# US CDC initiative to promote routine circumcision for all baby boys raises it's head
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-cdc-initiative-to-promote-routine-circumcision-for-all-baby-boys-raises-its-head/507442
**Category:** Great Debates
**Created:** [August 24, 2009, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-cdc-initiative-to-promote-routine-circumcision-for-all-baby-boys-raises-its-head/507442 "2009-08-24T01:22:04Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@astro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astro)
#### Post date: [August 24, 2009, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-cdc-initiative-to-promote-routine-circumcision-for-all-baby-boys-raises-its-head/507442/1 "2009-08-24T01:22:04Z")
[Public health officials are considering promoting routine circumcision for all baby boys born in the United States to reduce the spread of H.I.V., the virus that causes AIDS.](http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/24/health/policy/24circumcision.html?_r=1&hp)
Benefits seem relatively minor for US children. Is this controversial topic really a fight the CDC needs to take on when other health care issues are much more pressing.
> [@](#):
>
> There is little to no evidence that circumcision protects men who have sex with men from infection. Another reason circumcision would have less of an impact in the United States is that some 79 percent of adult American men are already circumcised, public health officials say.
>
> But newborn circumcision rates have dropped off in recent decades, to about 65 percent of all newborns in 1999 from a high of about 80 percent after World War II, according to C.D.C. figures. And blacks and Hispanics, who have been affected disproportionately by AIDS, are less likely than whites to circumcise their baby boys, according to the agency.
>
> Circumcision rates have fallen in part because the American Academy of Pediatrics, which sets the guidelines for infant care, does not endorse routine circumcision. Its policy says that circumcision is “not essential to the child’s current well-being,” and as a result, many state Medicaid programs do not cover the operation.
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> The academy is revising its guidelines, however, and is likely to do away with the neutral tone in favor of a more encouraging policy stating that circumcision has health benefits even beyond H.I.V. prevention, like reducing urinary tract infections for baby boys, said Dr. Michael Brady, a consultant to the American Academy of Pediatrics.
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> He said the academy would probably stop short of recommending routine surgery, however. “We do have evidence to suggest there are health benefits, and families should be given an opportunity to know what they are,” he said. But, he said, the value of circumcision for H.I.V. protection in the United States is difficult to assess, adding, “Our biggest struggle is trying to figure out how to understand the true value for Americans.”
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### Author:  [@MichaelQReilly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MichaelQReilly)
#### Post date: [August 24, 2009, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-cdc-initiative-to-promote-routine-circumcision-for-all-baby-boys-raises-its-head/507442/2 "2009-08-24T02:09:06Z")
According to [this](http://www.guardian.co.uk/lifeandstyle/2009/jul/05/circumcicision-health-children) recent article from the Guardian, circumcision has a ton of benefits.
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### Author:  [@Amp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amp)
#### Post date: [August 24, 2009, 2:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-cdc-initiative-to-promote-routine-circumcision-for-all-baby-boys-raises-its-head/507442/3 "2009-08-24T02:21:24Z")
As longs as it is not mandatory. As with anything people need to read up on both sides of the issue and decide for themselves. Luckily my mother did not mutilate my genitals nor did I my child’s.
[QUOTE=MichaelQReilly]
According to this recent article from the Guardian, circumcision has a ton of benefits
[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE= The Article]
Why is he having the operation? “Because it will reduce the chance of HIV,” he says. “It’s good for hygiene purposes. And girls will be pleased if you have the cut.”
[/QUOTE]
Yeah, great benefits. :rolleyes:
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### Author:  [@wierdaaron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wierdaaron)
#### Post date: [August 24, 2009, 2:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-cdc-initiative-to-promote-routine-circumcision-for-all-baby-boys-raises-its-head/507442/4 "2009-08-24T02:32:43Z")
It seems like most of the people “against” circumcision for their kids are women, and almost always just to save the baby a bit of pain they wont remember.
