# US or British jets intercepting Russian bombers **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [September 11, 2015, 11:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-or-british-jets-intercepting-russian-bombers/730732 "2015-09-11T23:05:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2015, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-or-british-jets-intercepting-russian-bombers/730732/41 "2015-09-14T19:39:07Z")
> [@Leo\_Bloom](#): > > Edinburgh? Aberdeen? The intercept **Fubaya** linked to pictures of was off the Scottish coast: > [@Fubaya](#): > > [Theaviationist.com](http://Theaviationist.com) posts lots of intercept photos and videos, including [this one](http://theaviationist.com/2015/09/11/tu-160s-intercepted-by-typhoons/) today. Typically, that would be the area near US/UK airspace that Soviet bombers approach most frequently; they run a sort of patrol route through the northern Atlantic. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2017, 7:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-or-british-jets-intercepting-russian-bombers/730732/42 "2017-05-16T07:52:20Z")
A bump for this Zombie thread since the[latest Aviationist](https://theaviationist.com/2017/05/15/dissecting-the-latest-close-encounter-between-u-s-f-22-raptors-and-russian-su-35s-flankers-off-alaska/) has an interesting description of an early May intercept off the US-Russia border area in the North Pacific Ocean > [@](#): > > On the night of May 3, 2017, two Russian nuclear-capable Tu-95MS Bear bombers, this time escorted by two Su-35S Flanker-E jets, flew again inside the Alaskan ADIZ (Air Defense Identification Zone). > > The “mini” package was intercepted by two U.S. Air Force F-22 Raptors some 50 NM to the south of Chariot, Alaska. > > The Su-35 is a 4++ generation aircraft characterized by supermaneuverability. Although it’s not stealth, it is equipped with a Irbis-E PESA (Passive Electronically-Scanned Array) and a long-range IRST – Infrared Search and Tracking – system capable, (according to Russian sources…) to detect stealth planes like the F-35 at a distance of over 90 kilometers… > ndeed, according to USAF, the Raptors were “committed” by North American Aerospace Defense Command to intercept the Russian aircraft while already in air patrol not too far away. It’s not clear whether the F-22s were already flying because involved in “Northern Edge”, Alaska’s largest and premier joint training exercise with MOB (Main Operating Base) at Joint Base Elmendorf-Richardson, or the CAP (Combat Air Patrol) was one of the measures introduced to enhance the readiness of the U.S. Air Force Air Defense assets as a consequence of the “unprecedented level activity of Russian bombers” recorded in the last months. > … > > The presence of Mainstay and Flanker confirms what this Author has already explained in the previous report about the key factors to take in consideration when planning a long-range strike sortie. > > In my opinion the “mini package” was launched as a consequence of the increased flight activity in Alaska related to the Northern Edge exercise, confirming that the Russians closely observe what happens in the Alaskan area. > > This time, they wanted to showcase their ability to plan a complex long-range sortie as well as the Flanker’s readiness to escort its own HVA (high value asset), the Bear, during operations at strategic distance. > > … > > The presence of the Mainstay should not be underestimated. It was flying well behind the Flanker and Bear aircraft with a specific purpose. As an AEW (Airborne Early Warning) platform the A-50 is believed to embed some ESM (Electronic Support Measures): in other words, it is able to detect far away targets as well as able to sniff radar, radio and data link emissions\*\*. Furthermore, Raptors in QRA (Quick Reaction Alert) _usually_ fly with external fuel tanks and Lunenburg lenses: this means that they are (consciously) visible to radars\*\*. In such conditions, although it can’t “characterize” the clean F-22’s signature, the Mainstay can at least gather some data about the interceptors’ radar emissions (if any) and observe and study their tactics. Emphasis added. This seems to be more sophisticated than the previous “lets send a couple of bombers” approach. Long range fighters, and AEW & EW platform. Plus the USAF in Alaska apparently has decided to sacrifice stealth for range and payload. And sensors, since the F22 has no IRST. ---
