# US assassinates commanding general of Iran Quds force **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 3, 2020, 2:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-assassinates-commanding-general-of-iran-quds-force/845821 "2020-01-03T02:01:17Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 26
**Author:** ![Pardel-Lux](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pardel-lux/32/20182_2.png) [@Pardel-Lux](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pardel-Lux)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2020, 9:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-assassinates-commanding-general-of-iran-quds-force/845821/501 "2020-01-07T09:31:55Z")
> [@GreenWyvern](#): > > Here’s an interesting piece of information: > > **Soleimani was in Iraq conducting peace negotiations which Trump had requested.** > > [The reason Qassem Soleimani was in Baghdad](https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/qassem-soleimani-death-iran-baghdad-middle-east-iraq-saudi-arabia-a9272901.html) Very interesting: killing a peace envoy makes the whole thing even worse, does it not? Morally, strategically and tactically. Here is Mustafa Salim’s original declaration (via [Twitter](https://twitter.com/Mustafa_salimb/status/1213822979882143744):() And here is a nice [explanation](https://twitter.com/robertjdenault/status/1213839075628716033)of what Trump might want to bury with this reckless decision, if such a complicated reasoning can be expected from him: A Deutsche Bank whistleblower declared that the loans he got from the Deutsche Bank were underwritten by the Russian State. Via Twitter again. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2020, 9:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-assassinates-commanding-general-of-iran-quds-force/845821/502 "2020-01-07T09:55:07Z")
[35 people killed in stampede at Soleimani’s funeral.](https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2020/01/dozens-killed-stampede-soleimani-funeral-iran-state-tv-200107093406578.html) ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2020, 10:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-assassinates-commanding-general-of-iran-quds-force/845821/503 "2020-01-07T10:25:18Z")
> [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](#): > > Anyway, to put the 5th Avenue thing to rest by just going with it, Trump may not lose support among the End-Timers, but when All of our international allies turn away from us, when his biggest fan base is literally demanding the Apocalypse, when thousands of innocent lives are in immanent danger from the threat of a potential war fomented directly by his unlawful actions, maybe the national interest would be better served by a different, more informed decisionmaker. The problem with that notion is that Trump’s immediate successor at the moment, Pence, is an End Times Apocalypse enthusiast. ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2020, 11:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-assassinates-commanding-general-of-iran-quds-force/845821/504 "2020-01-07T11:59:40Z")
> [@MarvinKitFox](#): > > And thereby you have show that you know jack shit, and should please stop announcing this fact t the world by posting here. MarvinKitFox. You may not insult other posters. Nor may you tell them where they can’t post. Please don’t do it again. Warning issued. ---
**Author:** ![Hamlet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hamlet/32/2818_2.png) [@Hamlet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamlet)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2020, 1:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-assassinates-commanding-general-of-iran-quds-force/845821/505 "2020-01-07T13:16:35Z")
Things like this will happen, and continue to happen, when there is little to no oversight of the President’s use of extra-judicial killing. While what Trump may have differed in the complete lack of evidence presented, the immediacy of necessary actions, and the wisdom of the strike (although, in Trump’s defense, at least the dead guy wasn’t a US citizen), it is not horribly different from the actions Obama took in the extra-judicial killing of Anwar al-Awlaki or Bush did for many others. The unfettered power of the President to murder anyone in the world as long as he pretends to have a reason has now been given to a narcissistic, bullying moron. Maybe now some grownups will find a spine and try to limit, or at least get some judicial oversight, over extra-judicial killing. ---
**Author:** ![Bijou\_Drains](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bijou_drains/32/2814_2.png) [@Bijou\_Drains](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bijou_Drains)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2020, 1:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-assassinates-commanding-general-of-iran-quds-force/845821/506 "2020-01-07T13:33:56Z")
Rand Paul says the murder was a bad idea > **[Rand Paul: Trump ‘got bad advice’ on killing of Soleimani](https://thehill.com/policy/international/middle-east-north-africa/477055-rand-paul-trump-got-bad-advice-on-killing-of/)** > > Sen. Rand Paul (R-Ky.) said Monday that President Trump “got bad advice” on his decision to kill top Iranian Gen. Qassem Soleimani in a strike last week.Paul said on CNN’s “The Situation Room … ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2020, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-assassinates-commanding-general-of-iran-quds-force/845821/507 "2020-01-07T14:09:36Z")
