# US Law: Are Convicted Felons Citizens? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [October 19, 2011, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-law-are-convicted-felons-citizens/600149 "2011-10-19T15:11:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Jinx](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/c6cbf5/32.png) [@Jinx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jinx)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2011, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-law-are-convicted-felons-citizens/600149/1 "2011-10-19T15:11:38Z")
I had heard that convicted felons (in the US) lose their citizenship. Is that correct? And, if true, who checks up on this when they go to register to vote? Or, commit yet another crime? (Do they still get a speedy trial, right to atty, etc?) FYI: I am assuming a felon is one serving in a State or Federal prison for a year or greater, per an online law dictionary of “felony”. ---
**Author:** ![friedo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8edcca/32.png) [@friedo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/friedo)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2011, 3:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-law-are-convicted-felons-citizens/600149/2 "2011-10-19T15:12:30Z")
No. However, a felony conviction does make you ineligible to vote in some states. ---
**Author:** ![dolphinboy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dolphinboy/32/330_2.png) [@dolphinboy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dolphinboy)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2011, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-law-are-convicted-felons-citizens/600149/3 "2011-10-19T15:17:22Z")
> [@friedo](#): > > No. > > However, a felony conviction does make you ineligible to vote in some states. And I believe in most cases you are not able to legally possess a firearm… but you’re still a citizen. ---
**Author:** ![Jinx](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/c6cbf5/32.png) [@Jinx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jinx)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2011, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-law-are-convicted-felons-citizens/600149/4 "2011-10-19T15:19:16Z")
It’s a shame they don’t lose all US rights. Like, losing your right to vote is a BAD thing??? I know, when the Constitution was framed, it was a big deal…today, it’s be a blessing! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2011, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-law-are-convicted-felons-citizens/600149/5 "2011-10-19T15:38:37Z")
> [@Jinx](#): > > It’s a shame they don’t lose all US rights. Like, losing your right to vote is a BAD thing??? I know, when the Constitution was framed, it was a big deal…today, it’s be a blessing! 😃 [Moderator Note] **Jinx** , political commentary of this kind is inappropriate for GQ. Do not do this again. Colibri General Questions Moderator ---
**Author:** ![Si\_Amigo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/si_amigo/32/2877_2.png) [@Si\_Amigo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Si_Amigo)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2011, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-law-are-convicted-felons-citizens/600149/6 "2011-10-19T16:15:10Z")
> [@Jinx](#): > > FYI: I am assuming a felon is one serving in a State or Federal prison for a year or greater, per an online law dictionary of “felony”. You assume wrong; many felons never have spent more than a couple of hours in a lockup,got out on bail and received probation for minor drug related offenses. IMO you should be correct, the term felon should be used for people who present a clear and present danger to society and their rights severely limited; but it doesn’t work that way. So no, to answer the OP they do not lose their US citizenship or many of their rights. Where would we send them them to once we took away their citizenship? Australia is full and not taking anymore last I heard. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![mlees](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba8739/32.png) [@mlees](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mlees)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2011, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-law-are-convicted-felons-citizens/600149/7 "2011-10-19T16:24:41Z")
For what it’s worth, wikipedia addresses the loss of U.S. citizenship, and the only “felony” that might qualify is treason, but I don’t know if it’s automatic, or if it must be reviewed by a judge or comittee. > **[United States nationality law](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_nationality_law#Loss_of_citizenship)** > > United States nationality law details the conditions in which a person holds United States nationality. In the United States, nationality is typically obtained through provisions in the U.S. Constitution, various laws, and international agreements. Citizenship is a right, not a privilege. While the domestic documents often use citizenship and nationality interchangeably, nationality refers to the legal means in which a person obtains a national identity and formal membership in a nation and ci... The law: > **[8 U.S. Code § 1481 - Loss of nationality by native-born or naturalized...](https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/8/1481)** ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2011, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-law-are-convicted-felons-citizens/600149/8 "2011-10-19T18:37:45Z")
