# US supersonic bombers over the Korean peninsula **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [July 31, 2017, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-supersonic-bombers-over-the-korean-peninsula/792504 "2017-07-31T14:45:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Lucas\_Jackson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lucas_jackson/32/303_2.png) [@Lucas\_Jackson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lucas_Jackson)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2017, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-supersonic-bombers-over-the-korean-peninsula/792504/1 "2017-07-31T14:45:01Z")
Apparently the US and South Korea are pushing back against North Korea. I’m not usually a fan of saber rattling but in this case I feel it’s warranted. > [@](#): > > The United States flew two supersonic bombers over the Korean peninsula and tested out its missile defense system as a warning to North Korea after it conducted another successful test of an intercontinental ballistic missile that apparently proved its ability to strike the mainland U.S. Just in case the message wasn’t clear, the commander of the U.S. Pacific Air Forces warned that the United States and its allies are ready to “respond with rapid, lethal, and overwhelming force at a time and place of our choosing.” Gen. Terrence J. O’Shaughnessy was sure to point out that while “diplomacy remains the lead” it is important to “showcase our unwavering commitment while planning for the worst-case scenario.” How do you feel about it? [https://www.google.com/amp/amp.slate.com/blogs/the\_slatest/2017/07/30/general\_warns\_u\_s\_allies\_ready\_to\_unleash\_overwhelming\_force\_against\_north.html](https://www.google.com/amp/amp.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/2017/07/30/general_warns_u_s_allies_ready_to_unleash_overwhelming_force_against_north.html) ---
**Author:** ![Okrahoma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/90db22/32.png) [@Okrahoma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Okrahoma)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2017, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-supersonic-bombers-over-the-korean-peninsula/792504/2 "2017-07-31T14:54:56Z")
“Saber rattling” is a bluff, and a useless bluff at that, if your adversary knows, 100%, you’re not going to do anything. NK’s leadership seems (at least seems to me) to be completely convinced that US will not attack them militarily. Because of hundreds of thousands of casualties (or millions, if nuclear weapons are used) on the South Korean side if that happens. US and SK have no stomach for that whatsoever, it is very obvious. So US has no leverage. China has some economic leverage but is not willing to use it now, and I don’t think will ever, in foreseeable future, because a unified Korea is a bigger threat to it than the crazy North Korea, apparently. And the NK nuclear weapons genie is out of the bottle and is not going back in. ---
**Author:** ![Sailboat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sailboat/32/461_2.png) [@Sailboat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sailboat)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2017, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-supersonic-bombers-over-the-korean-peninsula/792504/3 "2017-07-31T16:32:30Z")
The key to the bluff is persuading the other side you are actually crazy enough to do it. If they believe you are crazier than they are, they might hesitate. This is the basis for Cold-War-era Mutually Assured Destruction and similar strategies. That said, in this case, the person we are trying to out-crazy is Kim Jong-un. A daunting task. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2017, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-supersonic-bombers-over-the-korean-peninsula/792504/4 "2017-07-31T16:59:12Z")
> [@Sailboat](#): > > That said, in this case, the person we are trying to out-crazy is Kim Jong-un. > > A daunting task. Someone in another thread suggested that we shoot them down. Park a missile cruiser or destroyer nearby, and shoot them down in international waters. ---
**Author:** ![Defensive\_Indifference](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/defensive_indifference/32/6502_2.png) [@Defensive\_Indifference](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Defensive_Indifference)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2017, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-supersonic-bombers-over-the-korean-peninsula/792504/5 "2017-07-31T17:05:10Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > Someone in another thread suggested that we shoot them down. > Park a missile cruiser or destroyer nearby, and shoot them down in international waters. By “them”, you mean the DPRK missiles? My understanding is that the missile intercept technology we have is still pretty iffy. If we shoot at one of their test missiles and miss, we look like even bigger doofuses. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2017, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-supersonic-bombers-over-the-korean-peninsula/792504/6 "2017-07-31T17:19:59Z")
> [@Bayard](#): > > By “them”, you mean the DPRK missiles? My understanding is that the missile intercept technology we have is still pretty iffy. If we shoot at one of their test missiles and miss, we look like even bigger doofuses. I thought we had become rather good at it, I was mistaken. ---