> [@Bijou\_Drains](#): > > Rand Paul says the murder was a bad idea > > [https://thehill.com/policy/international/middle-east-north-africa/477055-rand-paul-trump-got-bad-advice-on-killing-of](https://thehill.com/policy/international/middle-east-north-africa/477055-rand-paul-trump-got-bad-advice-on-killing-of) He also exemplifies a confusing mindset common to far too many Americans of late: > [@](#): > > “You would have to be brain dead to believe that we tear up the agreement, we put an embargo on you and we kill your major general, and they’re just going to crawl back to the table and say, ‘What do you want, America?’” he said. > > He added that even though “nothing justifies their military action,” it would be “predictable.” He lists three major factors behind Iran’s current position, but then piously declares “nothing justifies their military action”. Except if anyone had tried to do even a portion of that to the US, there’d be no doubt that the Americans would consider military force justified. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2020, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-assassinates-commanding-general-of-iran-quds-force/845821/508 "2020-01-07T14:38:09Z")
> [@Hamlet](#): > > Things like this will happen, and continue to happen, when there is little to no oversight of the President’s use of extra-judicial killing. While what Trump may have differed in the complete lack of evidence presented, the immediacy of necessary actions, and the wisdom of the strike (although, in Trump’s defense, at least the dead guy wasn’t a US citizen), it is not horribly different from the actions Obama took in the extra-judicial killing of Anwar al-Awlaki or Bush did for many others. The unfettered power of the President to murder anyone in the world as long as he pretends to have a reason has now been given to a narcissistic, bullying moron. Maybe now some grownups will find a spine and try to limit, or at least get some judicial oversight, over extra-judicial killing. I would argue that the containment of American power may be the overwhelming geopolitical issue facing the globe today. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2020, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-assassinates-commanding-general-of-iran-quds-force/845821/509 "2020-01-07T16:00:10Z")
> [@Horatius](#): > > He lists three major factors behind Iran’s current position, but then piously declares “nothing justifies their military action”. Except if anyone had tried to do even a portion of that to the US, there’d be no doubt that the Americans would consider military force justified. I’m no Rand Paul fan, but he is a United States Senator, and he’s supposed to pick a side on this one. ---
**Author:** ![phantom\_lamb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/5f9b8f/32.png) [@phantom\_lamb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/phantom_lamb)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2020, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-assassinates-commanding-general-of-iran-quds-force/845821/510 "2020-01-07T16:05:34Z")
> [@Horatius](#): > > He lists three major factors behind Iran’s current position, but then piously declares “nothing justifies their military action”. Except if anyone had tried to do even a portion of that to the US, there’d be no doubt that the Americans would consider military force justified. That’s true and he may well be aware of that… but as an American politician he can’t exactly publicly justify the killing of American soldiers. ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2020, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-assassinates-commanding-general-of-iran-quds-force/845821/511 "2020-01-07T17:49:56Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > I’m no Rand Paul fan, but he is a United States Senator, and he’s supposed to pick a side on this one. > [@phantom\_lamb](#): > > That’s true and he may well be aware of that… but as an American politician he can’t exactly publicly justify the killing of American soldiers. Yes, but one would hope that a US Senator could come up with an answer that managed to both not support attacks on US troops, and not contain such a blatant bit of hypocrisy. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2020, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-assassinates-commanding-general-of-iran-quds-force/845821/512 "2020-01-07T17:55:58Z")
> [@Hamlet](#): > > Things like this will happen, and continue to happen, when there is little to no oversight of the President’s use of extra-judicial killing. While what Trump may have differed in the complete lack of evidence presented, the immediacy of necessary actions, and the wisdom of the strike (although, in Trump’s defense, at least the dead guy wasn’t a US citizen), it is not horribly different from the actions Obama took in the extra-judicial killing of Anwar al-Awlaki or Bush did for many others. The unfettered power of the President to murder anyone in the world as long as he pretends to have a reason has now been given to a narcissistic, bullying moron. Maybe now some grownups will find a spine and try to limit, or at least get some judicial oversight, over extra-judicial killing. Maybe Nancy can add this to the articles of impeachment. I don’t see any Constitutional impediment to adding “killing terrorists without permission” to the list of high crimes and misdemeanors. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Hillmanhunter1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/7ea924/32.png) [@Hillmanhunter1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hillmanhunter1)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2020, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-assassinates-commanding-general-of-iran-quds-force/845821/513 "2020-01-07T18:01:33Z")