**Author:** ![Machine\_Elf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/82dd89/32.png) [@Machine\_Elf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machine_Elf)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2017, 12:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-or-british-jets-intercepting-russian-bombers/730732/43 "2017-05-16T12:09:09Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > Kawaii? Not a term I’m familiar with. I’m almost two years late, but I’ve finally arrived to fight your ignorance: > **[Kawaii](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kawaii)** > > Kawaii (Japanese: かわいい or 可愛い, \[kawaiꜜi\]; "cute" or "adorable") is a Japanese cultural phenomenon which emphasizes cuteness, childlike innocence, charm, and simplicity. Kawaii culture began to flourish in the 1970s, driven by youth culture and the rise of cute characters in manga and anime (comics and animation) and merchandise, exemplified by the creation of Hello Kitty by Sanrio in 1974. The kawaii aesthetic is characterized by soft or pastel colors, rounded shapes, and features which evoke v... ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2017, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-or-british-jets-intercepting-russian-bombers/730732/44 "2017-05-16T15:08:37Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > A bump for this Zombie thread since … 😕 “Lunenburg lenses?” ---
**Author:** ![Tranquilis](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tranquilis/32/3639_2.png) [@Tranquilis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tranquilis)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2017, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-or-british-jets-intercepting-russian-bombers/730732/45 "2017-05-16T17:28:50Z")
> [@Fubaya](#): > > Russia makes some beautiful planes. I think they’re winning the war in looks in fighter aircraft with the Fulcrum and Flanker family. The F-15, 22, and 35 look bland in comparison. Even going back a ways, MiG-21 vs F-4. F-4 was ugly on a stick. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2017, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-or-british-jets-intercepting-russian-bombers/730732/46 "2017-05-16T17:29:38Z")
“Intercepting” might just better be described as “greeting” or “escorting.” Although the name makes it sound like there is something kinetic or explosive that takes place. ---
**Author:** ![aldiboronti](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc348/32.png) [@aldiboronti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aldiboronti)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2017, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-or-british-jets-intercepting-russian-bombers/730732/47 "2017-05-16T18:09:15Z")
> [@Mangosteen](#): > > It seems to me that when the Russian bombers turn around and head home that it is a humiliating experience for them. They look like little doggies who got caught doing something they shouldn’t have and are now running away with their tails between their legs. Nothing humiliating about it in the least. The Russians are well aware they will be intercepted. They’re simply testing the response times of the Americans or British. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2017, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-or-british-jets-intercepting-russian-bombers/730732/48 "2017-05-16T18:12:47Z")
> [@Mangosteen](#): > > It seems to me that when the Russian bombers turn around and head home that it is a humiliating experience for them. They look like little doggies who got caught doing something they shouldn’t have and are now running away with their tails between their legs. As I understand it: 1. They hit bingo fuel at some point. At some point they have to go home no matter what. 2. They do \*\*\*not \*\*\*just go home as soon as the American fighters show up. They keep flying for hours, with the Americans next to them (am I right?) ---
**Author:** ![Atomic\_Alex](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atomic_alex/32/175_2.png) [@Atomic\_Alex](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atomic_Alex)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2017, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-or-british-jets-intercepting-russian-bombers/730732/49 "2017-05-16T18:56:12Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > But the Russians have been very eager to fly bombers, _which have no effective air-to-air sensors,_ through high density airspace just to prove they can. I’m a little surprised at that, and I may have misunderstood what you mean, but wouldn’t it be extremely important to know whats going on in the airspace around them? Especially in a hostile environment during a real shooting-war? ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2017, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-or-british-jets-intercepting-russian-bombers/730732/50 "2017-05-16T19:01:55Z")
> [@aldiboronti](#): > > They’re simply testing the response times of the Americans or British. And seeing how an F-22 looks on radar. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2017, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-or-british-jets-intercepting-russian-bombers/730732/51 "2017-05-16T19:20:06Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > And seeing how an F-22 looks on radar. Apparently, it shows up fine at long ranges on Russian IRST, or at least that’s what they seem to have discovered in Syria. The US seems to dispense with the stealth in Alaska. