# USA really too different from English-speaking world to have similar policies? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [January 27, 2009, 6:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-really-too-different-from-english-speaking-world-to-have-similar-policies/483193 "2009-01-27T06:04:59Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 13
**Author:** ![Gam\_Zeh\_Yaavor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/3e96dc/32.png) [@Gam\_Zeh\_Yaavor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gam_Zeh_Yaavor)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2009, 1:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-really-too-different-from-english-speaking-world-to-have-similar-policies/483193/241 "2009-01-30T01:12:58Z")
> [@brazil84](#): > > ROTFLMAO. Instead, you rather keep throwing up strawmen, hey? I don’t blame you. Oh, mercy. Strawmen? You believe that your race is naturally superior and deserves better treatment than other races. You readily accept tremendous bullshit. Why should I even attempt to have a rational discussion with you? Keep rolling on the floor, my main man. ---
**Author:** ![brazil84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8491ac/32.png) [@brazil84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brazil84)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2009, 1:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-really-too-different-from-english-speaking-world-to-have-similar-policies/483193/242 "2009-01-30T01:20:20Z")
> [@Gam\_Zeh\_Yaavor](#): > > Oh, mercy. Strawmen? You believe that your race is naturally superior and deserves better treatment than other races. Lol. Yet another strawman. > [@](#): > > Why should I even attempt to have a rational discussion with you? You probably shouldn’t until you have removed the beam from your eye. > [@](#): > > Keep rolling on the floor, my main man. Keep on entertaining me, and I’ll keep on laughing. ---
**Author:** ![MichaelQReilly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/df705f/32.png) [@MichaelQReilly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MichaelQReilly)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2009, 1:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-really-too-different-from-english-speaking-world-to-have-similar-policies/483193/243 "2009-01-30T01:24:10Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > And that is because…? A bunch of reasons that I don’t know enough about to really explain to you. Ask a GQ, that should get you a good answer. But I will note that in that same time period salaries for CEOs and the like have risen exponentially, so it seems there is at least a prima facie case for that being one of the main reasons for the decline. ---
**Author:** ![Biggirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biggirl/32/3294_2.png) [@Biggirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biggirl)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2009, 1:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-really-too-different-from-english-speaking-world-to-have-similar-policies/483193/244 "2009-01-30T01:30:39Z")
> [@brazil84](#): > > Lol. Yet another strawman. > > You probably shouldn’t until you have removed the beam from your eye. > > Keep on entertaining me, and I’ll keep on laughing. Oh sure, you’re laughing on the outside but inside, _inside_ you know that your genetic greatness is being diminished every day by the classless underclass. Those criminal, lazy, genetically inferior. . . people. . . are gaining on you. They already think they are as good as you and soon it won’t matter that they’re not. Everyone will be treating them as if they were. Inside the tears are hot and bitter. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2009, 1:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-really-too-different-from-english-speaking-world-to-have-similar-policies/483193/245 "2009-01-30T01:45:21Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > Don’t know, don’t care since it is immaterial. How is it immaterial? A couple of pages ago you decided that our government must waste all our money because we spend heaps and don’t have UHC. The reason, dear, is that we spend all our money on defense. That, and we’re not smart enough to realize that tax cuts only make sense with a corresponding decrease in spending. > [@](#): > > Why? Why does Medicare help defraud the cost of training doctors? I don’t know… maybe so we’ll have some doctors. They’re handy if you’re sick, you know. ---
**Author:** ![Gam\_Zeh\_Yaavor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/3e96dc/32.png) [@Gam\_Zeh\_Yaavor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gam_Zeh_Yaavor)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2009, 2:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-really-too-different-from-english-speaking-world-to-have-similar-policies/483193/246 "2009-01-30T02:54:21Z")
> [@brazil84](#): > > You probably shouldn’t until you have removed the beam from your eye. > Keep on entertaining me, and I’ll keep on laughing. Laughter really is the only way to (pardon the expression) tolerate the inevitably rising tide of Mud People, isn’t it? It must chafe your tender Aryan hide. **Biggirl** : sorry to steal your thunder here, I just couldn’t resist. P.S. I tried to get the beam removed from my eye the other day, but there were too many _brown types_ ahead of me in the line at the ER. ---
**Author:** ![brazil84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8491ac/32.png) [@brazil84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brazil84)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2009, 3:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-really-too-different-from-english-speaking-world-to-have-similar-policies/483193/247 "2009-01-30T03:23:41Z")
> [@Gam\_Zeh\_Yaavor](#): > > Laughter really is the only way to (pardon the expression) tolerate the inevitably rising tide of Mud People, isn’t it? It must chafe your tender Aryan hide. Lol. Inventing strawmen to attack really is the only way to distract yourself from your hypocricy, isn’t it? > [@](#): > > Oh sure, you’re laughing on the outside but inside, inside you know that your genetic greatness is being diminished every day by the classless underclass :shrug: I look forward to the day when the underclass is actually lifted up. ---
