# USA to Syria - another Iraq **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 24, 2013, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-to-syria-another-iraq/667072 "2013-08-24T18:56:02Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2013, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-to-syria-another-iraq/667072/21 "2013-08-25T22:53:20Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > But it is a good place for a [natural-gas pipeline](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trans-Afghanistan_Pipeline). Yeah, but who would want it? It would be in \*Afghanistan. \* ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-to-syria-another-iraq/667072/22 "2013-08-28T14:38:05Z")
😕 Now, I’m not sure how reliable [this](http://www.democraticunderground.com/1014578419) [is](http://iranian.com/posts/view/post/19821) . . . because both links attribute the story to something called the “EU Times,” but the links are dead, and while googling finds several hits for the “EU Times,” they are all dead links, and there is no Wikipedia page for such a publication . . . but if it’s for real . . . :eek: If it’s for real, Putin threatens to respond to any Western attack on Syria by attacking . . . Saudi Arabia?! 😕 > [@](#): > > A grim “urgent action memorandum” issued today from the office of President Putin to the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation is ordering a “massive military strike” against Saudi Arabia in the event that the West attacks Syria. > > According to Kremlin sources familiar with this extraordinary “war order,” Putin became “enraged” after his early August meeting with Saudi Prince Bandar bin Sultan who warned that if Russia did not accept the defeat of Syria, Saudi Arabia would unleash Chechen terrorists under their control to cause mass death and chaos during the Winter Olympics scheduled to be held 7-23 February 2014 in Sochi, Russia. > > Lebanese newspaper As-Safir confirmed this amazing threat against Russia saying that Prince Bandar pledged to safeguard Russia’s naval base in Syria if the Assad regime is toppled, but he also hinted at Chechen terrorist attacks on Russia’s Winter Olympics in Sochi if there is no accord by stating: “I can give you a guarantee to protect the Winter Olympics next year. The Chechen groups that threaten the security of the games are controlled by us.” > > Prince Bandar went on to say that Chechens operating in Syria were a pressure tool that could be switched on an off. “These groups do not scare us. We use them in the face of the Syrian regime but they will have no role in Syria’s political future.” ---
**Author:** ![hotflungwok](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/edb3f5/32.png) [@hotflungwok](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hotflungwok)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-to-syria-another-iraq/667072/23 "2013-08-28T14:43:13Z")
Nah, this wouldn’t be like Iraq. For one, we know there’s weapons of mass destruction in Syria, they just used them. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 2:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-to-syria-another-iraq/667072/24 "2013-08-28T14:44:40Z")
> [@hotflungwok](#): > > Nah, this wouldn’t be like Iraq. For one, we know there’s weapons of mass destruction in Syria, they just used them. Yeah, it wouldn’t be like Iraq at all. There are _way more_ ethnic/sectarian divisions in Syria than in Iraq! ---
**Author:** ![tagos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@tagos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tagos)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 3:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-to-syria-another-iraq/667072/25 "2013-08-28T15:15:23Z")
> [@aldiboronti](#): > > I don’t think the CIA is involved at all. What does give me pause though is the question _cui bono_? Why would Assad use chemical weapons at this point? He’s winning the war, it makes no sense for him to risk such an attack. It makes a great deal of sense however for the rebels to do it and blame the government. At one stroke they could tip the balance in their favor by bringing the Western powers in. > > Or maybe I’m just a cynical old bastard. You can’t be cynical enough. We have no idea who did this, if it happened. We can’t believe any proferred ‘intelligence’ especially if derived second hand from alleged Israel intercepts of telephone conversations. It could be Assad, it could be a rogue commander, it could be a rebel faction plot, it could be Mossad, it could be the bloody Tooth Fairy for all we know. The boy has cried Wolf too many times. And in the end I don’t care. The end result, even if Assad falls, will be a bloody civil war that will probably end up with some lunatic islamic faction in command. Let them get on with it. ---
**Author:** ![komolono](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/komolono/32/532_2.png) [@komolono](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/komolono)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2013, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-to-syria-another-iraq/667072/26 "2013-08-29T18:41:27Z")
The more you hear about Syria, the less you pay attention to what Ed Snowden tells us. [https://mobile.twitter.com/EJosephSnowden](https://mobile.twitter.com/EJosephSnowden) ---
