# University of Phoenix **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [January 30, 2006, 5:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/university-of-phoenix/342175 "2006-01-30T05:35:22Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![UncleBeer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/977dab/32.png) [@UncleBeer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UncleBeer)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2006, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/university-of-phoenix/342175/21 "2006-01-30T18:51:24Z")
> [@mrald](#): > > Really you spend the first 18 weeks of class trying to figure out what the hell to do and why you are having to do it. Maybe when that is done they think they have you so beat down you will stay and submit… Congratulations! You will be pleased to learn that your college is one of very few which provides real-world experience immediately applicable in the workplace. You need only replace “first 18 weeks of class” with “first 52 weeks of the fiscal year,” for an excellent beginning to a successful career. You’ll have that much-sought leg up on all your job competitors. ---
**Author:** ![Merneith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/57b2e6/32.png) [@Merneith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merneith)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2006, 7:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/university-of-phoenix/342175/22 "2006-01-30T19:41:50Z")
I don’t know what “local” is for you, but many colleges now offer online classes. Sometime they want you to attend a week long seminar, sometimes it’s 100% online. You might have more access to instructors who can explain APA or other things. They’d have a real location and a desk where you could sit down if necessary. Online courses are a great alternative for some people. But maybe a little more face-time would help you out. It might be worth taking another look at schools in your area. Good luck - don’t give up! ---
**Author:** ![vivalostwages](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/d07c76/32.png) [@vivalostwages](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vivalostwages)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2006, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/university-of-phoenix/342175/23 "2006-01-30T20:45:25Z")
I’m not sure what the complaint is here, either. What may seem like an obsession with plagiarism is probably just the same strict policy that applies at all colleges and universities, online or not. Whether it’s APA or MLA, the same standards are in place. If the professors repeatedly discuss the policy, there may be several reasons: \*Some students are not listening. \*Some students do not know what plagiarism is or why it’s wrong. \*The professors are required to include such policies in their courses and syllabi as a CYA measure. \*Students need to know how to work with different formats and how to incorporate others’ words and ideas properly. ---
**Author:** ![Obsidian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/51bf81/32.png) [@Obsidian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Obsidian)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2006, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/university-of-phoenix/342175/24 "2006-01-31T00:09:24Z")
I went to a large, respectable state university. We didn’t have any particular style standard, which frankly I think was a mistake. Most proffessors in my department felt as long as your citations were consistant and contained all relevant information, you were okay. I followed MLA because I’m anal and need rules. Some people just winged it. Some were successful, some were not. At no point did any of us recieve any consistant instruction. We were all made to understand the university’s academic dishonesty policy. I never felt it was shoved down my throat, just like laws for grown-ups that we’re not beat over the head with. However, I think they’re getting more and more shrill about it. My sister is at community college and she is literally beat over the head with plagarism lectures. They’ve put the fear of God into her, so much so that she felt if she used ANY quotations (no matter how well cited), or recieved any help from anyone else, she would be cheating. I had to convince her that letting me proofread her draft and returning it to her with comments and corrections was not plagarism. Some schools are really overdoing it. ---
**Author:** ![mrald](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/3da27b/32.png) [@mrald](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mrald)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2006, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/university-of-phoenix/342175/25 "2006-01-31T00:49:49Z")
I wasn’t complaing about having to use a format and not cheat… Contrary to popular beleif I am not an idiot. The in structors don’t even know the format… Nevermind sorry I bothered Btw. I got a scholarship back in high school because of writing. WhenI am agitated I don’t write cleary and I have a 3.3 right now. ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2006, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/university-of-phoenix/342175/26 "2006-01-31T01:22:49Z")
> [@mrald](#): > > I wasn’t complaing about having to use a format and not cheat. But your OP stated: > [@mrald](#): > > The school is **obsessed** with plagerisim and their stupid APA format. Which makes me ask you to provide a cite for the following: > [@mrald](#): > > Contrary to popular beleif I am not an idiot. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2006, 1:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/university-of-phoenix/342175/27 "2006-01-31T01:40:14Z")
