overbooking-flight/784171/228 "2017-04-10T21:58:22Z")
> [@Musicat](#): > > Onceuponatime, longlongago, I recall an airline that initiated a new booking policy for a popular route. They promised that if you showed up at the gate in time and paid your fare, you would have a seat on a plane to the planned destination, no advance bookings needed or accepted. > > On the first day of the new policy, exactly one more passenger arrived at the gate than the plane could hold. The airline made good on their promise, and rolled out another plane. The news article said he rode in “solitary splendor” to his destination. > > The favorable publicity was priceless. Is “once upon a time, long long ago” code to indicate that what follows is a fairy tale? (To be abundantly clear, I’m not accusing you of lying, I’m just not sure if you are being serious.) Airlines do not have an extra aircraft and crew just sitting around ready to go on a few moments notice; nor are departure slots available at short notice at major airports. If you think this really happened, do you have a cite? ---
**Author:** ![rat\_avatar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rat_avatar/32/255_2.png) [@rat\_avatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rat_avatar)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2017, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/united-airlines-brutally-removes-passenger-after-overbooking-flight/784171/229 "2017-04-10T22:00:12Z")
> [@Riemann](#): > > Is “once upon a time” a coded cue that what follows is a fairy tale? > > Airlines do not have an extra aircraft and crew just sitting around ready to go on a few moments notice; nor are departure slots available at short notice at major airports. They do have an “extra board” but I am not saying they had that option this time. ---
**Author:** ![Bone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bone/32/407_2.png) [@Bone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bone)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2017, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/united-airlines-brutally-removes-passenger-after-overbooking-flight/784171/230 "2017-04-10T22:13:42Z")
[Delta had a potential solution since 2011.](http://www.pbs.org/newshour/making-sense/how-delta-masters-the-game-of-overbooking-flights/) > [@](#): > > Delta started this practice back in 2011, and it works like this: When passengers on overbooked flights check in online or at the check-in kiosk, they’re asked what the dollar value of the travel voucher they would accept as compensation for volunteering their seats. They give you a hint, too — “Delta accepts lower bids first.” By the time you reach the gate, the gate attendants already have a list of passengers to call up to confirm they’ll fly standby. If your bid is low enough, you’ll be on that list. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2017, 10:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/united-airlines-brutally-removes-passenger-after-overbooking-flight/784171/231 "2017-04-10T22:17:04Z")
> [@Bone](#): > > [Delta had a potential solution since 2011.](http://www.pbs.org/newshour/making-sense/how-delta-masters-the-game-of-overbooking-flights/) Nice! That works for me! ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2017, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/united-airlines-brutally-removes-passenger-after-overbooking-flight/784171/232 "2017-04-10T22:20:47Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > If you were to guess how many of those were actual flyers instead of anonymous me-tooers, then how many of _those_ flew that airline, then how many of _those_ would carry through on their threat instead of just doing whatever was cheapest and/or most convenient when the time came to book a flight, what would be your best guess? My honest guess would be significantly more than add up to $800. I know people who have blacklisted airlines for less (and I, easygoing myself, even have one airline, Spirit, which I will never fly, no matter how cheap.) I don’t think it’s a stretch that this will be a net loss for them. ---
**Author:** ![Musicat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/musicat/32/20189_2.png) [@Musicat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Musicat)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2017, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/united-airlines-brutally-removes-passenger-after-overbooking-flight/784171/233 "2017-04-10T22:21:07Z")
> [@Riemann](#): > > Is “once upon a time, long long ago” code to indicate that what follows is a fairy tale? (To be abundantly clear, I’m not accusing you of lying, I’m just not sure if you are being serious.) > > Airlines do not have an extra aircraft and crew just sitting around ready to go on a few moments notice; nor are departure slots available at short notice at major airports. If you think this really happened, do you have a cite? No cite, just memory. I think it was in a Time mag article because I got most of my news from that source. And if the airline was trying to promote their “walk right in, sit right down, Baby, let us take you there…” service, I find it quite logical that they were prepared for overflow. At least the first few times. > [@Czarcasm](#): > > 1. What airline did this? > 2. Did they ever do it again? I wish I knew, but I don’t. The phrase “he rode in solitary splendor” sticks in my mind. You can treat it as a fairy tale if you wish. I don’t find it impossible or even unlikely when promotion is paramount. Does anyone else recall a time (1970’s?) when airlines tried this kind of service on heavily traveled medium/short distance commuter routes, like Wash DC to NYC or DC to Miami, etc.? ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2017, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/united-airlines-brutally-removes-passenger-after-overbooking-flight/784171/234 "2017-04-10T22:29:00Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > My honest guess would be significantly more than add up to $800. I know people who have blacklisted airlines for less (and I, easygoing myself, even have one airline, Spirit, which I will never fly, no matter how cheap.) I don’t think it’s a stretch that this will be a net loss for them. ETA: Not $800, but whatever the next level of compensation would be. ---