**Author:** ![El\_Kabong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/el_kabong/32/496_2.png) [@El\_Kabong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Kabong)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2017, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-supersonic-bombers-over-the-korean-peninsula/792504/7 "2017-07-31T17:23:31Z")
> [@Bayard](#): > > By “them”, you mean the DPRK missiles? My understanding is that the missile intercept technology we have is still pretty iffy. If we shoot at one of their test missiles and miss, we look like even bigger doofuses. Also, an unnecessary provocation at this point, IMO. AFAIK there are no indications that the North Koreans have a deliverable missile-launched nuclear weapon. ---
**Author:** ![Okrahoma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/90db22/32.png) [@Okrahoma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Okrahoma)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2017, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-supersonic-bombers-over-the-korean-peninsula/792504/8 "2017-07-31T17:26:23Z")
> [@El\_Kabong](#): > > Also, an unnecessary provocation at this point, IMO. AFAIK there are no indications that the North Koreans have a deliverable missile-launched nuclear weapon. Yet. They are not that far away from it. Give them a couple of years. The couple of year that they (see my first post) definitely are going to get. ---
**Author:** ![Defensive\_Indifference](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/defensive_indifference/32/6502_2.png) [@Defensive\_Indifference](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Defensive_Indifference)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2017, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-supersonic-bombers-over-the-korean-peninsula/792504/9 "2017-07-31T17:32:51Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > I thought we had become rather good at it, I was mistaken. You’re giving me too much credit. 🙂 I really don’t know either. Hopefully one of our resident experts in the area will drop in soon. ---
**Author:** ![GusNSpot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gusnspot/32/436_2.png) [@GusNSpot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GusNSpot)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2017, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-supersonic-bombers-over-the-korean-peninsula/792504/10 "2017-07-31T22:36:06Z")
I’m crazy. Preempt NK, then look at Iran, Syria & Iraq real hard and be obvious about it. And be ready to follow through. If we are not/don’t, we are going to lose it all anyway by sitting on our asses. YMMV; IMHO Forum; etc… ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2017, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-supersonic-bombers-over-the-korean-peninsula/792504/11 "2017-07-31T22:49:59Z")
By “preempt North Korea”, you mean “bomb Seoul to rubble before they do”? Remember, we’re not the ones with the biggest stake in what happens. ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2017, 12:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-supersonic-bombers-over-the-korean-peninsula/792504/12 "2017-08-01T00:02:37Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > Someone in another thread suggested that we shoot them down. > Park a missile cruiser or destroyer nearby, and shoot them down in international waters. Yes, let’s convince them to abandon this research and instead put millions into figuring out how they could, say, ship a bomb to the US. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2017, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-supersonic-bombers-over-the-korean-peninsula/792504/13 "2017-08-01T00:09:18Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > Someone in another thread suggested that we shoot them down. > [@Bayard](#): > > By “them”, you mean the DPRK missiles? I assumed he meant our own bombers. It’ll show Kim what “crazy” _really_ looks like. ---
**Author:** ![GusNSpot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gusnspot/32/436_2.png) [@GusNSpot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GusNSpot)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2017, 1:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-supersonic-bombers-over-the-korean-peninsula/792504/14 "2017-08-01T01:20:37Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > By “preempt North Korea”, you mean “bomb Seoul to rubble before they do”? Remember, we’re not the ones with the biggest stake in what happens. The ability to read what is not there and to jump to less than great insight as to what a person is saying is really mind boggling. I know I am hard to follow without resorting to Dick & Jane so here goes; Thread is more or less about what to do about NK. One of the many interpretations is to hit them before they hit us. To suggest we strike Seoul, with no hint of humor is really , well strange. :smack: NK is rattling sabers at the USA so we don’t mess around and just blow them away preemptively. Solves a lot of problem for SK also. 