> [@Obsidian](#): > > My sister is at community college and she is literally beat over the head with plagarism lectures. She should wear a helmet. ---
**Author:** ![mrald](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/3da27b/32.png) [@mrald](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mrald)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2006, 3:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/university-of-phoenix/342175/28 "2006-01-31T03:18:31Z")
Okay,maybe I am an idioit. It isn’t having to use a format and not cheat that is the problem, it is that they focus more on learning the format ( which they aren’t clear in presenting in one absolute way), than they are learning information. For what it is worth I am in the Health Administration program at the moment. I wasn’t complaining that I have to write the way they say. It is just that all I am doing is writing their way and not learning anything new. When I get done and move to the nursing program I am going to, I will have to use another writing format(MLA) altogether. What it boils down too is that I am not happy with my decision to attendend Phoenix, even though I researched it, I am I kind of stuck! ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2006, 3:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/university-of-phoenix/342175/29 "2006-01-31T03:24:29Z")
This person is going to be a nurse?!?! :eek: ---
**Author:** ![mrald](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/3da27b/32.png) [@mrald](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mrald)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2006, 3:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/university-of-phoenix/342175/30 "2006-01-31T03:52:42Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > This person is going to be a nurse?!?! :eek: What does me not being able to grasp and enjoy APA have to do with whether I will be a good nurse? I am a nurse’s aide at the moment, and a good one. I work at a nursing home. I just don’t like this classes I am in! :mad: ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2006, 3:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/university-of-phoenix/342175/31 "2006-01-31T03:54:55Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > This person is going to be a nurse?!?! What do you think **mrald** should do for a career? ---
**Author:** ![Metacom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ecae2f/32.png) [@Metacom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Metacom)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2006, 4:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/university-of-phoenix/342175/32 "2006-01-31T04:12:12Z")
> [@mrald](#): > > What does me not being able to grasp and enjoy APA have to do with whether I will be a good nurse? Not all that much. Don’t take what people say in this forum seriously–we’re a bunch of assholes, unleashed in an arena that transcends civility. Good luck with your studies! We certainly need more nurses. ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2006, 4:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/university-of-phoenix/342175/33 "2006-01-31T04:25:24Z")
> [@mrald](#): > > What does me not being able to grasp and enjoy APA have to do with whether I will be a good nurse? The ability to follow a prescribed procedure, and to make good decisions when a procedure does not fully cover a matter. ---
**Author:** ![Scarlett67](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scarlett67/32/7387_2.png) [@Scarlett67](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scarlett67)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2006, 4:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/university-of-phoenix/342175/34 "2006-01-31T04:39:03Z")
> [@mrald](#): > > WhenI am agitated I don’t write cleary and I have a 3.3 right now. Don’t nurses have to make notes on patient charts? And isn’t nursing a rather high-stress occupation? Seems that clerical accuracy under pressure would be a desirable quality in a nurse. Perhaps scoring on attention to APA is a screening method that doesn’t put actual patients in harm’s way. ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2006, 4:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/university-of-phoenix/342175/35 "2006-01-31T04:49:43Z")
[one time senior technical writer and university English professor]Most of the writing you will do at university and in your career will be geared to a very narrow audience. The key is that you must write for your audience. Anything that stands in the way of your communicating your ideas to your audience is bad. Presently, your audience is your professors, who are used to quickly reading very large amounts of information. It is easier for them to read when the information has a consistent format. If you do not follow the format that they are used to, it will stand in the way of your communicating your ideas. If you want to succeed in your academic writing, take an evening to thoroughly read the APA style guide (or the MLA guide, or whatever guide your audience uses), and then follow it. It is not difficult to follow, and after you write a few papers, it will become second nature. Once you are comfortable with the style guide, you will then be free to focus your intellectual efforts on more substantive issues pertaining to your subject matter. The sooner you master the form, the sooner you will be free to deal with the content. Don’t let irregular form stand in the way of getting your ideas across to your audience.[/one time senior technical writer and university English professor] ---
