# US Southerners/Kentuckians: What's a "holler?" **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [June 22, 2018, 1:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-southerners-kentuckians-whats-a-holler/816569 "2018-06-22T13:46:56Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2018, 4:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-southerners-kentuckians-whats-a-holler/816569/101 "2018-06-25T04:16:29Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > NO. Most families in KY, or elsewhere, do not receive disability or retirement. **Moderator Note** Knock off the hijack about disabilities. If you want to discuss that, open a thread in Great Debates. This thread is about “hollers” and associated terms. Colibri General Questions Moderator ---
**Author:** ![D\_Anconia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@D\_Anconia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Anconia)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2018, 4:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-southerners-kentuckians-whats-a-holler/816569/102 "2018-06-25T04:17:45Z")
More than one poster in this thread is stereotyping in the worst way. They live in hollers, so they are probably on disability or retirement? What evidence do you have? ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2018, 4:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-southerners-kentuckians-whats-a-holler/816569/103 "2018-06-25T04:34:36Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > More than one poster in this thread is stereotyping in the worst way. They live in hollers, so they are probably on disability or retirement? What evidence do you have? **Moderator Instruction** Drop the hijack, or you will be subject to a warning for ignoring moderator instructions. Colibri General Questions Moderator PS. This instruction applies to everyone. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2018, 7:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-southerners-kentuckians-whats-a-holler/816569/104 "2018-06-25T07:18:52Z")
> [@Leo\_Bloom](#): > > Linky boo-boo. Can you check and send it again? Sorry, didn’t Dope on the weekend. [Band-aided linky](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Ringo). ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2018, 8:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-southerners-kentuckians-whats-a-holler/816569/105 "2018-06-25T08:04:27Z")
> [@Leo\_Bloom](#): > > Wiki[Appalachian English](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appalachian_English). What I find weird is how close that is to we hillbillies in another state and a completely different set of mountains. I’ve watched [videos](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=03iwAY4KlIU) of [people](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5PTML-P3Hl0) from [Appalachia](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=35JdnJzXX1U), and they sound like the old folk here in the Ozarks. They all resembled the accents at the old family reunion. The softened accent in that last video actually sounds like my grandparents. ---
**Author:** ![senoy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dbc845/32.png) [@senoy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/senoy)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2018, 1:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-southerners-kentuckians-whats-a-holler/816569/106 "2018-06-25T13:09:40Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > What I find weird is how close that is to we hillbillies in another state and a completely different set of mountains. I’ve watched [videos](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=03iwAY4KlIU) of [people](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5PTML-P3Hl0) from [Appalachia](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=35JdnJzXX1U), and they sound like the old folk here in the Ozarks. They all resembled the accents at the old family reunion. The softened accent in that last video actually sounds like my grandparents. Same people and same process. The Ozarks were populated by Scotch-Irish from the Southern Appalachians beginning in the early 19th century. The early settlers brought their Appalachian accents with some additions later. Basically what you have going on is that due to isolation, the speech patterns in the Appalachians and the Ozarks evolved much, much more slowly than in more urban areas. So both Ozark and Appalachian English are much less far removed from 17th and 18th century standard Scotch-Irish dialects. Since they are both very close to this 17th century proto-dialect, they are both very close to each other. ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_T](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/3ec8ea/32.png) [@Gary\_T](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_T)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2018, 2:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-southerners-kentuckians-whats-a-holler/816569/107 "2018-06-25T14:03:51Z")
After posting saw the moderator’s instructions, so deleted to comply. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2018, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-southerners-kentuckians-whats-a-holler/816569/108 "2018-06-25T14:47:29Z")
> [@Gary\_T](#): > > After posting saw the moderator’s instructions, so deleted to comply. Thank you. ---