Then there’s guys who grow up and feel somehow betrayed that they were circumsized without their permission. They’re just unsatisfied with life and are trying to find something to rail against. Then again, people who weren’t circumsized themselves seem to want the same for their children, and so on. Hard to imagine living your life differently Sort of like how some little people are disappointed when their kids turn out to be… whatever the proper term for “not a little person” is.
Even without the health benefits and all that, I’d almost definitely get my kid snipped just because it’s so popular. When a boy is young and insecure about his body and everything about it, the last thing he needs is to be the only kid in his class whose dingie looks different. Since every other kid is insecure, they’re of course checking everybody else’s tackle out, and they’ll single out the “different” kid with teasing just to make themselves look better.
There are situations that can arise later in life where it’s a medical necessity to have a circumcision performed. There are no situations later in life where it would be medically necessary to have foreskin attached.
All that stuff aside, it does seem a bit strange for the CDC to advocate that, but then again the CDC isn’t really supposed to be a platform for politics. If it turned out to have health benefits to have a swastika tattood to your forehead, they’d say so.
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### Author:  [@Grumman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grumman)
#### Post date: [August 24, 2009, 4:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-cdc-initiative-to-promote-routine-circumcision-for-all-baby-boys-raises-its-head/507442/5 "2009-08-24T04:49:51Z")
> [@wierdaaron](#):
>
> It seems like most of the people “against” circumcision for their kids are women, and almost always just to save the baby a bit of pain they wont remember.
I’m a guy and I’m against it, unless they present a convincing argument otherwise.
> [@](#):
>
> Then there’s guys who grow up and feel somehow betrayed that they were circumsized without their permission.
Considering the claimed benefits only appear once they’re old enough to have sex, and thus old enough to decide for themselves, why _wouldn’t_ you let them decide for themselves? It’s not like you can undo the procedure, is it?
> [@](#):
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> Even without the health benefits and all that, I’d almost definitely get my kid snipped just because it’s so popular. When a boy is young and insecure about his body and everything about it, the last thing he needs is to be the only kid in his class whose dingie looks different. Since every other kid is insecure, they’re of course checking everybody else’s tackle out, and they’ll single out the “different” kid with teasing just to make themselves look better.
:dubious: Is there something you’d like to tell the class, Aaron?
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### Author:  [@Freudian\_Slit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freudian_Slit)
#### Post date: [August 24, 2009, 4:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-cdc-initiative-to-promote-routine-circumcision-for-all-baby-boys-raises-its-head/507442/6 "2009-08-24T04:57:30Z")
> [@Amp](#):
>
> Yeah, great benefits. :rolleyes:
I don’t have strong feelings on the cut either way (I’m a woman with no immediate plans for babies), but why aren’t those good reasons? Lesser chance of HIV, being attractive to women, and hygiene aren’t good reasons? What would be a good reason? Semen that turns to gold upon air contact?
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### Author:  [@wierdaaron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wierdaaron)
#### Post date: [August 24, 2009, 5:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-cdc-initiative-to-promote-routine-circumcision-for-all-baby-boys-raises-its-head/507442/7 "2009-08-24T05:03:37Z")
> [@Grumman](#):
>
> Considering the claimed benefits only appear once they’re old enough to have sex, and thus old enough to decide for themselves, why _wouldn’t_ you let them decide for themselves? It’s not like you can undo the procedure, is it?
Because it hurts like hell then and takes much longer to heal.
The benefits aren’t only sexual, as I’m aware. For instance, see the subject of this thread.
> [@Grumman](#):
>
> Is there something you’d like to tell the class, Aaron?
Yes. Being a male, I know how they think. Being a young male once, I know how _they_ think. Having a penis, I know how they think as well.
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### Author:  [@Renee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Renee)
#### Post date: [August 24, 2009, 6:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-cdc-initiative-to-promote-routine-circumcision-for-all-baby-boys-raises-its-head/507442/8 "2009-08-24T06:00:44Z")
> [@Amp](#):
>
> > [@](#):
> >
> > Originally Posted by The Article
> > Why is he having the operation? “Because it will reduce the chance of HIV,” he says. “It’s good for hygiene purposes. And girls will be pleased if you have the cut.”
