Sorry. I bypassed the Dao is not a hero part. It seems to me that ANY paying passenger’ rights supersede any “hitchin a ride” crew member’s rights any day of the week. Either that, or don’t book a certain number of seats in case flight crew need them. If they don’t offer them up as stand by. Cheap bastards. Which is ironic, because it’s probably going to cost a lot more in providing a place to stay/upgrades. And in this case, for United, there’s all that lost business and lawsuit money to pay out.
In the gargantuan MPSIMS thread, someone copied/pasted a likely/plausible scenario from an air travel discussion forum involving a plane with mechanical problems. If you’re interested you can browse through the thread to look for it, but it seemed very possible that UA really didn’t know until then that they needed to get these four crew members to Louisville on that particular flight.
I admit that’s a likely speculation as well.
Reading between the lines, and with absolutely no knowledge of how things work in the industry:
It’s clear a ball was dropped. I have read that the crew knew roughly an hour ahead of time that they needed to be on THIS flight. What I am not sure of is whether or not notifying the gate ASAP was de rigeur once the crew was notified.
I have also read (nothing official, just a comment somewhere) that the crew assumed that just making it to the plane barely before take off would be sufficient. If you’re asking me, though … if I were one of the crew rushing to make it to that flight, I’d want the gate agent notified as soon as humanly possible.
Not if you don’t really give a crap, because you know that you are the numero-uno priority, and you know that someone will be kicked off to accommodate you.
If this is company policy (to treat paying passengers like crap), sooner or later, the flight crew and gate agents will tend to get sloppy, knowing that they hold all the cards. It does not matter (to them) one whit; they will kick off the paying passengers whenever it is convenient FOR THE STAFF. In addition to breeding a “who gives a shit” attitude about the timing, it also will tend to give the flight crews (and gate staff) a sense of superiority to the cattle that they are transporting. This superior attitude will come out when anyone dares question their Holy Authority.
I assume that United Airlines will conduct a careful investigation of everything that happened, including the reason the seats were needed at the last minute. But we may never know the results of that process.
As for this, they’re already changed the rules so that crew need to be present an hour before any flight they need to take (as non-revenue passengers).
This is a good start to changing the corporate sense of entitlement that seems to pervade many airlines. They seem to be of the opinion that the company exists to fly the airline staff around, and that the paying passengers are just pain-in-the asses who get in the way.
Again, it would then be proactive to leave a few seats open just in case when they’re booking. Certainly less expensive in the long run.
The need for seats for deadheading crew is rare enough that leaving seats open for them would be more expensive than simply paying volunteers enough to give up seats.
Between the TSA security theater nonsense and shit like United just pulled, at least for me driving is an attractive alternative to flying. In 2016 I drove to Philly twice, and Myrtle Beach once. Trips like those used to be done by plane, but lately I’d rather just drive if I can do it in 5 - 7 hours. Saves from needing to rent a car, as well.
Am I an outlier, or are airlines feeling any of this?
You know not long after 9/11 I was on a flight to Tampa from Newark, NJ that got in the air after a delay, started rumbling like crazy around DC and turned around. They asked us to stay on the plane after we landed despite the engine problems. I got very loud about how I wanted off the plane and was unwilling to fly it.
The crew correctly asked me to calm down, said I would not be able to re-board and let me and then another 20-30 passengers leave. No airport security goons. Just trying to calm down a very unhappy and somewhat frightened passenger. This was how an airline should behave.
Oh the flight safely arrived about 2:30am or 12 hours late for a less than 3 hour flight.
Bolding mine.
The enough part is pretty critical. Enough, apparently isn’t.
Due to how much of a bitch flying has become, I think that paying volunteers enough is going to have to be the new business model. That may change the idea of possibly not booking some of the worst seats in the back, and letting must fly crew/standby take/pay for them if they want them and is the only option.
Why not a reverse auction? I’ve heard others mention it. At the gate its announced that the plane is overbooked, and the airline will pay two volunteers. “Who will accept $3,000?” Eight hands go up. “$2500.” Still eight hands. " $2000." Now only three hands.
Etc.
A reverse auction could work. Or, as I heard suggested on a public radio program, they could make an offer or ask for bids via smartphone. That way, none of the passengers knows what the others are willing to accept.
And as mentioned somewhere, Delta apparently asks people upfront what they would want to voluntarily give up their seat.
That was mentioned in the MPSIMS thread.
The problem I see with that, especially at the gate and boarding counter, could be that if $3000 is offered, 10-20 people could try to rush the counter. With their carry-ons. You could really get a mob. “BUT YOU SAID $3000”. “I WAS HERE FIRST”. Ect. and so on.
I think lowballing it first is the way to go.
I identify strongly with this. The Mrs. and I have driven from our place in WI to the Pittsburgh area a few times now, once to Kansas City, and once to Norfolk rather than flown, just to save airport/airline hassles. It leaves us with a car when we get there, and by the time we figure in the delays at airports and associated hassles, it’s worth it to us. Especially since the direct flights tend to be costly premium ones, and the connecting flights have us hopscotching across the continent, covering 3 or more times the actual straight-line distance. But it only works if we’ve the free time.
Fortunately travel pretty well together, are used to grinding out the miles on the turnpikes, get a kick out of taking interesting side-trips, and aren’t intimidated by navigating city traffic.
I do miss the glory days of airline passengers, back in the 1960’s. It was just so damn convenient, and fun too, to fly back then.
Remember when Interstate highways where limited to 55mph under Jimmy C?
Our airport is 100 miles away. Add at least 2 hours to that, actually not getting searched and taking everything that you want to, and a 7-8 hour drive is nothing. Unfortunately, most trips that my wife and I take are around or over 1000 miles. And if we have a lot of gear that we need to take, driving is the way to go.
We are flying to Miami on Sunday. Don’t need anything that won’t fit in overhead bin bags and under the seat. Then we drive to Key West.
The national speed limit was in effect for 20 years, from 1974-1995, enacted under Nixon and repealed under Clinton. Carter was president for only four of those years.
This sort of mentality and policy comes from the top, not the deadheading flight crew. Its not their job to make sure that the passengers are paid enough to deplane voluntarily. Its not their job to tell police how to deplane a passenger without bashing in his face. That is all rightfully laid at the feet of whoever came up with the policy on how to handle overbook situations.
There was a time when most of the middle seats in coach were empty because airlines didn’t overbook like they do now.