🆒 Should I make my sentences even smaller? > [@](#): > > Miller =“I assumed he meant our own bombers. > It’ll show Kim what “crazy” really looks like.” Bawahahahaha :eek: :rolleyes: **Miller** seems intent on proving that he does not understand what people are saying even more. :rolleyes: ad. in. fi. night. um… ← \* YMMV, I assume of course. Assume Assume ---
**Author:** ![Defensive\_Indifference](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/defensive_indifference/32/6502_2.png) [@Defensive\_Indifference](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Defensive_Indifference)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2017, 1:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-supersonic-bombers-over-the-korean-peninsula/792504/15 "2017-08-01T01:29:51Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > I assumed he meant our own bombers. > > It’ll show Kim what “crazy” _really_ looks like. Just like the “bottle scene” in _The Long Goodbye_! That’ll show 'em! ---
**Author:** ![David\_H\_Singanas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ac8455/32.png) [@David\_H\_Singanas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/David_H_Singanas)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2017, 2:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-supersonic-bombers-over-the-korean-peninsula/792504/16 "2017-08-01T02:25:11Z")
AFAIK , South Korea does not want the U.S. to “attack” the DPRK. Seoul wants the ABM defense shield but we have never proved that we can destroy a DPRK missile or aircraft. This is because they have not yet entered our defense perimeter and our protected airspace over South Korea and Japan. ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2017, 2:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-supersonic-bombers-over-the-korean-peninsula/792504/17 "2017-08-01T02:34:48Z")
> [@Sailboat](#): > > …That said, in this case, the person we are trying to out-crazy is Kim Jong-un. > > A daunting task. I’m sure President Trump is up to it. ---
**Author:** ![bordelond](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bordelond/32/150_2.png) [@bordelond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bordelond)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2017, 2:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-supersonic-bombers-over-the-korean-peninsula/792504/18 "2017-08-01T14:27:32Z")
I’ve often wondered what would happen if a NK missile test had a malfunction that landed the missile in, say, a remote area of Hokkaido. Or maybe Attu Island, the westernmost of the Aleutians. If there were no Japanese or American casualties, would the U.S. have sufficient pretense to attack North Korea’s missile-launching sites? ---
**Author:** ![Okrahoma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/90db22/32.png) [@Okrahoma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Okrahoma)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2017, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-supersonic-bombers-over-the-korean-peninsula/792504/19 "2017-08-01T14:38:03Z")
> [@bordelond](#): > > I’ve often wondered what would happen if a NK missile test had a malfunction that landed the missile in, say, a remote area of Hokkaido. Or maybe Attu Island, the westernmost of the Aleutians. If there were no Japanese or American casualties, would the U.S. have sufficient pretense to attack North Korea’s missile-launching sites? First, I don’t think you can “attack NK missile-launching sites” without triggering an all-out shelling of Seoul. Second, I don’t see why US needs “pretense” to attack NK. If US could figure out a plan to attack NK without massive casualties for South Korea (and if they could get SK to agree to it), the attack could be tomorrow, without any “pretense”. NK has given enough reasons to do that over the years. Having a crazy rogue state with nuclear weapons is reason enough. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2017, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-supersonic-bombers-over-the-korean-peninsula/792504/20 "2017-08-01T14:38:59Z")
> [@bordelond](#): > > I’ve often wondered what would happen if a NK missile test had a malfunction that landed the missile in, say, a remote area of Hokkaido. Or maybe Attu Island, the westernmost of the Aleutians. If there were no Japanese or American casualties, would the U.S. have sufficient pretense to attack North Korea’s missile-launching sites? I think this would be a case of “Legally justified but practically unwise.” Any attack on North Korea is likely to lead to retaliation that will have a heavier toll than is worth it (although such a North Korean retaliation would probably be quite limited, since NKers are still rational - maybe “only” hundreds of Seoul residents dead, millions of dollars damage). So if a North Korean missile hits Japan or South Korea or the USA and doesn’t actually cause real harm, I’d guess that there’d be no retaliation except for sanctions, maybe some cyber-sabotage, etc. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/us-supersonic-bombers-over-the-korean-peninsula/792504.md?page=2)