# US General uses "V" word in Afghan War - Only 4 US Combat Deaths since Jan 1. **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [March 10, 2013, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-general-uses-v-word-in-afghan-war-only-4-us-combat-deaths-since-jan-1/652554 "2013-03-10T14:23:28Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 5\ **Page:** 11
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2013, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-general-uses-v-word-in-afghan-war-only-4-us-combat-deaths-since-jan-1/652554/201 "2013-04-01T18:52:06Z")
> [@](#): > > In plain English, we don’t have enough troops to train all the ALP that we want. Maybe that’s why half of the ALP are not partnered with anyone? -Ravenman 01:43 pm 090p9143 Using ‘maybe’ in your response says a lot. > [@](#): > > Summary: at least we’re doing something about it. I await your comments on what a smashing success this CI effort is going to be, and how the ALP are terrific institutions that are smashing the Taliban to pieces and guaranteeing democracy. -Ravenman 01:43 pm 090p9143 As I wrote previously “smashing success” is you terminology not mine. And You are admitting that less than 1% have been disqualified. I do not see how that makes your case that US Special Forces are no longer working with conventional or local police in defense if tagos’ claim that Americans no longer trust Afghans to GI on joint operations. You complained that I didn’t mention police. Now I gave mentioned police and your own report confirms American are working with both types if Afghan police. Where we don’t, they don’t need us any more, except perhaps at times for logistics support which I have already acknowledged is a need. ---
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2013, 12:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-general-uses-v-word-in-afghan-war-only-4-us-combat-deaths-since-jan-1/652554/202 "2013-04-02T00:27:28Z")
[quote=“Ravenman, post:200, topic:652554”] The 1230 report I linked to earlier as an assessment of ALP. Let me highlight some assessments: In plain English, we don’t have enough troops to train all the ALP that we want. Maybe that’s why half of the ALP are not partnered with anyone? Summary: uh oh. > [@](#): > > The proliferation of independent non-GIRoA sanctioned militias, which operate outside the VSO/ALP framework, threaten to undermine the legitimacy and progress of the program. Although limited in number, these unauthorized organizations threaten to damage the ALP “brand,” especially when they inappropriately use the ALP name to further their own interests./quote] > > Summary: uh oh. > > Summary: oh, crap. > > Summary: at least we’re doing something about it. I await your comments on what a smashing success this CI effort is going to be, and how the ALP are terrific institutions that are smashing the Taliban to pieces and guaranteeing democracy. It is not the Legitimate ALP’s purpose to 'smash the Taliban to pieces. You need to read the entire 1230 report that you linked to earlier. The ALP were created for defensive purposes, and are not heavily armed. They do not go on offensive patrols against insurgents as the uniformed police and army does. However they were cited by a UN source as keeping the villages they defend safe from insurgents. **And the Afghans taking over for security in another district is a bad thing? Why?** > [@](#): > > Coalition Forces Complete Transition of Nerkh District to Afghan National Security Forces > ISAF HQ Public Affairs 2013-03-CA-08 > > Coalition Forces Complete Transition of Nerkh District to Afghan National Security Forces > > KABUL, Afghanistan (Mar. 30, 2013) – Today Coalition forces completed their transition from Nerkh District, Wardak Province to Afghan National Security Forces. > > As previously announced, Gen. Joseph F. Dunford, the ISAF commander, and President Karzai agreed on a plan March 20 to transition Nerkh District as part of the larger effort to transition Wardak Province to Afghan security lead. > > “As we pledged, our forces have transitioned Nerkh District to Afghan National Security Forces and they have now assumed full responsibility for security in this key district. The rest of Wardak will continue to transition over time as Afghan forces continue to grow in capability and capacity,” Dunford said. **“This is another sign of the ANSF’s forward momentum in assuming the lead for security across Afghanistan.”** ---
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2013, 7:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-general-uses-v-word-in-afghan-war-only-4-us-combat-deaths-since-jan-1/652554/203 "2013-04-02T07:37:51Z")
[QUOTE] > [@Ravenman](#): > > The 1230 report I linked to earlier as an assessment of ALP. > > {cite} “The proliferation of independent non-GIRoA sanctioned militias, which operate outside the VSO/ALP framework, threaten to undermine the legitimacy and progress of the program. Although limited in number, these unauthorized organizations threaten to damage the ALP “brand,” especially when they inappropriately use the ALP name to further their own interests.”