# USA massive bombing campaign **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [January 12, 2008, 3:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-massive-bombing-campaign/433241 "2008-01-12T03:18:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![jimsies](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f9ae1b/32.png) [@jimsies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jimsies)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2008, 3:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-massive-bombing-campaign/433241/1 "2008-01-12T03:18:20Z")
[http://www.komotv.com/news/national/13707017.html](http://www.komotv.com/news/national/13707017.html) The article speaks for itself. Sickening. ---
**Author:** ![Q.E.D](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/51bf81/32.png) [@Q.E.D](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Q.E.D)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2008, 3:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-massive-bombing-campaign/433241/2 "2008-01-12T03:27:58Z")
> [@The article](#): > > The targets consisted mainly of weapons caches and powerful roadside bombs buried deep underground - key defensive elements for al-Qaida in Iraq insurgents, said Donnelly and Army Col. Terry Ferrell, commander of the 2nd Brigade Combat Team, 3rd Infantry Division. > > … > > Despite the massive size of the airstrikes, Donnelly said that to the military’s knowledge, no civilians were killed. That could not immediately be independently confirmed. He added that strikes on three targets were called off because unmanned surveillance planes showed civilians in those areas. How awful. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2008, 3:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-massive-bombing-campaign/433241/3 "2008-01-12T03:33:35Z")
[QUOTE=jimsies] > **[Seattle News, Weather, Sports, Breaking News](https://komonews.com)** > > KOMO 4 TV provides news, sports, weather and local event coverage in the Seattle, Washington area including Bellevue, Redmond, Renton, Kent, Tacoma, Bremerton, SeaTac, Auburn, Mercer Island, Bothell, Shoreline, Lynnwood, Mill Creek and Everett. The article speaks for itself. Sickening. [/QUOTE] Hmmmm. > [@](#): > > As U.S. and Iraqi ground forces move through areas to push out insurgents, Ferrell said members of the so-called “Awakening Council” movement - mostly Sunni fighters who switched sides to join in the fight against al-Qaida - will be relied upon to stabilize the region and maintain security. > > It was those Sunni fighters, Ferrell said, who largely provided the intelligence that allowed U.S. forces to locate the targets destroyed in Thursday’s bombing. I’ll be surprised if it eventually doesn’t turn out that we were bombing people who were the enemies of these Sunni fighters, who had nothing at all to do with Al Qaeda. > [@](#): > > Despite the massive size of the airstrikes, Donnelly said that to the military’s knowledge, no civilians were killed. That could not immediately be independently confirmed. He added that strikes on three targets were called off because unmanned surveillance planes showed civilians in those areas. Riiiiight. I don’t buy that for a moment. > [@](#): > > Little initial resistance has been reported, though at least nine U.S. soldiers have been killed since the offensive began - the deadliest days for American forces since last fall. Little resistance, in what’s supposed to be such a hotbed of enemy activity ? ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2008, 3:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-massive-bombing-campaign/433241/4 "2008-01-12T03:35:12Z")
[QUOTE=Q.E.D.] How awful. :rolleyes: [/QUOTE] Because, of course, we should take the word of known liars and vicious conquerors. :rolleyes: right back at you. ---
**Author:** ![Tristan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tristan/32/18058_2.png) [@Tristan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tristan)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2008, 3:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-massive-bombing-campaign/433241/5 "2008-01-12T03:37:48Z")
Of course, you have the only reliable source of info… ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2008, 3:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-massive-bombing-campaign/433241/6 "2008-01-12T03:39:12Z")
[QUOTE=jimsies] > **[Seattle News, Weather, Sports, Breaking News](https://komonews.com)** > > KOMO 4 TV provides news, sports, weather and local event coverage in the Seattle, Washington area including Bellevue, Redmond, Renton, Kent, Tacoma, Bremerton, SeaTac, Auburn, Mercer Island, Bothell, Shoreline, Lynnwood, Mill Creek and Everett. The article speaks for itself. Sickening. [/QUOTE] Sickening? Methinks not. ---