In Canada, people in prison (even for life) have the right to vote. One theory says that in the USA removing felons’ right to vote is a tactic used because lower class, poor people, who tend to be minorities too, vote for one party - so when the other is in power, it passes a law disenfranchising convicted felons. (you fill in the blanks). This becomes an issue in states like Florida where the election results can be close, and some voters are scrutinized closely because they are the same skin colour as a disproportionate number of convicted felons. This is likely what you may have heard on the news - during US elections or primaries, etc. the news stories are full of people denied their right to vote or voting illegally based on their legal status as felon or not, or often from mistaken identity or lack of identification. The attention given to every voter in some districts means the line moves slowly and some people may not get a chance to vote in time. But everyone who is a citizen stays a citizen with a legal right to be in the country. You can’t be deported if you have a legal right to be in the country; and where would the US deport you to? ---
**Author:** ![GaryM](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/garym/32/241_2.png) [@GaryM](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GaryM)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2011, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-law-are-convicted-felons-citizens/600149/9 "2011-10-19T19:18:34Z")
> [@md2000](#): > > The attention given to every voter in some districts means the line moves slowly and some people may not get a chance to vote in time. I can’t say for other states, but in Missouri, if the polls are scheduled to close at 7PM, a Election Judge gets on the end of the existing line at that time. Everyone in line ahead of the Election Judge gets to vote. Anyone in line behind them should have gotten there sooner. My wife was an election judge for several years, so I know how it’s done in my state. ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2011, 11:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-law-are-convicted-felons-citizens/600149/10 "2011-10-19T23:01:20Z")
> [@md2000](#): > > …But everyone who is a citizen stays a citizen with a legal right to be in the country. You can’t be deported if you have a legal right to be in the country; and where would the US deport you to? You can’t deport someone unless there is a country willing to accept them. Presumably a US citizen who somehow lost their citizenship w/o having another citizenship would simply be stuck in the US. Traveling abroad would be quite difficult since they’d be stateless and unable to get a passport (I’m pretty sure the US doesn’t issue alien’s passports. ---
**Author:** ![Snnipe\_70E](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5a626/32.png) [@Snnipe\_70E](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snnipe_70E)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2011, 12:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-law-are-convicted-felons-citizens/600149/11 "2011-10-20T00:38:41Z")
I believe the only way to loose US citizenship if it is determined that it was gain illegally. then you could be deported back to the country you came from. ---
**Author:** ![Bridget\_Burke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7cd45c/32.png) [@Bridget\_Burke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bridget_Burke)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2011, 12:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-law-are-convicted-felons-citizens/600149/12 "2011-10-20T00:39:30Z")
Just to agree with everybody else that convicted felons remain US Citizens. Can they vote? As prisoners, as parolees, after they’ve “paid their debt to society” or _ever_? [Depends on the state](http://www.aclu.org/map-state-felony-disfranchisement-laws). In Texas, felons who’ve completed their sentence (including parole and/or probation) regain the franchise. ---
**Author:** ![Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/46a35a/32.png) [@Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tim_T-Bonham.net)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2011, 2:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-law-are-convicted-felons-citizens/600149/13 "2011-10-20T02:13:46Z")
> [@Bridget\_Burke](#): > > In Texas, felons who’ve completed their sentence (including parole and/or probation) regain the franchise. Minnesota, too. But note that this includes probation/parole time. So if a person is convicted and sentenced to 12 years in prison, but because of good behavior gets out after 8 years, legally, they still can’t vote for another 4 years – until the end of their original sentence. About the only ‘voter fraud’ cases we have had in Minnesota have been such cases – people who register & vote after serving their time, but before the end of the original sentence. Not much ‘fraud’ involved – they use their real name & real address to register with the Secretary of State, and vote at the polling place the SoS office tells them to, thinking they were entitled to vote. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Tildrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e95f7d/32.png) [@Tom\_Tildrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Tildrum)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2011, 2:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-law-are-convicted-felons-citizens/600149/14 "2011-10-20T02:40:10Z")
> [@mlees](#): > > For what it’s worth, wikipedia addresses the loss of U.S. citizenship… I think it’s been speculated several times in the past that Google and Wikipedia are blocked on **Jinx** ’s computer. 🆒 ---