**Author:** ![Musicat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/musicat/32/20189_2.png) [@Musicat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Musicat)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2017, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/united-airlines-brutally-removes-passenger-after-overbooking-flight/784171/235 "2017-04-10T22:29:36Z")
My memory might not be so faulty after all. From the [New York Times](http://www.nytimes.com/1981/04/12/magazine/winging-it-to-washington.html?pagewanted=all), 1981 (my bolding): > [@](#): > > Eastern officials would like to see a repetition of the free publicity of the early days when the logistics finally broke so that **one passenger was left over from a full flight and thus commanded the entire passenger compartment of a second plane.** The first such passenger, fairly leaped upon by airline publicity agents in 1961, balked when he considered the privilege. ‘‘I won’t do it,’’ he is recorded to have told company officials. ‘‘You people must be crazy -using a whole crew and plane to take one guy to Washington.’’ The airline had to wait some time for a more cooperative leftover to garner the publicity. **There have been about 50 such single-passenger flights,** according to company records, but none in the past decade since the original Constellation propeller planes were retired and larger planes - DC-9’s and 727’s - put into service. So **Czarcasm,** 1) Eastern, and 2) yes, often. No fairy tale. ---
**Author:** ![Okrahoma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/90db22/32.png) [@Okrahoma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Okrahoma)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2017, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/united-airlines-brutally-removes-passenger-after-overbooking-flight/784171/236 "2017-04-10T22:32:17Z")
> [@Musicat](#): > > I wish I knew, but I don’t. The phrase “he rode in solitary splendor” sticks in my mind. You can treat it as a fairy tale if you wish. I don’t find it impossible or even unlikely when promotion is paramount. I remember flying some time in 1980, I believe it was from NYC to Chicago, and there were maybe 10 people on the flight. Some kind of Boeing plane. “Solitary splendor” was close enough. That never happens anymore. ---
**Author:** ![Folly](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/folly/32/3219_2.png) [@Folly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Folly)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2017, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/united-airlines-brutally-removes-passenger-after-overbooking-flight/784171/237 "2017-04-10T22:37:49Z")
> [@Musicat](#): > > My memory might not be so faulty after all. From the [New York Times](http://www.nytimes.com/1981/04/12/magazine/winging-it-to-washington.html?pagewanted=all), 1981 (my bolding):So **Czarcasm,** 1) Eastern, and 2) yes, often. No fairy tale. This one is kind of similar and has your magic phrase. 🙂 [http://www.nytimes.com/1979/03/18/archives/a-747-of-ones-ownny-to-paris-in-solitary-splendor.html](http://www.nytimes.com/1979/03/18/archives/a-747-of-ones-ownny-to-paris-in-solitary-splendor.html) ---
**Author:** ![Idle\_Thoughts](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/838e76/32.png) [@Idle\_Thoughts](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Idle_Thoughts)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2017, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/united-airlines-brutally-removes-passenger-after-overbooking-flight/784171/238 "2017-04-10T22:38:49Z")
I once flew a flight that took off about 9 or 10pm (I forget where to where) and it was a large plane, but only about 95 passengers. I remember everyone pretty much had an whole seating section to themselves…there were also entire rows that were empty. ---
**Author:** ![jaycat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jaycat/32/3015_2.png) [@jaycat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jaycat)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2017, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/united-airlines-brutally-removes-passenger-after-overbooking-flight/784171/239 "2017-04-10T22:39:31Z")
I sell thingumabobs for a living. Today I sold out all of my thingumabobs early in the day. Later on a guy showed up saying “I am a REALLY IMPORTANT PERSON and I need me some thingumabobs RIGHT NOW.” So naturally I went to the home of another not-so-important customer who had bought a thingumabob earlier in the day, broke down the door and forcefully repossessed his thingumabob so I could sell it to the REALLY IMPORTANT PERSON . . . ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2017, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/united-airlines-brutally-removes-passenger-after-overbooking-flight/784171/240 "2017-04-10T22:39:32Z")
> [@Okrahoma](#): > > I remember flying some time in 1980, I believe it was from NYC to Chicago, and there were maybe 10 people on the flight. Some kind of Boeing plane. “Solitary splendor” was close enough. > > That never happens anymore. True. That said, sometime in the early 2000s, I did manage to get an 8-hour leg of an international flight where I had the entire middle section of seats to myself. It was glorious. Probably the only time I slept for hours on a flight as I got four seats to splay myself over. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/united-airlines-brutally-removes-passenger-after-overbooking-flight/784171.md?page=11) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/united-airlines-brutally-removes-passenger-after-overbooking-flight/784171.md?page=13)