{cite} > > Summary: uh oh. > > Summary: oh, crap. Oh Crap is right. Ravenman cited a problem with \*\*\*non-\*\*\*ALP fighters using the ALP brand. But Ravenman did not include the ‘rest of the story’ Perhaps we should look at the 1230 report in full context of what was written about the ALP: > [@](#): > > The proliferation of independent non-GIRoA sanctioned militias, which perate outside the VSO/ALP framework, threaten to undermine the legitimacy and progress of the program. > > **Although limited in number** , these unauthorized organizations threaten to damage the ALP “brand,” especially when they inappropriately use the ALP name to further their own interests. > > Although there are a few incidences to contrary, the ALP has favorable name recognition in the majority of Afghan provinces in which polling has been conducted. > > Underscoring the effectiveness of the program, the Taliban Senior Leadership (TBSL) have identified infiltration of the ALP as a primary objective to weaken the program. As of August 2012, a small minority of insider attacks (3 out of 78) have involved members of the ALP. SOF remain deeply embedded with ALP, more so than other ISAF units working with AUP or ANA. > > Although this exposes them to much more direct contact with possible infiltrators, also it also allows for a better understanding of the human terrain and an opportunity to identify possible threat indicators. > > To mitigate the risk of insider threats, SOJTF-A has taken active measures to re-validate all 16,474 ALP personnel. This revalidation process is currently 52 percent complete, with less than one percent removed due to nefarious activities or counter-intelligence concerns. This process, which is currently ongoing, is very similar in design to our initial screening/validation methodology. It begins at the local level by conducting shuras and intimately involving local elders, who must vouch for each ALP member, ensuring he remains in good standing. Each > member’s application paperwork is re-reviewed by various personnel from the Coalition, MoI, NDS, and the DCOPs. If any ALP member “flags” as suspicious, additional counter-intelligence (both Afghan and Coalition) measures are taken. If it is determined that an ALP member is unfit, he is removed from the program. These processes are non-negotiable. In addition, NDS plans to embed three agents per 100 ALP to identify possible infiltration by the enemy. The prevention/elimination of Insider Threats will remain COMISAF’s top force protection priorities. > > During the reporting period, \*\*United Nations Assistance Mission in Afghanistan (UNAMA) released its annual report on the protection of civilians, which noted that ALP had improved security and kept insurgents out of ALP areas. \*\*The UNAMA report also maintained some criticisms from its previous 2011 report, which included references to issues in recruitment, > vetting, training, and discipline. To address these occurrences, MoI responded by creating ALP Assessment Teams charged with investigating misconduct allegations and related issues affecting the ALP at the district level. > [http://www.defense.gov/transcripts/transcript.aspx?transcriptid=5164](http://www.defense.gov/transcripts/transcript.aspx?transcriptid=5164) ---
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2013, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-general-uses-v-word-in-afghan-war-only-4-us-combat-deaths-since-jan-1/652554/204 "2013-04-03T23:54:44Z")
> [@tagos](#): > > [Afghan army readiness](http://articles.washingtonpost.com/2012-10-20/world/35498594_1_afghan-security-afghan-soldiers-afghan-forces) > [Grudges investigated](http://gwynnedyer.com/tag/afghanistan/) > > Vanda Felbab-Brown testifies at a House Armed Services Committee’s Subcommittee on Oversight and Investigations hearing on the critical issues surrounding the development of Afghan National Security Forces (ASNF) and corruption in Afghanistan. > > [Afghan National Security Forces: Afghan Corruption and the Development of an Effective Fighting Force](http://www.brookings.edu/research/testimony/2012/08/02-afghanistan-security-felbabbrown) > > Yea. That smells like Victory all right. Tagos has cited Vanda Felbab-Brown who was also promoting her new book. She certainly sounds like a proponent of keeping more US military combat presence in Afghanistan beyond 2014. To justify that she’d of course have to badmouth the Afghan military, police as much as she could in testimony to Congress last August. I wonder why tagos puts faith in her biased opinion that more US combat troops should stay longer because that Afghans can’t do it themselves. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2013, 1:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-general-uses-v-word-in-afghan-war-only-4-us-combat-deaths-since-jan-1/652554/205 "2013-04-04T01:08:26Z")
**NotfooledbyW** , this is the second time that I have closed a thread because you have continued to natter on for days after everyone else had given up on the topic. We prefer that posters not engage in monomaniacal (or one-trick-pony) posting: From the [Registration Agreement](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=650726): > [@](#): > > The board is not intended to furnish you with a forum for promoting your personal agenda. We reserve the right to ask you to limit postings on a particular topic, or to refrain from posting on such topics altogether. You are clearly over the edge. This thread is closed and you are not to post on any aspect of the U.S. military or political involvement in the MENA region for one month. If you can actually post and interact on other topics, we will review a possible relaxation of that rule at that time. [/Moderating] [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-general-uses-v-word-in-afghan-war-only-4-us-combat-deaths-since-jan-1/652554.md?page=10)