**Author:** ![mlees](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba8739/32.png) [@mlees](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mlees)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2011, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-law-are-convicted-felons-citizens/600149/15 "2011-10-20T15:22:59Z")
> [@Tom\_Tildrum](#): > > I think it’s been speculated several times in the past that Google and Wikipedia are blocked on **Jinx** ’s computer. 🆒 Heh. I say “for what it’s worth” in regards to wikipedia because I know that wikipedia can be hit or miss, and that some posters do not put much faith in cites from it. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2011, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-law-are-convicted-felons-citizens/600149/16 "2011-10-20T16:49:03Z")
> [@](#): > > Quoth [The Fourteenth Amendment](http://www.usconstitution.net/const.html#Am14): > > 1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws. I’d say that wraps it up pretty neatly, no? Unless, of course, you want to release felons from being subject to the jurisdiction of the United States, which strikes me as a really, really bad idea. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2011, 10:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-law-are-convicted-felons-citizens/600149/17 "2011-10-21T10:51:09Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > I’d say that wraps it up pretty neatly, no? Unless, of course, you want to release felons from being subject to the jurisdiction of the United States, which strikes me as a really, really bad idea. But also note the exception of life, liberty, and property being allowed to be removed after due process. They may remain citizens, but any of those otherwise fundamental rights can be removed. Thus one may claim they aren’t really full citizens, since the most fundamental protections are removed. Yes, I know it’s talking about the states at that point, but removal by the federal government is already covered in the [fifth amendment](http://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/Fifth+Amendment). BTW, the idea of restricting the vote is based on the idea that a criminal should not be able to participate in the government that is punishing him, lest he use his participation to change his sentence. While I find that unlikely, I do wonder if politicians would start pandering to get the prison vote. In an ideal system, this shouldn’t matter, as all laws would be those that most of society thinks are good, and, thus, such pandering would lose more votes than it would gain. But I’m not so sure in other systems. What happens in other countries that have a similar portion of their population incarcerated allow their prisoners to vote? ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2011, 1:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-law-are-convicted-felons-citizens/600149/18 "2011-10-21T13:17:58Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > What happens in other countries that have a similar portion of their population incarcerated allow their prisoners to vote? No other western democracy incarcerates a similar portion of their population as does the United States, which has the highest incarceration rate. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2011, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-law-are-convicted-felons-citizens/600149/19 "2011-10-21T19:21:19Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > BTW, the idea of restricting the vote is based on the idea that a criminal should not be able to participate in the government that is punishing him, lest he use his participation to change his sentence. While I find that unlikely, I do wonder if politicians would start pandering to get the prison vote. In an ideal system, this shouldn’t matter, as all laws would be those that most of society thinks are good, and, thus, such pandering would lose more votes than it would gain. But I’m not so sure in other systems. > > What happens in other countries that have a similar portion of their population incarcerated allow their prisoners to vote? This issue is addressed in Canada (at the federal level at least - dunno how each province deals with it) by the location that prisoners vote. They aren’t included on the voters’ list for the riding where the correctional centre or penitentiary is located. They cast their votes in the riding where they came from, as defined by this list: > [@](#): > > D **efinition of Place of Ordinary Residence** > > For electoral purposes, the incarcerated elector’s place of ordinary residence is **not** the institution in which he or she is serving a sentence. It is the **first** of the following places for which the elector knows the civic and mailing addresses: > > 1. his or her residence before being incarcerated; or > > 2. the residence of the spouse, the common-law partner, a relative or dependant of the elector, a relative of his or her spouse or common-law partner or a person with whom the elector would live if not incarcerated; or > > 3. the place of his or her arrest; or > > 4. the last court where the elector was convicted and sentenced. Source: [Elections Canada](http://www.elections.ca/content.aspx?section=vot&dir=bkg&document=ec90545&lang=e); bolding in original. So there isn’t a prisoners block of votes that may affect a particular riding or candidate disproportionately; their votes go back to where they came from, diluting the effect of a prisoners bloc. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2011, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-law-are-convicted-felons-citizens/600149/20 "2011-10-21T20:40:01Z")
> [@](#): > > But also note the exception of life, liberty, and property being allowed to be removed after due process. They may remain citizens, but any of those otherwise fundamental rights can be removed. Thus one may claim they aren’t really full citizens, since the most fundamental protections are removed. Certainly, they have fewer rights than non-convicts, but the question at hand is whether they lose their citizenship itself. Which, clearly, they don’t.