**Author:** ![mrald](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/3da27b/32.png) [@mrald](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mrald)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2006, 4:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/university-of-phoenix/342175/36 "2006-01-31T04:55:08Z")
Have you ever read nurse’s notes and a doctor’s handwriting? Nurses write all in a shorthand language of their own… which I can do as well. I deal with high stress, to me it is different than agitation. I work well under stress. Nursing procedures are useful and outlined clearly, and are normally the same in every situation. My complaint was that the format was not outlined the same everywhere or the same from each instructor. \*Thank you \*\*Metacom! ---
**Author:** ![Siege](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dbc845/32.png) [@Siege](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siege)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2006, 10:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/university-of-phoenix/342175/37 "2006-01-31T10:27:15Z")
**mrald** , it’s an unfortunate fact of college life that some professors require nonsense. I suppose it teaches a valuable lesson – in business life, I’ve had my share of bosses who require nonsense. Realistically, there’s not much you can do except put up with it until the course is over. I attended a good-sized conventional university. During my freshman year, a very good English teacher broke me of the habit of qualifying almost everything I wrote. My senior year, in a class which required a specified amount of writing, in my first essay I wrote, “Plato was a student of Socrates.” This sentence was marked and “How do you know this?” was written in the margin. I was flabbergasted for a bit, then realized that, in order to pass this class, which I had to do in order to graduate, I was simply going to work out what the professor’s way was and do it that way. I could swing it for a few weeks and the course filled a requirement which was a different piece of nonsense. As a result, I think I either qualified every fact I used in papers for that professor or gave citations for that fact. I know your professors seem to be obfuscating; can you put up with learning their version of APA formatting until you’ve finished the classes you need there? As I said, I know it seems like nonsense, but it’s been my experience that the business world is rife with nonsense, especially of the bureaucratic kind. Good luck, CJ ---
**Author:** ![Siege](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dbc845/32.png) [@Siege](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siege)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2006, 11:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/university-of-phoenix/342175/38 "2006-01-31T11:34:16Z")
One other thing you might want to consider is writing a letter to the University of Phoenix’s administration explaining the difficulties you’ve been having with instructors who require the APA format but who don’t provide the resources for you to use it correctly. You might want to add that as a result of this confusion, you’re considering not taking any more classes through them (aka, “hit them in the wallet”). If you do, make sure the letter is free of grammar and spelling errors. Not only would I run it through a spell checker and a grammar checker, I’d have a friend look it over as well. If the University of Phoenix operates like other colleges and universities, you should have a chance to provide feedback to your instructor at the end of the class. If you do, that would be the perfect time to bring up the problems you had with the APA format and the instructor’s failure to explain it consistently. While it may not help much in the short run, it may get the university and the instructors to make some changes. Even if it doesn’t, you’ve at least tried and you’re not out much. CJ ---
**Author:** ![eleanorigby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ee7513/32.png) [@eleanorigby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eleanorigby)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2006, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/university-of-phoenix/342175/39 "2006-01-31T14:58:48Z")
OK-I’m doing something that I consider tacky, and that’s quoting myself. You are entering a NURSING program that DOESN’T use APA? If I were you-I would take a second and third look at that nursing program. My experience as an undergrad and in the real world tells me that APA is THE format for BSNs, Master’s in Nursing and PhD’s. Get used to it. It’s fairly straightforward–it takes about a day to get used to. Oh, and instructor is one word–not in structor. > [@eleanorigby](#): > > I cut my eye teeth on the APA format. You don’t like it? Try going through a BSN program. You can’t declare the need to pee without a cite! (kinda like here…but I never cite here–no computer skills) something here doesn’t add up. ---
**Author:** ![eleanorigby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ee7513/32.png) [@eleanorigby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eleanorigby)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2006, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/university-of-phoenix/342175/40 "2006-01-31T15:01:59Z")
> [@Scarlett67](#): > > Don’t nurses have to make notes on patient charts? And isn’t nursing a rather high-stress occupation? Seems that clerical accuracy under pressure would be a desirable quality in a nurse. Perhaps scoring on attention to APA is a screening method that doesn’t put actual patients in harm’s way. Nurses don’t use APA on charts or forms. APA is used in the many, many papers that are required throughout nursing school. but you are absolutely correct in the presumption that attention to detail and precision in recording are vital to nursing. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/university-of-phoenix/342175.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/university-of-phoenix/342175.md?page=3)