**Author:** ![Learjeff](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/94ad74/32.png) [@Learjeff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Learjeff)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2013, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-to-syria-another-iraq/667072/27 "2013-08-29T20:56:16Z")
> [@Wesley\_Clark](#): > > Afghanistan was harboring Al Qaeda. Syrian rebels are allied with Al Qaeda. I think his point was that there might be more than one reason to invade a country. > [@Martin\_Hyde](#): > > The regime is now offering to let UN inspectors visit the site some five days later, but realistically that isn’t necessary. The protocol the United States, France, and the United Kingdom have adopted will give all the hard verification any reasonable person will need. After the previous attacks when the three powers initially disagreed about whether chemical weapons have been used they adopted a procedure by which each of the three has their own independent sources and will collect samples from those sources who were dispatched on the ground right after it happened. These samples will then go through each of the three country’s systems and be validated as proof of chemical weapons attacks or not, and then the three countries will compare samples. That’s basically a type of triple verification, and if they have good controls in place to make sure they’re getting samples from trustworthy sources it seems a lot more reliable to me than UN inspection five days after the attack when the site has been further damaged by conventional weapons and possibly manipulated by the regime. Gee, too bad we didn’t think of something like that before invading Iraq on what turned out to be false pretenses. > [@komolono](#): > > The more you hear about Syria, the less you pay attention to what Ed Snowden tells us. [https://mobile.twitter.com/EJosephSnowden](https://mobile.twitter.com/EJosephSnowden) I guess that makes Syria a good thing. Or more accurately, a teeny bit less bad thing. ---
**Author:** ![ralph124c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8797f3/32.png) [@ralph124c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ralph124c)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2013, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-to-syria-another-iraq/667072/28 "2013-08-29T22:10:06Z")
Is Sarin a gas you can store for a long time (decades) and still be assured that it is still lethal? Or do yo need fresh batches? I ask because I wonder if making the stuff is withing the Syrian’s capabilities-or would they have imported it? ---
**Author:** ![Duckster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/duckster/32/1244_2.png) [@Duckster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duckster)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2013, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-to-syria-another-iraq/667072/29 "2013-08-29T22:39:02Z")
> [@ralph124c](#): > > Is Sarin a gas you can store for a long time (decades) and still be assured that it is still lethal? Or do yo need fresh batches? > I ask because I wonder if making the stuff is withing the Syrian’s capabilities-or would they have imported it? > **[Sarin](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sarin)** > > Sarin (NATO designation GB \[short for G-series, "B"\]) is an extremely toxic organophosphorus compound. A colourless, odourless liquid, it is used as a chemical weapon due to its extreme potency as a nerve agent. Exposure can be lethal even at very low concentrations, where death can occur within one to ten minutes after direct inhalation of a lethal dose, due to suffocation from respiratory paralysis, unless antidotes are quickly administered. People who absorb a non-lethal dose and d Sarin i... ---
**Author:** ![komolono](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/komolono/32/532_2.png) [@komolono](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/komolono)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2013, 10:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-to-syria-another-iraq/667072/30 "2013-09-01T10:26:43Z")
> [@DWMarch](#): > > This doesn’t make any kind of sense. > > Every day on the news you can see military officials and politicians from the US saying loudly what a clusterfuck Syria is and how we should back away very quickly. There is no advantage in getting involved… > But in the midst of this, the CIA is gassing Syrians? Please convince me how this follows. Now, it seems that the US will be involved or Obama will face some sort of humiliation in his politics. (Reuters) - _“He was the peace candidate who became a war president, a Nobel Peace Prize laureate who has regularly ordered executions by drone.”_ I don’t know what the advantage is, but I don’t think Assad was that stupid… > **[Russia's Vladimir Putin challenges US on Syria claims](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-23911833)** > > Russia's President Putin asks the US to present to the UN evidence behind claims that Syria was responsible for chemical weapons attacks. Putin - however being no better than Assad - knows how to deal with his countrymen. That is to put some singer girls to prison and men in the country turn homophobic. ---
**Author:** ![komolono](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/komolono/32/532_2.png) [@komolono](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/komolono)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2013, 4:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-to-syria-another-iraq/667072/31 "2013-09-02T04:54:14Z")
The US attack is just a provocation for Iran to get involved. Then a strike to Iranian nuclear program would be justified. Ed? ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2013, 5:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-to-syria-another-iraq/667072/32 "2013-09-02T05:03:59Z")
