# US military weapons inscribed with secret bible codes **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 19, 2010, 3:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-military-weapons-inscribed-with-secret-bible-codes/525518 "2010-01-19T03:36:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2010, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-military-weapons-inscribed-with-secret-bible-codes/525518/61 "2010-01-19T16:25:44Z")
> [@Argent\_Towers](#): > > Off topic but it’s very weird to see a childish-sounding nickname like that, or any nickname at all - in quotes, no less - thrown into an otherwise-professional article. What is the deal with that? It’s not like Weinstein is some kind of household name and the majority of readers would be familiar with his nickname. What is up with this? Yes indeed, a "childish nickname’ suggests he must be childish and his statements must be ignored. Nice job of poisoning the well. Now please explain why his nickname means something and we should not take him seriously. ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2010, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-military-weapons-inscribed-with-secret-bible-codes/525518/62 "2010-01-19T16:33:05Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > I’m curious if any tank regiments have latched onto Judges 1:19, the implication being that not even God himself could dislodge their “iron chariots”. And antitank guns or missiles could have the following from Judges 11:6: > [@](#): > > And the LORD said to Joshua, “Do not be afraid of them, for tomorrow at this time I will give over all of them, slain, to Israel. You shall hamstring their horses and burn their chariots with fire.” ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2010, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-military-weapons-inscribed-with-secret-bible-codes/525518/63 "2010-01-19T16:43:47Z")
> [@Argent\_Towers](#): > > What about the Navy’s Blue Angels team? That’s definitely a religious reference - has anyone raised any objections to it, on these same grounds? They were named after a bar which in turn was named for the Marlene Dietrich movie. ---
**Author:** ![gravitycrash](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@gravitycrash](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gravitycrash)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2010, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-military-weapons-inscribed-with-secret-bible-codes/525518/64 "2010-01-19T16:53:04Z")
Well shit. I guess the Marines need to pack up and leave the middle east so as to not offend the Muslims. Or at least they need to stop saying: God, Country, Corps. ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2010, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-military-weapons-inscribed-with-secret-bible-codes/525518/65 "2010-01-19T17:08:58Z")
As transgressions go, this one may be a low rating on the Egregiometer\*. It’s lately become a peeve of mine, however, to see—in the context of the prosecution of this open-ended war----everything from loutish behavior to bone-crushing stupidity on our part waved away because “they’ll hate us no matter what.” Well, fine. But does it make sense to hand our enemies gilt-framed examples of \*why \*we’re hateworthy to hang in their madrassas and caves? Shouldn’t we at least make them \*work \*for it? The last thing we want is fat, complacent terrorists; it’ll be that much harder to distinguish them from us. Isn’t it slightly bothersome that some major players on “our” side (ostensibly the Good Guys) freely and obliviously exhibit signs of crackpot religious zealotry that look pretty damned similar, now that you mention it, to the very fundamentalism we’re allegedly at war with? - Patent pending, currently in naming-dispute litigation with the Church of Scientology. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2010, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-military-weapons-inscribed-with-secret-bible-codes/525518/66 "2010-01-19T17:45:39Z")
If the owner of the company is religious then he should engrave the gun sights with the words “God is Great”. ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2010, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-military-weapons-inscribed-with-secret-bible-codes/525518/67 "2010-01-19T17:53:03Z")
Obviously. And if he’s not, he should engrave them with the words, “There is no God.” I’m sure that would fly just as well. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2010, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-military-weapons-inscribed-with-secret-bible-codes/525518/68 "2010-01-19T18:00:12Z")
> [@Mr.Excellent](#): > > Really? I’m about as secular a Jew as you can get (atheist, non-practicing) - but I thought the Yom Kippur war convinced the IDF that military necessity trumps religion every time. There’s neccessity, and there’s neccessity. We’re not fighting a hot war just now, and iron sights will do just fine until replacements can be produred. Hopefully, this will never hit the Israeli media. ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2010, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-military-weapons-inscribed-with-secret-bible-codes/525518/69 "2010-01-19T18:19:11Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > I’m trying to envision the circumstances under which the answer to “What would Jesus do?” is “Go for a headshot.” Boom, saved ! ---