**Author:** ![fatgail](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fatgail/32/7285_2.png) [@fatgail](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fatgail)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2008, 3:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-massive-bombing-campaign/433241/7 "2008-01-12T03:43:50Z")
Apropos of nothing, when various ‘truthers’ refuse to offer explanation for their disgust and simply post a link and a word of narrow eyed disapproval, I automatically assume that they really didn’t understand what they just read and are hoping someone else will make their ponts for them. Just, you know, FYI. ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2008, 4:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-massive-bombing-campaign/433241/8 "2008-01-12T04:00:51Z")
From the article in the OP: > [@](#): > > Extremists were believed to have controlled Arab Jabour, a Sunni district lined with citrus groves, but Ferrell said “the predominant number” have now fled to the southwest since his troops’ operations began Jan. 1. > … > The targets consisted mainly of weapons caches and powerful roadside bombs buried deep underground A little more clarity on exactly what was bombed [from af.mil](http://www.af.mil/news/story.asp?id=123081684): > [@](#): > > FORWARD OPERATING BASE KALSU, Iraq (AFPN) – More than 40 targets were hit after precision air strikes destroyed reported al-Qaida safe havens Jan. 10 in Arab Jabour, Iraq. > > The precision air strikes supported Operation Phantom Phoenix, the overarching operation that includes Operation Marne Thunderbolt. [From the white house:](http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2007/11/20071102-9.html) > [@](#): > > For Immediate Release > Office of the Press Secretary > November 2, 2007 > > Fact Sheet: The Way Forward in Iraq: Successes and Challenges > President Bush Says “Return On Success” Plan Is Putting Us On The Right Track To Win In Iraq > … > > Bringing Economic Improvements With Improvements In Security > > Successes > > ``` > * With improvements in security, we are also seeing improvements in important economic indicators. > o Inflation has been cut in half since last year. > o Electricity production in September reached its highest levels since the war began – and is higher than it was under Saddam. > > * When Iraqis do not have to fear the terrorists, they can build a better life for themselves. > o In Baqubah, the historic market has been reopened in a city that had been in a virtual lockdown a few months ago. > o In Fallujah, workers have turned an artillery factory into a civilian machine shop employing 600 people. > o In the Baghdad neighborhood of Ameriya, an al Qaeda stronghold until a few months ago, locals have returned and are reopening their shops. > o In Arab Jabour, another former al Qaeda stronghold, a local butcher said that as recently as last June he was selling only one or two sheep per week. Now, with the terrorists cleaned out and residents returning home, he is selling one or two sheep per day. > > ``` Could it be that we just bombed the shit out of one of our own ‘success stories’? How did the terrorists manage to build those ‘deep underground’ caches in the two month’s since we were told that Arab Jabour was a ‘success’? ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2008, 4:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-massive-bombing-campaign/433241/9 "2008-01-12T04:03:51Z")
[QUOTE=Tristan] Of course, you have the only reliable source of info… [/QUOTE] Don’t distort what I said. I said that I don’t trust anything the military says, after all the lies it’s spouted in the past. The only “source of info” I have is this story, and my whole point is that I DON’T consider it reliable. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2008, 4:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-massive-bombing-campaign/433241/10 "2008-01-12T04:09:37Z")
[QUOTE=Squink] How did the terrorists manage to build those ‘deep underground’ caches in the two month’s since we were told that Arab Jabour was a ‘success’? [/QUOTE] Either the “Success” story is wrong; the “victory over terrorists” story is wrong, or both are wrong. It would be the kind of screwup I’ve come to expect if we DID blow up some place that was actually getting better. ---
**Author:** ![PetW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/d2c977/32.png) [@PetW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PetW)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2008, 4:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-massive-bombing-campaign/433241/11 "2008-01-12T04:12:49Z")
Funny, the OP says the article “speaks for itself”, then **Q.E.D**. points out what it actually says, which isn’t sickening at all. I guess the article didn’t speak for itself, it needed **Der Trihs** to read between the lines for us. I understand that it’s generally considered that the entire war effort has been a clusterfuck from the beginning, but is it so unlikely that we can carry out a “massive bombing campaign” that is actually successful in achieving our goals? I’ve never considered myself an optimist, but must we assume that every positive news story that comes out about the war is complete bullshit? ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2008, 4:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-massive-bombing-campaign/433241/12 "2008-01-12T04:50:13Z")