**Author:** ![P-man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/p-man/32/3606_2.png) [@P-man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/P-man)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2018, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-southerners-kentuckians-whats-a-holler/816569/109 "2018-06-25T15:01:43Z")
The holler where I grew up was relatively close to more heavily populated areas, so our situation was a bit different. Our county had a population of well over 100K, and there was a small city of around 40K 10 minutes away. In some ways it wasn’t that different from what my friends in the subdivisions experienced. There was one difference, though. My friends in more populated areas played together after school, and got that all-important out of school socialization. That’s something I missed out on. Sure, I would have a friend over once in a while. It didn’t happen that often, though, and I missed out on being in a real neighborhood. By the time I was driving, I was already behind in my social development. Since I’m naturally introverted, it was a tough hill to climb. I don’t think anybody looked down on me because of where I lived, but it was weird not living within a mile or so of anyone in my class. Trying to explain to a first grade classmate where I lived was impossible. Funny that now I can go on Google Earth and show my students who live almost 400 miles away what the farm where I grew up looks like now. ---
**Author:** ![sbunny8](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c77e96/32.png) [@sbunny8](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sbunny8)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-southerners-kentuckians-whats-a-holler/816569/110 "2018-06-26T15:25:43Z")
n/m. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 8:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-southerners-kentuckians-whats-a-holler/816569/111 "2018-06-27T08:08:18Z")
I thought this thread would be about field hollers. So can I take it a holler is different from the kind of hollow that Stars Hollow is? Would that be more likely to be a copse, in New England? ---
**Author:** ![bibliophage](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bibliophage/32/7615_2.png) [@bibliophage](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bibliophage)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-southerners-kentuckians-whats-a-holler/816569/112 "2018-06-27T14:41:47Z")
In parts of New England we have similar landforms, but only rarely call them “hollows” and never “hollers.” Stars Hollow is a fictional town in Connecticut and from what I’ve seen of the show, it wasn’t set in a hollow. I’d guess the creators wanted a folksy sounding name and didn’t care much about geographic accuracy. According to the USGS Geographic Names Information System, there are about eight “populated places” (which includes formerly populated places) in Connecticut called \_\_\_\_ Hollow. Most of them seem to be little more than dots on a map. As far as I know, all of them are so called for being in a small valley of the same name. The former settlement of [Cotton Hollow](http://www.glastonbury-ct.gov/Home/Components/FacilityDirectory/FacilityDirectory/112/180), for example, is indeed located in a small narrow valley that once housed a cotton mill. ---
**Author:** ![DSYoungEsq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c6cbf5/32.png) [@DSYoungEsq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSYoungEsq)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-southerners-kentuckians-whats-a-holler/816569/113 "2018-06-27T16:20:42Z")
Then there is Sleepy Hollow. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 4:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-southerners-kentuckians-whats-a-holler/816569/114 "2018-06-27T16:42:03Z")
> [@bibliophage](#): > > In parts of New England we have similar landforms, but only rarely call them “hollows” and never “hollers.” Stars Hollow is a fictional town in Connecticut and from what I’ve seen of the show, it wasn’t set in a hollow. I’d guess the creators wanted a folksy sounding name and didn’t care much about geographic accuracy. According to the USGS Geographic Names Information System, there are about eight “populated places” (which includes formerly populated places) in Connecticut called \_\_\_\_ Hollow. Most of them seem to be little more than dots on a map. As far as I know, all of them are so called for being in a small valley of the same name. The former settlement of [Cotton Hollow](http://www.glastonbury-ct.gov/Home/Components/FacilityDirectory/FacilityDirectory/112/180), for example, is indeed located in a small narrow valley that once housed a cotton mill. [Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hollow#Natural_phenomena)had an alternative meaning of “low wooded area, such as a copse”, which was the reason for my question. It’s not a usage I know, so was wondering if it was NE dialect. ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 4:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-southerners-kentuckians-whats-a-holler/816569/115 "2018-06-27T16:58:51Z")
I never read “copse” to have any suggestion of being a “low” stand of trees. I also never heard it used like that, chiefly because I never heard anyone ever actually say it. Even me, surprisingly. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-southerners-kentuckians-whats-a-holler/816569/116 "2018-06-27T19:21:58Z")
> [@Leo\_Bloom](#): > > I never read “copse” to have any suggestion of being a “low” stand of trees It’s inherent in the meaning of the word - a copse, originally, was a stand of \*[coppiced](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coppicing)\*trees, which wouldn’t have time to attain their full height. So “low”. ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-southerners-kentuckians-whats-a-holler/816569/117 "2018-06-27T19:36:08Z")
Oh, no, not the trees themselves, but the geography of the land in/on which they’re growing. Never knew about “coppiced,” though, so thanks. Or that “stool” means “ground level.” ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2018, 10:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-southerners-kentuckians-whats-a-holler/816569/118 "2018-06-28T10:49:04Z")
> [@Leo\_Bloom](#): > > Or that “stool” means “ground level.” 😕 It doesn’t. “known as a stool” refers to the stump after cutback, not the level it’s cut to. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-southerners-kentuckians-whats-a-holler/816569.md?page=5)