**Author:** ![Bear\_Nenno](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bear_nenno/32/3358_2.png) [@Bear\_Nenno](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bear_Nenno)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2010, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-military-weapons-inscribed-with-secret-bible-codes/525518/70 "2010-01-19T18:30:15Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > There’s neccessity, and there’s neccessity. We’re not fighting a hot war just now, and iron sights will do just fine until replacements can be produred. You’re out of your mind! Not fighting a hot war right now? Do you have any idea what you’re talking about? Do you have any idea of the benefit a 4x power ACOG has over iron sights? Do you know what the Bindon Aiming Concept is? What a wholely ignorant statement on your part. Plus you can’t just replace a sight that easily. Besides the fact that you would have to test all the potential replacements, you’d have to change training and support manuals and all kinds of other logistical shit. Not to mention the waste of money throwing out all those ACOGs. Ridiculous. I have an easier short-term fix. I just checked my ACOG and found I have JN8:12 on mine. Fuck me, I’ve never noticed it before. I mean, I’ve seen the long stream of digits before, it is hidden in the Part Number (not serial number). But it never occurred to me that it is a bible reference. As soon as I get back to my Outpost, I am going to take a dremel and file away that unwanted reference. I don’t have the authority to make the rest of the Army do it, but that would be a much better short term solution than having the entire military take off their ACOGs. There is no finer rifle sight out there. There is no substitute. File off all the bible verses and demand the company stop putting them on future sights. Makes more sense, right? I will be filing away my JN8:12 and the codes on all the sights in my squad. The next Taliban we shoot won’t die at the hands of a “Jesus Sight”. Fair enough? ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2010, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-military-weapons-inscribed-with-secret-bible-codes/525518/71 "2010-01-19T18:42:48Z")
Uh, **Bear**? IIRC, **Allessan** is Israeli. The “we” therefore refers to Israel. Could be wrong. Probably not. ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2010, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-military-weapons-inscribed-with-secret-bible-codes/525518/72 "2010-01-19T18:49:08Z")
I’d think that the main reason to censure the sight manufacturers wouldn’t be to pacify the terrorists, but to inform weapons manufacturers that it’s not their job to sneak propaganda messages onto military equipment intended for use by the government. Deciding what the US military’s PR position is, is Ceasar’s job. ---
**Author:** ![Bear\_Nenno](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bear_nenno/32/3358_2.png) [@Bear\_Nenno](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bear_Nenno)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2010, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-military-weapons-inscribed-with-secret-bible-codes/525518/73 "2010-01-19T18:51:23Z")
> [@](#): > > Uh, Bear? IIRC, Allessan is Israeli. The “we” therefore refers to Israel. Could be wrong. Probably not. My apologies. I am sitting in the computer center right now. I walked over to a buddy of mine and showed him the code on the sight. He asked what it meant. I told him it stands for "_When Jesus spoke again to the people, he said, “I am the light of the world. Whoever follows me will never walk in darkness, but will have the light of life.”_. I further explained that the public has gotten wind of this and people are getting upset. I didn’t realize it at the time, but the Command Sergeant Major of the BRIGADE was sitting next to him. He turned around and said “Well, what’s wrong with that?” My immediate response was, “Well. . . what if the soldier is Jewish, Sergeant Major” “Jews believe in the Bible!!” “They don’t believe in Jesus, Sergeant Major. This passage says one should follow Jesus. Wouldn’t they have a problem with that?” Then I quickly got out of that conversation before it progressed further. As I sat down he reminded me that it’s been like that for 30 years. I wanted to say “Slavery existed for centuries but that never made it right” (But I just went back to my screen) ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Excellent](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f19dbf/32.png) [@Mr.Excellent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Excellent)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2010, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-military-weapons-inscribed-with-secret-bible-codes/525518/74 "2010-01-19T18:53:59Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Uh, **Bear**? IIRC, **Allessan** is Israeli. The “we” therefore refers to Israel. Could be wrong. Probably not. And as an Israeli, he almost certainly has military experience. (The IDF practices near-universal conscription). He probably wasn’t a sniper (after all, most soldiers aren’t) - but the contention that he simply doesn’t know what he’s talking about, and is speaking from complete ignorance, is pretty far off-base. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2010, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-military-weapons-inscribed-with-secret-bible-codes/525518/75 "2010-01-19T18:54:06Z")