As a rule of thumb, one can normally take the military’s version of events (or the media’s version, which is to say the military’s) and **Der Trihs** ’s third-rate evil comic book supervillain interpretation, and use them to triangulate an approximation of the actual truth. I’ve found it to work nicely for a number of topics relating to the war, politics, and religion. Hope you don’t mind me using you in this way, **DT**. You’re an amazing tool. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2008, 4:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-massive-bombing-campaign/433241/13 "2008-01-12T04:53:00Z")
[QUOTE=Squink] … How did the terrorists manage to build those ‘deep underground’ caches in the two month’s since we were told that Arab Jabour was a ‘success’? [/QUOTE] The is a very convenient explanation for for all the “precision” bombs that, on the “surface”, appear to fall on empty fields of nothing. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2008, 4:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-massive-bombing-campaign/433241/14 "2008-01-12T04:53:10Z")
> [@](#): > > …but must we assume that every positive news story that comes out about the war is complete bullshit? History shows that to be a markedly reliable standard ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2008, 5:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-massive-bombing-campaign/433241/15 "2008-01-12T05:06:15Z")
Boy, another crushing defeat for Al Queda! Seems like an unbroken string of defeats, five years of getting their asses blown to pieces. They’re like Jubilation T. Cornpone, geneal of Cornpone’s Defeat. Cornpone’s Rout, and Cornpone’s Utter Humiliation. Death throes. Definately death throes. Any minute now. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2008, 5:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-massive-bombing-campaign/433241/16 "2008-01-12T05:14:25Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > History shows that to be a markedly reliable standard > Today 10:53 PM [QUOTE=elucidator] Boy, another crushing defeat for Al Queda! Seems like an unbroken string of defeats, five years of getting their asses blown to pieces. They’re like Jubilation T. Cornpone, geneal of Cornpone’s Defeat. Cornpone’s Rout, and Cornpone’s Utter Humiliation. Death throes. Definately death throes. Any minute now. [/QUOTE] Zzzzzzzzz…Huh, what…somebody say somethin’? Oh, it’s just **luci** … Zzzzzzzzzzzzz… ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2008, 5:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-massive-bombing-campaign/433241/17 "2008-01-12T05:14:37Z")
[QUOTE=Vinyl Turnip] As a rule of thumb, one can normally take the military’s version of events (or the media’s version, which is to say the military’s) and **Der Trihs** ’s third-rate evil comic book supervillain interpretation, and use them to triangulate an approximation of the actual truth. I’ve found it to work nicely for a number of topics relating to the war, politics, and religion. Hope you don’t mind me using you in this way, **DT**. You’re an amazing tool. [/QUOTE] Ha. Ha. The actual truth is at least as bad as I’ve portrayed it. And we are quite a bit worse than most comic book supervillains, so you should stop slandering them by comparing them to us. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2008, 5:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-massive-bombing-campaign/433241/18 "2008-01-12T05:17:11Z")
[QUOTE=Starving Artist] Zzzzzzzzz…Huh, what…somebody say somethin’? Oh, it’s **luci** … Zzzzzzzzzzzzz… [/QUOTE] He passed out again. Somebody help me turn him on his stomach… ---
**Author:** ![Duke\_of\_Rat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ad7895/32.png) [@Duke\_of\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duke_of_Rat)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2008, 5:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-massive-bombing-campaign/433241/19 "2008-01-12T05:24:13Z")
[QUOTE=fatgail] I automatically assume that they really didn’t understand what they just read and are hoping someone else will make their ponts for them. [/QUOTE] My ponts need a little taking up in the cuff, can you help? ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2008, 5:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-massive-bombing-campaign/433241/20 "2008-01-12T05:26:10Z")
[QUOTE=elucidator] He passed out again. Somebody help me turn him on his stomach… [/QUOTE] Hey!..be careful!..don’t knock over the bottle, that shit’s _expensive_! Zzzzz… [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-massive-bombing-campaign/433241.md?page=2)