If Dick Cheney was still in charge, I might take that as a possibility. With Obama and Kerry? No… Not how they work. ---
**Author:** ![ryanl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b487fb/32.png) [@ryanl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ryanl)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2013, 5:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-to-syria-another-iraq/667072/33 "2013-09-02T05:14:51Z")
Sometimes [the truth may be simpler](http://www.nytimes.com/2013/08/28/world/middleeast/reports-of-syria-chemical-attack-spur-question-why.html?_r=0), even if less satisfying than believing that there is machination behind events that appear to make little sense. ---
**Author:** ![komolono](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/komolono/32/532_2.png) [@komolono](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/komolono)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2013, 5:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-to-syria-another-iraq/667072/34 "2013-09-02T05:17:14Z")
Winning the second term Obama became somebody’s puppet. The same who allowed him to take Osama down. Bush had plenty of occasions, but no permission. ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2013, 5:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-to-syria-another-iraq/667072/35 "2013-09-02T05:25:42Z")
If it was CIA, i think it would have been much better executed. [Does this look like](http://therearenosunglasses.files.wordpress.com/2013/08/1377278095-the-results-of-ghouta-alleged-chemical-attack-in-syria_2485030.jpg) [modern military munitions to you?](http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2013/08/28/article-2404550-1B81058D000005DC-591_634x419.jpg) That’s what’s being reported to have been the delivery vehicle. The thing doesn’t look like it could fly straight, and with fixed stabilizers like that I wouldn’t think there would be any precision at all. CIA would have splurged for something better. ---
**Author:** ![Ibn\_Warraq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e19b73/32.png) [@Ibn\_Warraq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibn_Warraq)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2013, 5:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-to-syria-another-iraq/667072/36 "2013-09-02T05:34:08Z")
> [@komolono](#): > > Winning the second term Obama became somebody’s puppet. The same who allowed him to take Osama down. Bush had plenty of occasions, but no permission. Uh, to be clear, you’re saying that there’s a group of people who controlled Bush and didn’t let him kill Osama but chose to let Obama kill Osama? Can you tell us who these people are, what their names are, how you know of their existence and what evidence you have to prove such extraordinary claims? Thanks. ---
**Author:** ![komolono](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/komolono/32/532_2.png) [@komolono](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/komolono)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2013, 5:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-to-syria-another-iraq/667072/37 "2013-09-02T05:36:49Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > If it was CIA, CIA would have splurged for something better. Why? Further: If Iran gets involved, they’ll propably give Mahmoud Abbas the glory. He seems to be the sole idol of the Muslims[Jerusalem Post]. ---
**Author:** ![komolono](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/komolono/32/532_2.png) [@komolono](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/komolono)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2013, 6:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-to-syria-another-iraq/667072/38 "2013-09-02T06:03:01Z")
> [@Ibn\_Warraq](#): > > Uh, to be clear, you’re saying that there’s a group of people who controlled Bush and didn’t let him kill Osama but chose to let Obama kill Osama? I have no idea. Based on what has been the post-WWII US policy, everything happens very far away from USA. WHY ARE WE SO AGGRESSIVE? Every president meets the question: not to wage war or to wage war (yes in perspective NOT is the first choice here). But why is it so far from the US? War on drugs: ask Snowden about it! ---
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2013, 6:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-to-syria-another-iraq/667072/39 "2013-09-02T06:35:40Z")
> [@komolono](#): > > I have no idea. Based on what has been the post-WWII US policy, everything happens very far away from USA. WHY ARE WE SO AGGRESSIVE? Maybe because we’re a global superpower? > [@](#): > > Every president meets the question: not to wage war or to wage war (yes in perspective NOT is the first choice here). But why is it so far from the US? War on drugs: ask Snowden about it! This doesn’t make any sense. ---
**Author:** ![komolono](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/komolono/32/532_2.png) [@komolono](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/komolono)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2013, 6:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-to-syria-another-iraq/667072/40 "2013-09-02T06:48:00Z")
> [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](#): > > Maybe because we’re a global superpower? > > No more! > > This doesn’t make any sense. You are not making any sense - once being a superpower, you must make a stance. That is wage war??? I hope Obama meets me and I’ll dye his gray hair. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-to-syria-another-iraq/667072.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/usa-to-syria-another-iraq/667072.md?page=3)