> [@Bear\_Nenno](#): > > My apologies… He’s a good egg, you’ll have no problem. ---
**Author:** ![Uosdwis\_R.Dewoh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Uosdwis\_R.Dewoh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Uosdwis_R.Dewoh)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2010, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-military-weapons-inscribed-with-secret-bible-codes/525518/76 "2010-01-19T19:01:07Z")
I for one suggest a lengthy double-blind study to determine if bible verses make sights more accurate. At the taxpayers’ expense, of course. ---
**Author:** ![Bear\_Nenno](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bear_nenno/32/3358_2.png) [@Bear\_Nenno](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bear_Nenno)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2010, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-military-weapons-inscribed-with-secret-bible-codes/525518/77 "2010-01-19T19:22:02Z")
> [@Mr.Excellent](#): > > And as an Israeli, he almost certainly has military experience. (The IDF practices near-universal conscription). He probably wasn’t a sniper (after all, most soldiers aren’t) - but the contention that he simply doesn’t know what he’s talking about, and is speaking from complete ignorance, is pretty far off-base. Well it was the statement that iron sights will “do just fine” combined with the fact that I assumed he meant “for the US Military”. I don’t doubt that the Israeli military has the current luxary of waiting to find a replacement and using iron sights in the meantime. A person making the statement I _thought_ he was making would be wholely ignorant on the subject. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2010, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-military-weapons-inscribed-with-secret-bible-codes/525518/78 "2010-01-19T19:56:35Z")
Nah, I’m just old. Back in my day we didn’t have these fancy-schmansy laser sights and whatnot. We used iron sights, and we \*liked \*it. (That aside, the IDF uses a hodgepodge of optics from a variety of manufacturers. I think Trijicon is currently the most popular, but it wouldn’t be that difficult them with something from a local producer like Elbit while still maintaining an operational level. I doubt this whole thing will as be as big a deal as I implied, anyway.) ---
**Author:** ![appleciders](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85f322/32.png) [@appleciders](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/appleciders)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2010, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-military-weapons-inscribed-with-secret-bible-codes/525518/79 "2010-01-19T20:25:58Z")
> [@Bear\_Nenno](#): > > I have an easier short-term fix. I just checked my ACOG and found I have JN8:12 on mine. Fuck me, I’ve never noticed it before. I mean, I’ve seen the long stream of digits before, it is hidden in the Part Number (not serial number). But it never occurred to me that it is a bible reference. > > As soon as I get back to my Outpost, I am going to take a dremel and file away that unwanted reference. I don’t have the authority to make the rest of the Army do it, but that would be a much better short term solution than having the entire military take off their ACOGs. There is no finer rifle sight out there. There is no substitute. File off all the bible verses and demand the company stop putting them on future sights. Makes more sense, right? > > I will be filing away my JN8:12 and the codes on all the sights in my squad. The next Taliban we shoot won’t die at the hands of a “Jesus Sight”. Fair enough? Buddy, will you be in my Army? Seriously, though, I foresee one hell of a problem in asking a Christian to file off a Bible verse from anything. Not that we shouldn’t fix this problem, but what’s an easy solution for some isn’t for all. ---
**Author:** ![ChrisBooth12](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e95f7d/32.png) [@ChrisBooth12](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ChrisBooth12)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2010, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-military-weapons-inscribed-with-secret-bible-codes/525518/80 "2010-01-19T21:38:57Z")
Who cares. How is this any different than us having missiles called “peace keepers” If it makes you feel better those verses are probably not even the real verses as our understanding of ancient hebrew has improved greatly from king james’s time Besides Yea, Though I fly through the Valley of Death… I shall fear no evil. For I am at 80,000 feet and climbing Is the best damn verse you can put on a piece of hardware [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-military-weapons-inscribed-with-secret-bible-codes/525518.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-military-weapons-inscribed-with-secret-bible-codes/525518.md?page=5)