But lots of names transmitted to us through classical Greek culture and civilisation are names of places not in Europe, and indeed names adopted the Greeks, but originally conferred by other, non-European cultures. Troy, already mentioned, is in Asia minor, and was probably named by the Hittites. Utica is in North Africa (and was named by the Phoenicians). There are several Smyrnas in the US; they are all named after the original in what is now Turkey. And so forth.
I wasn’t objecting to Utica and Troy, but rather to Attica, Syracuse, and Rome (not Greek, but European). As far as Smyrna, I contributed that name about 3 posts before yours, even though it’s actually a Greek name. At least as Greek as Athens, if not more so. Is it European or not?
Because of such potential rabbit holes, I’m going to consider only the immediate antecedent and where those antecedents are located, rather than try to follow names back to their ultimate origin. So I’m accepting the Australian names; you can do different if you want.
no, that’s a city in Russia. MOSS-cow is a town in Idaho
Ohio has both Mecca and Medina.
Fun fact: Medina was originally going to be named Mecca, but when they found out there already was a Mecca, Ohio, they picked the other holy city of Islam as its namesake. American culture had a little love affair with Islam in the first half of the 19th century when these places were founded, now completely forgotten.
dammit, I’m getting old. Rick was correct, I had it backwards:smack: the cows are in Russia and the coes are in Idaho.
if you look it up you will find at least one website that claims its moss-go…do not be fooled by this.
Being British, not American – could I request a bit of clarification on the “Moscow” issue? Would I be right in inferring that the standard US pronunciation of Russia’s capital, is “MOSS-cow”; and that US towns of that name, not wishing for association with Communism or other nasty stuff, choose to be pronounced “MOSS-ko”? In the UK, we always pronounce the Russian capital “MOSS-ko”; over here, sounding the second syllable like the name of the bovine animal is AFAIK unheard-of.
(Of course, the Russians pronounce their capital “MOSK-va”…)
A bit of admittedly irrelevant trivia: in Scotland, a little way south of Glasgow, there’s a small hamlet called Moscow (how people pronounce it, I don’t know). It’s situated on a stream called the Volga Burn – the real Moscow is of course not on the River Volga, but, poetic license?
Well, I don’t know about other Moscows in the US, but for Moscow Idaho, if I have my historical folklore correct, no, it wasn’t to distance themselves from communist taint. Moscow ID was incorporated in 1887 so Russia was still a tsarist monarchy.
Actually, here is a link to the official website of Moscow Idaho. It’s sparse, but pronunciation probably has nothing at all to do with Moscow Russia.
This is correct. Cite: spent a lot of time in Moscow, Idaho.
And definitely no-go.
The city in Russia is pronounced “Mos-cow”, but “Mos-co” is closer to the native pronuciation. I don’t know about the city in Idaho.
The city in Russia is pronounced Musk-VAH
Damn! I missed the edit window. What I meant to say is that many AMRICANS pronounce the name of the city in Russia “Mos-cow.”
You’re probably right, but when I hear a Russian speaker say it, it sounds an awful lot like “mos-co” to my untrained ear. I did say that it is “closer” to the native pronunciation, not that it is the correct native pronunciation.
I guess Dopers could eventually list all the US placenames, and speculate about their derivations, but it might be worth mentioning that virtually every state has at least one book devoted to scholarly research of its placenames—a field usually called toponymy. I have about 30 of them. The most prominent national compilation is George Stewart’s American Place-Names, though I have another half-dozen nationwide volumes that focus on the most unusual.
One danger in this field is “folk etymology.” For instance, nearly anyone you ask about Half Day, Illinois, will relate what they heard from grampa, that it was a half day by some old mode of travel from Chicago. Or Milwaukee, or someplace. It was, in fact, named for the Native American Half-Day, also known as Aptakisic.
The journal of onomastics, Names, often runs scholarly articles focused on placenames.
I can testify to the truthfulness of this. Almost did it myself just a few posts upthread, the historical folklore thing that is.
Moscow. Enter the hymen store. Two men are scorched and burned. Kite me a sign.
Yup. The march ends in Normal, Illinois.
Potosi, Wisconsin was probably named to evoke the great mine of Bolivia (there were some lead mines in this corner of Wisconsin).
Our city cemetery is the Mt. Pisgah Cemetery.
Don’t forget Montevideo, MN.
I have never met anybody that pronounced Des Moines as anything other than Deh Moyn, unless they were doing it with humorous intent.