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2017, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-or-british-jets-intercepting-russian-bombers/730732/52 "2017-05-16T20:11:49Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > The US seems to dispense with the stealth in Alaska. How so, paint them differently? And, why? ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2017, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-or-british-jets-intercepting-russian-bombers/730732/53 "2017-05-16T20:13:20Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > How so, paint them differently? And, why? Carry external fuel tanks and weapons. As to why, I suppose its to get more range and payload. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2017, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-or-british-jets-intercepting-russian-bombers/730732/54 "2017-05-16T20:16:43Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > Carry external fuel tanks and weapons. As to why, I suppose its to get more range and payload. Thanks. ---
**Author:** ![wevets](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e9a140/32.png) [@wevets](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wevets)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2017, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-or-british-jets-intercepting-russian-bombers/730732/55 "2017-05-16T20:27:29Z")
> [@Leo\_Bloom](#): > > 😕 “Lunenburg lenses?” Possibly used as radar reflectors to deliberately make the Raptor more visible on radar (makes sense in peacetime)? Not sure, but I’ll defer to someone more knowledgeable to elaborate. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2017, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-or-british-jets-intercepting-russian-bombers/730732/56 "2017-05-16T20:28:55Z")
> [@wevets](#): > > Possibly used as radar reflectors to deliberately make the Raptor more visible on radar (makes sense in peacetime)? Not sure, but I’ll defer to someone more knowledgeable to elaborate. AIUI, American F-35s in Estonia are also doing that, to prevent Russians from finding out just how stealthy the F-35 really is. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2017, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-or-british-jets-intercepting-russian-bombers/730732/57 "2017-05-16T23:11:24Z")
> [@Leo\_Bloom](#): > > 😕 “Lunenburg lenses?” ETA: nicely ninja’d. See [Luneburg lens - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luneburg_lens) A device that acts sorta like a distorting funhouse mirror to radar. So that the F-22 looks to any radar like an ordinary airplane. That helps ATC keep track of them. It also, in peacetime, helps keep the Russians from learning just how stealthy the F-22 really is. Whatever signals they get back are bigger, and funhoused, versus what they’ll see in wartime. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2017, 5:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-or-british-jets-intercepting-russian-bombers/730732/58 "2017-05-17T05:04:00Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > It also, in peacetime, helps keep the Russians from learning just how stealthy the F-22 really is. Whatever signals they get back are bigger, and funhoused, versus what they’ll see in wartime. Won’t external stores (which Alaska F22 carry) accomplish that just fine? ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2017, 11:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-or-british-jets-intercepting-russian-bombers/730732/59 "2017-05-17T11:47:00Z")
They’ll certainly help. Since stealth is pretty much the USAF’s sole secret sauce I can imagine them being uber cautious about hiding it as best they know how. Alaska is a special case in that because it’s right adjacent to the Russian mainland it’s very cost-effective for the Russians to build a couple of radars or ESM facilities out near the edge and simply watch all our flying every day. And learn whatever comes of that. For them to do the same thing vs. the F-22s based at, e.g, Langley AFB in Norfolk Virginia they’d need to put the surveillance gear on an AGI ([Spy ship - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spy_ship#Soviet_AGI_trawlers)), park it halfway around the planet from their own territory, have two or three ships working in 2-month shifts, etc. Note the Soviet era “trawlers” have been superceded by more capable ships: [Vishnya-class intelligence ship - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vishnya-class_intelligence_ship). Which are correspondingly more expensive to operate. It’s telling to me that USAF chose to put F-22s in Alaska despite the counter-intel risk. The implication is there was some other specific risk they were mitigating. ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2017, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-or-british-jets-intercepting-russian-bombers/730732/60 "2017-05-17T16:04:55Z")
OK. Finally. [Doesn’t my dog look like an F-22 seen from above?](http://imgur.com/hYrAlew) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-or-british-jets-intercepting-russian-bombers/730732.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-or-british-jets-intercepting-russian-bombers/730732.md?page=4)