>
> Yeah, great benefits. :rolleyes:
That’s what you took from the article? How about this:
[QUOTE=Guardian article]
Long understood as hygienic, it is now established that circumcision prevents much more than just HIV-Aids. It has been shown to limit the transfer of many sexual diseases, including syphilis, chancroid and herpes. There are other issues: uncircumcised infant boys are 10 times as likely to get urinary tract infections (which may lead to kidney problems in later life). Penile cancer is much rarer in circumcised men.
The implications for women are enormous: not only are they less likely to catch STDs and other infections from male partners, but the circumcised penis is cleaner. Less exposure to disease, especially genital warts, and dirt cuts back women’s chances of contracting cervical cancer enormously. Again, the medical profession has long known this. A study in 1955 found that Jewish women in Israel had a cervical cancer rate of 2.2 per 100,000 people: in American cities the figure was 44. Modern studies say that women with circumcised male partners are up to three times less likely to contract cervical cancer, especially if they are in high-risk groups. It is possible that women with circumcised partners are less likely to develop breast cancer.
…
“The relative risk for HIV infection was 44% lower in circumcised men. The strongest association was seen in men at high risk, such as patients at sexually transmitted disease clinics, for whom the adjusted relative risk was 71% lower for circumcised men.”
[/QUOTE]
> **[Alex Renton on circumcising your children for health reasons](https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2009/jul/05/circumcicision-health-children)**
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> It may horrify you. But what if you knew it could potentially save his life - and others? Special report by Alex Renton
Not exactly just HIV, though I do think that’s a pretty big benefit.
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### Author:  [@fuzzypickles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fuzzypickles)
#### Post date: [August 24, 2009, 6:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-cdc-initiative-to-promote-routine-circumcision-for-all-baby-boys-raises-its-head/507442/9 "2009-08-24T06:03:47Z")
> [@wierdaaron](#):
>
> …the last thing he needs is to be the only kid in his class whose dingie looks different. Since every other kid is insecure, they’re of course checking everybody else’s tackle out, and they’ll single out the “different” kid with teasing just to make themselves look better.
Were you homeschooled? Boys in the locker room don’t tease other boys for having a weird penis, because that would be admitting that you looked in the first place.
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### Author:  [@wierdaaron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wierdaaron)
#### Post date: [August 24, 2009, 6:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-cdc-initiative-to-promote-routine-circumcision-for-all-baby-boys-raises-its-head/507442/10 "2009-08-24T06:31:37Z")
> [@fuzzypickles](#):
>
> Were you homeschooled? Boys in the locker room don’t tease other boys for having a weird penis, because that would be admitting that you looked in the first place.
(Hopefully) none of us have a very large sample study to say unilaterally how young naked boys behave in groups.
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### Author:  [@Mosier](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mosier)
#### Post date: [August 24, 2009, 6:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-cdc-initiative-to-promote-routine-circumcision-for-all-baby-boys-raises-its-head/507442/11 "2009-08-24T06:51:31Z")
Ritual infant genital mutilation is only okay when it’s something WE do.
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### Author:  [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)
#### Post date: [August 24, 2009, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-cdc-initiative-to-promote-routine-circumcision-for-all-baby-boys-raises-its-head/507442/12 "2009-08-24T17:55:11Z")
> [@](#):
>
> Even without the health benefits and all that, I’d almost definitely get my kid snipped just because it’s so popular. When a boy is young and insecure about his body and everything about it, the last thing he needs is to be the only kid in his class whose dingie looks different. Since every other kid is insecure, they’re of course checking everybody else’s tackle out, and they’ll single out the “different” kid with teasing just to make themselves look better.
I grew up uncircumcised in America, and of all the many things the other kids found to single out and tease me about, the state of my penis was never one of them. I have a hard time believing that this could be a problem.
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### Author:  [@wierdaaron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wierdaaron)
#### Post date: [August 24, 2009, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-cdc-initiative-to-promote-routine-circumcision-for-all-baby-boys-raises-its-head/507442/13 "2009-08-24T18:20:32Z")
> [@Chronos](#):
>
> I grew up uncircumcised in America, and of all the many things the other kids found to single out and tease me about, the state of my penis was never one of them. I have a hard time believing that this could be a problem.