**Author:** ![Gam\_Zeh\_Yaavor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/3e96dc/32.png) [@Gam\_Zeh\_Yaavor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gam_Zeh_Yaavor)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2009, 3:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-really-too-different-from-english-speaking-world-to-have-similar-policies/483193/248 "2009-01-30T03:33:47Z")
> [@brazil84](#): > > Lol. Inventing strawmen to attack really is the only way to distract yourself from your hypocricy, isn’t it? I think we’ve been keeping the Straw Man down for too long. > [@](#): > > :shrug: I look forward to the day when the underclass is actually lifted up. How could a naturally inferior underclass possibly be lifted up? Perhaps if each class had its own territory, each one _separate_, yet _equal_. Or maybe if there’s some sort of _selection_ of the stronger from the weaker elements, so that everyone has the living space they need. Yes, that sounds like a proper, final solution. :shrug: ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2009, 3:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-really-too-different-from-english-speaking-world-to-have-similar-policies/483193/249 "2009-01-30T03:39:49Z")
> [@MichaelQReilly](#): > > A bunch of reasons that I don’t know enough about to really explain to you. Ask a GQ, that should get you a good answer. > > But I will note that in that same time period salaries for CEOs and the like have risen exponentially, so it seems there is at least a prima facie case for that being one of the main reasons for the decline. You don’t know the reason, but you still don’t think it is because we’ve been taxing the crap out of the middle class to support the poor, without similarly taxing the rich? ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2009, 3:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-really-too-different-from-english-speaking-world-to-have-similar-policies/483193/250 "2009-01-30T03:46:23Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > How is it immaterial? A couple of pages ago you decided that our government must waste all our money because we spend heaps and don’t have UHC. The reason, dear, is that we spend all our money on defense. What does that have to do with what Canada spends? That’s what was immaterial. > [@](#): > > That, and we’re not smart enough to realize that tax cuts only make sense with a corresponding decrease in spending. EXACTLY! All we do is keep adding to the tax burden without - gasp! - determining that maybe we don’t really need to spend hundreds of dollar on toilet seats. The ability of the middle class to pay taxes is not infinite. > [@](#): > > Why does Medicare help defraud the cost of training doctors? I don’t know… maybe so we’ll have some doctors. They’re handy if you’re sick, you know. And then they put a cap on how many can go to school? Doesn’t make much sense. ---
**Author:** ![woodstockbirdybird](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/woodstockbirdybird/32/7905_2.png) [@woodstockbirdybird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/woodstockbirdybird)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2009, 3:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-really-too-different-from-english-speaking-world-to-have-similar-policies/483193/251 "2009-01-30T03:50:49Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > Snort. Gee I’m sorry I don’t have that kind of time - why do you? I don’t know how long it takes you to read - apparently more than you’ve got if you want to actually comprehend what you’re reading, because you seem to be woefully lacking in that department - but I got through the 5 pages of this thing in about half an hour. Of course, that was broken up over a few days, leaving me plenty of time to lead a healthy, productive life. So you can shove your supercilious snort up your ass. > [@curlcoat](#): > > As is responding with something that has nothing to do with what I said. > > OK, you think you are so above me here - explain in simple terms exactly why it is in my best interests to pay more for less. Do not attempt to divert by “showing” that I wouldn’t because you simply cannot prove that since there is no UHC in the US. Come up with facts that actually prove that extending a Medicaid/Medicare type system to all citizens would make it cheaper for the average middle class person and not result in a drop in quality of care. Seems to me it’s up to you to prove your point, since UHC already exists in most of the civilized world, and AFAIK the middle class hasn’t been destroyed in Europe and Canada, nor are people dying by the boatload from being treated by inept doctors. But I guess reality is no match for your theory. ---
**Author:** ![brazil84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8491ac/32.png) [@brazil84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brazil84)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2009, 4:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-really-too-different-from-english-speaking-world-to-have-similar-policies/483193/252 "2009-01-30T04:02:26Z")
> [@Gam\_Zeh\_Yaavor](#): > > I think we’ve been keeping the Straw Man down for too long. :shrug: If you’re tired of pushing down strawmen, you are free to stop. Either way, you’re still a sanctimonious hypocrite. ETA: But somehow I don’t think you will stop attacking strawmen anytime soon. ---