> [@Horatius](#): > > Yes, but one would hope that a US Senator could come up with an answer that managed to both not support attacks on US troops, and not contain such a blatant bit of hypocrisy. Rand Paul’s analysis is on the money, he clearly has a better grasp pf the dynamics of the Middle East and of diplomacy than Trump. The killing of Soliemani was dumb dumb dumb, and Trump, the US and perhaps her allies will pay a price. It is very significant that both of the most important military allies of the US, the UK and Israel, are tiptoeing away as quickly as possible from this debacle, all the while making it clear that this was Trump’s call alone. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2020, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-assassinates-commanding-general-of-iran-quds-force/845821/514 "2020-01-07T18:03:12Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > Maybe Nancy can add this to the articles of impeachment. I don’t see any Constitutional impediment to adding “killing terrorists without permission” to the list of high crimes and misdemeanors. Clever! ---
**Author:** ![Bijou\_Drains](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bijou_drains/32/2814_2.png) [@Bijou\_Drains](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bijou_Drains)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2020, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-assassinates-commanding-general-of-iran-quds-force/845821/515 "2020-01-07T18:10:07Z")
Trump could not understand the dynamics of running a town of 500 people let alone 320 million people. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Bredin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/96bed5/32.png) [@John\_Bredin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Bredin)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2020, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-assassinates-commanding-general-of-iran-quds-force/845821/516 "2020-01-07T19:05:17Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > Maybe Nancy can add this to the articles of impeachment. I don’t see any Constitutional impediment to adding “killing terrorists without permission” to the list of high crimes and misdemeanors. :dubious: How does “going to war without permission” strike you? Terrorists = non-state actors. _Hostis humani generis_, as they used to say, like pirates. Hard to say AlQaida isn’t an “enemy of humankind generally” and hunting AlQuaida clearly falls under Congress’s Authorization for Use of Military Force resolution. Killing a high-ranking official of another nation-state: act of war. The power to bring the U.S. to war lies with Congress, not the President. Hope this helps. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2020, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-assassinates-commanding-general-of-iran-quds-force/845821/517 "2020-01-07T19:10:11Z")
Silly rabbit – only Democrats have to follow the Constitution! ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2020, 9:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-assassinates-commanding-general-of-iran-quds-force/845821/518 "2020-01-07T21:13:08Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > I’m no Rand Paul fan, but he is a United States Senator, and he’s supposed to pick a side on this one. Yes, but it’s no less patriotic and faithful to his constitutional civic duty to introduce reason into an important public debate, which he did in challenging the rationale for Trump’s whacking of a foreign official. He shouldn’t be afraid to point out that our perpetual tendency to apply double standards feeds into our self-destructive illusion of American exceptionalism. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2020, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-assassinates-commanding-general-of-iran-quds-force/845821/519 "2020-01-07T22:40:35Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > Silly rabbit – only Democrats have to follow the Constitution! You mean like Obama did when he ordered hundreds of drone strikes without congressional approval, including targeting American civilians? Or perhaps the wars in Libya and Syria which were carried out without congressional authorization? As Obama himself said, “It turns out I’m really good at killing people.” Not so good at getting Congress to approve it. Or maybe you mean the Iran ‘deal’, which was clearly a treaty but the word was never used to avoid the pesky constitutional requirement of having Congress vote on it? Or maybe you mean DACA, which Obama passed by executive order after spending years telling people he couldn’t do exactly that because the constitution forbade it? If Obama had killed Soleimani, Democrats would be cheering and the Republicans would be complaining about oversight. Because that’s the way we roll now, ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2020, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-assassinates-commanding-general-of-iran-quds-force/845821/520 "2020-01-07T22:46:37Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > You mean like Obama did when he ordered hundreds of drone strikes without congressional approval, including targeting American civilians? Or perhaps the wars in Libya and Syria which were carried out without congressional authorization? As Obama himself said, “It turns out I’m really good at killing people.” Not so good at getting Congress to approve it. > > Or maybe you mean the Iran ‘deal’, which was clearly a treaty but the word was never used to avoid the pesky constitutional requirement of having Congress vote on it? > > Or maybe you mean DACA, which Obama passed by executive order after spending years telling people he couldn’t do exactly that because the constitution forbade it? > > If Obama had killed Soleimani, Democrats would be cheering and the Republicans would be complaining about oversight. Because that’s the way we roll now, Yes, everything is the same and Trump is no different than Obama in any way, and no criticism of Trump is ever valid. :rolleyes: Do you really believe this kind of nonsense? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-assassinates-commanding-general-of-iran-quds-force/845821.md?page=25) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-assassinates-commanding-general-of-iran-quds-force/845821.md?page=27)