I doubt it would ever be a huge problem. The more likely thing is the “why’s mine different?” dinner dialog.
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### Author:  [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)
#### Post date: [August 24, 2009, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-cdc-initiative-to-promote-routine-circumcision-for-all-baby-boys-raises-its-head/507442/14 "2009-08-24T18:25:02Z")
> [@Mosier](#):
>
> Ritual infant genital mutilation is only okay when it’s something WE do.
The motivation and results are significantly different when comparing circumcision to various female genital alterations/mutilations.
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### Author:  [@Patty\_O\_Furniture](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Patty_O_Furniture)
#### Post date: [August 24, 2009, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-cdc-initiative-to-promote-routine-circumcision-for-all-baby-boys-raises-its-head/507442/15 "2009-08-24T18:26:49Z")
> [@wierdaaron](#):
>
> (Hopefully) none of us have a very large sample study to say unilaterally how young naked boys behave in groups.
Where’s Mark Foley when you need him?
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### Author:  [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)
#### Post date: [August 24, 2009, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-cdc-initiative-to-promote-routine-circumcision-for-all-baby-boys-raises-its-head/507442/16 "2009-08-24T18:35:36Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#):
>
> The motivation and results are significantly different when comparing circumcision to various female genital alterations/mutilations.
I’m not so sure. It’s been reported by men who had circumcisions later in life (some to convert to Judaism) that the lack of foreskin reduces sexual pleasure considerably.
As we all know that sex is dirty and wrong, and deriving pleasure from it is a bad thing, let’s hack up everyone’s genitals!
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### Author:  [@kidchameleon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kidchameleon)
#### Post date: [August 24, 2009, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-cdc-initiative-to-promote-routine-circumcision-for-all-baby-boys-raises-its-head/507442/17 "2009-08-24T18:43:29Z")
> [@SenorBeef](#):
>
> I’m not so sure. It’s been reported by men who had circumcisions later in life (some to convert to Judaism) that the lack of foreskin reduces sexual pleasure considerably.
I’ve heard it the other way.
Plus, can you make it big in porn without a circumcision?
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### Author:  [@Freudian\_Slit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freudian_Slit)
#### Post date: [August 24, 2009, 6:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-cdc-initiative-to-promote-routine-circumcision-for-all-baby-boys-raises-its-head/507442/18 "2009-08-24T18:45:17Z")
> [@kidchameleon](#):
>
> I’ve heard it the other way.
>
> Plus, can you make it big in porn without a circumcision?
We’re talking about a world where 2 girls 1 cup has turned into a meme, and you’re afraid of a little foreskin?!
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### Author:  [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)
#### Post date: [August 24, 2009, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-cdc-initiative-to-promote-routine-circumcision-for-all-baby-boys-raises-its-head/507442/19 "2009-08-24T19:02:56Z")
Is it really a “fight” for the CDC to say that there’s benefits to neonatal circumcision? Even if they’re “minor” in someone’s eyes, why not be clear about them?
If anything, this worries me because the “anti-circumcision” group has a lot more emotional energy invested in the debate. Like abortion, there’s not really a “pro” side (few people are saying “You _must_ get your baby circumcised!”) so much as a “It’s your choice” side. People saying “It’s your choice” tend not to make as much noise as those really against something and, as a result, legitimate medical science can be drowned out by emotional investment.
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### Author:  [@kidchameleon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kidchameleon)
#### Post date: [August 24, 2009, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-cdc-initiative-to-promote-routine-circumcision-for-all-baby-boys-raises-its-head/507442/20 "2009-08-24T19:09:50Z")
> [@Freudian\_Slit](#):
>
> We’re talking about a world where 2 girls 1 cup has turned into a meme, and you’re afraid of a little foreskin?!
So scared that I keep a knife under my pillow in case any of the little buggers attempt to creep up on me.
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