**Author:** ![MichaelQReilly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/df705f/32.png) [@MichaelQReilly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MichaelQReilly)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2009, 4:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-really-too-different-from-english-speaking-world-to-have-similar-policies/483193/253 "2009-01-30T04:08:47Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > You don’t know the reason, but you still don’t think it is because we’ve been taxing the crap out of the middle class to support the poor, without similarly taxing the rich? I’m talking about pre-tax salary. Salaries for middle class workers have stayed pretty flat, while obviously things cost a lot more than 20 years ago. After tax income has nothing to do with it. ---
**Author:** ![Gam\_Zeh\_Yaavor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/3e96dc/32.png) [@Gam\_Zeh\_Yaavor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gam_Zeh_Yaavor)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2009, 4:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-really-too-different-from-english-speaking-world-to-have-similar-policies/483193/254 "2009-01-30T04:11:07Z")
> [@brazil84](#): > > :shrug: If you’re tired of pushing down strawmen, you are free to stop. > > Either way, you’re still a sanctimonious hypocrite. Given the choice between being a sanctimonious hypocrite and a white supremacist, which do you think I’d take? Wait, I guess I shouldn’t be asking that opinion from you, should I? Anyway, I’m in favor of universal health care. ---
**Author:** ![brazil84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8491ac/32.png) [@brazil84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brazil84)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2009, 4:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-really-too-different-from-english-speaking-world-to-have-similar-policies/483193/255 "2009-01-30T04:13:29Z")
> [@Gam\_Zeh\_Yaavor](#): > > Given the choice between being a sanctimonious hypocrite and a white supremacist, which do you think I’d take? I suppose that in your world, those are the only two options. ---
**Author:** ![rayh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e79b87/32.png) [@rayh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rayh)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2009, 4:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-really-too-different-from-english-speaking-world-to-have-similar-policies/483193/256 "2009-01-30T04:51:17Z")
> [@brazil84](#): > > I suppose that in your world, those are the only two options. Well he could have been “an asshole simpleton”, but that was already taken. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2009, 5:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-really-too-different-from-english-speaking-world-to-have-similar-policies/483193/257 "2009-01-30T05:01:22Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > Yeah, kinda my point. Canada can do it and do it right, for whatever reason (wish I knew), but apparently the US can’t. Do you begin to see why I’m not interested in paying even more taxes to our government? You don’t know that, since the United States has never attempted single-payer health insurance. Medicare, Medicaid blah blah blah. Having a covey of competing systems mixed with a dizzying complication of private insurance simply isn’t comparable to having a nationally mandated universal system. Until the USA actuallyt tries something equivalent to the Canadian model, you have no idea if it will work or not. Since it CAN work, I can sympathize with those who want to try. There’s nothing especially cooperative or nice about Canadians. Sorry to burst your bubble, but we have whiners and malingerers, too. The universal health insurance program works because, systemically, it’s inherently less wasteful than having a bazillion systems. ---
**Author:** ![Idle\_Thoughts](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/838e76/32.png) [@Idle\_Thoughts](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Idle_Thoughts)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2009, 6:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-really-too-different-from-english-speaking-world-to-have-similar-policies/483193/258 "2009-01-30T06:29:51Z")
DNFTTs. ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2009, 6:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-really-too-different-from-english-speaking-world-to-have-similar-policies/483193/259 "2009-01-30T06:44:30Z")
> [@woodstockbirdybird](#): > > I don’t know how long it takes you to read - apparently more than you’ve got if you want to actually comprehend what you’re reading, because you seem to be woefully lacking in that department - but I got through the 5 pages of this thing in about half an hour. Of course, that was broken up over a few days, leaving me plenty of time to lead a healthy, productive life. So you can shove your supercilious snort up your ass. Did I hurt your feelings? :rolleyes: > [@](#): > > Seems to me it’s up to you to prove your point, since UHC already exists in most of the civilized world, and AFAIK the middle class hasn’t been destroyed in Europe and Canada, nor are people dying by the boatload from being treated by inept doctors. But I guess reality is no match for your theory. Now that’s rich. _I_ have to prove that it is a good idea for you to spend my money? double :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2009, 6:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-really-too-different-from-english-speaking-world-to-have-similar-policies/483193/260 "2009-01-30T06:47:27Z")
> [@MichaelQReilly](#): > > I’m talking about pre-tax salary. Salaries for middle class workers have stayed pretty flat, while obviously things cost a lot more than 20 years ago. After tax income has nothing to do with it. I wouldn’t know about salaries staying flat since both of us here receive/d raises every year. Yes, things cost a lot more but I kinda doubt health care is driving that, my guess would be the cost of gas. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-really-too-different-from-english-speaking-world-to-have-similar-policies/483193.md?page=12) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-really-too-different-from-english-speaking-world-to-have-similar-policies/483193.md?page=14)