# Use for "suicide cables"? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [December 14, 2013, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-for-suicide-cables/676304 "2013-12-14T14:59:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![gussy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/91b2a8/32.png) [@gussy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gussy)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2015, 1:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-for-suicide-cables/676304/41 "2015-01-07T01:03:58Z")
I can well understand their use, powering a house to get the furnace going when the power won’t be on for another week and the electrician wants a princely sum to hook up that transfer switch. A safer and more expensive ( not as expensive as a house or casket though) is the following set-up Once you know where you’ll keep the generator and have figured the length of cable and know that where the connection to house is made and that that area WILL be dry do the following. One end of the cord has a male fitting to plug into the generator the other end is wired to dryer receptacle mounted on a board another dryer receptacle is mounted on same board, the 2nd dryer receptacle is wired to a pig tail or piece of cord that plugs into the receptacle for the dryer Now a short piece of cable is equipped with two male ends, this is the “go between” this plugs into the two dryer receptacles mounted on the board. SO although more expensive to make up there are NO exposed prongs, they only way to get zapped or electrocuted is to touch the prongs on the short cable that plugs into the two receptacles on the board. You will not be lugging around a big cord with live ends, no matter how hard one tries to be safe. Accidents can and do happen, it is getting closer to night time, you are hurrying and trip over something, you did not see, in that trip the end of that deadly cable is touching you. This is why it is called a suicide cord. Also you should have a routine for restoring power. 1 have a good WORKING flash lite ALWAYS ready at the dryer receptacle. 2 SHUT OFF MAIN BREAKER OR REMOVE THE FUSED PULL-OUT FOR THE MAINS MARKED ‘MAINS’ OR ‘LIGHTS AND APPLIANCES’ 3 START GENERATOR AS INSTRUCTION MANUAL SAYS. 4 PLUG cord into generator, other cord into dryer receptacle. 5 then plug in short cable with male ends into the two dryer receptacle on the board. When you see other homes with power on, , start at step 5 and work backwards. Using a suicide cord is dangerous and if you end up electrocuting a lineman from the utility company, you will have the company and its lawyers on your ass and you’ll have some very serious legal issues. ---
**Author:** ![GaryM](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/garym/32/241_2.png) [@GaryM](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GaryM)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2015, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-for-suicide-cables/676304/42 "2015-01-07T01:09:47Z")
I have a stand by generator and automatic transfer switch, but if I didn’t and used a suicide cord, which I wouldn’t do, I’m pretty sure my generator wouldn’t be able to back feed the line successfully because the other two houses on the transformer would quickly bring the generator to a stop wouldn’t it? ---
**Author:** ![johnpost](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f17d59/32.png) [@johnpost](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/johnpost)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2015, 1:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-for-suicide-cables/676304/43 "2015-01-07T01:53:34Z")
zombie or no it is a deadly hazard. it is very limited to amount of current and easy to overload creating another hazard. you are far better using a long beefy extension cord with separate select loads as needed. ---
**Author:** ![Snnipe\_70E](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5a626/32.png) [@Snnipe\_70E](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snnipe_70E)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2015, 4:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-for-suicide-cables/676304/44 "2015-01-07T04:23:00Z")
Most mains in a house are two pole breakers, but most house wiring systems are 3 wire. If you are going to connect a generator open the main and disconnect the neutral line back to the power company. The it is not going to happen to me attitude in violating safety leads to Darwin awards. ---
**Author:** ![Habeed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a587f6/32.png) [@Habeed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Habeed)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2015, 8:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-for-suicide-cables/676304/45 "2015-01-07T08:20:48Z")
Honestly, it’s not that hard to do safely. 1. Disconnect mains 2. Connect male\<-\> male cord between generator and plug. 3. **Secure** the cord in a way that can’t come out no matter what. Do this securing while the system isn’t live. One method involves cable ties. 4. Start generator Once the power is back on, you do the steps in reverse, as in : 1. Stop Generator 2. Remove male to male cord 3. Reconnect mains This kind of thing isn’t for everyone, but millions of people have the necessary skills to do something like this safely in reliably. It isn’t nearly as complex or dangerous as actually being an electrician, plumber, mechanic, or dozens of other jobs. The reason why this has such a bad rap is because while probably tens of millions of people are capable of doing this safely, first time every time, there’s a lot of people that screw up steps 1 or 3, and in doing so they shock themselves or linemen. Though I’m not sure how likely that really is, I’ve heard that linemen are supposed to put this shorting strap between the lines before they work on them, they don’t stake their lives on someone not having an improperly connected generator somewhere. ---
**Author:** ![gussy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/91b2a8/32.png) [@gussy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gussy)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2015, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-for-suicide-cables/676304/46 "2015-09-06T15:23:54Z")
I recently explained a safer way to deal with “suicide cords” and yeah they look scary too! Another way is to get the genset running with NO load wired to the generator. While it is warming up go to the electrical panel and shut off the mains by flipping the breaker OFF, OR by pulling the mains that could be a pull-out made of bakelite or porcelain containing two fuses. by doing this, you have broken all connection to the service drops and power lines that feed your home. Even if the power came back on, the home would have no power. In a storm situation or someone hitting the pole, it will take some time to get things back to normal. Now plug suicide cord into dryer outlet, the other end of cord is DEAD, since there are no other means to power the home and plug other end into genset. If possible just leave a few lights on (if at night) then start adding loads as you need them Yes, this is a LOT safer than plugging cord into genset and walking back to the receptacle with a “LIVE” plug in your hand. Get the whole routine in your head so you understand it completely, , NO margin for error here ! THEN, make 2 set of instructions using cardboard and a marker and place securely by the dryer receptacle and electrical panel. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2015, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-for-suicide-cables/676304/47 "2015-09-06T16:59:06Z")
Or just wire your generator properly. It’s a little extra work to install the first time, but then becomes a lot easier when it’s time to actually use it, and _much_ safer. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2015, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-for-suicide-cables/676304/48 "2015-09-06T17:21:16Z")
Note: I have not read the thread. I may just be agreeing with someone else. > [@KCB615](#): > > Imagine you have a portable generator that you would like to connect to your house during a power failure, but you lack the appropriate (read: code-approved) transfer switch and plug to do so. > > The typical (read: not code–approved) solution to this is a suicide cable. You take a cable with male plugs on both ends, plug one into your generator, and the other into your electric clothes dryer (or other 220 volt) receptacle. Turn off the main breaker in the panel, and - huzzah - you have power. As I detailed in another thread, we had to use the generator for two and a half days last week. Your scenario is valid, and I’m sure it’s often used. But it’s not the way I would do it. When we have to use the generator, we plug one or two extensions into it. (They’re 110 v because the generator is only 3 kW and not big enough to use the 220 v outlet for the water heater or stove.) The extensions come in through one half of the French doors where the weather stripping has come off/ been cat-ified. We plug stuff into power strips indoors. What I would like to do is install a ‘two-sided outlet’ in an exterior wall. The inside would look like any other outlet, and the outside would look like any of the indoor outlets covered with a weatherproof box. With a ‘suicide’ cable I could plug the generator into the exterior outlet, and have power coming into an outlet indoors. No 50-foot cables lying about! Such a setup would do what we do now with the extensions, and would not be a part of the house circuitry. No need for a transfer switch. ---
**Author:** ![FinsToTheLeft](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finstotheleft/32/2930_2.png) [@FinsToTheLeft](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinsToTheLeft)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2015, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-for-suicide-cables/676304/49 "2015-09-06T17:56:34Z")
Just use an inlet on the outside of the house like [this](http://www.leviton.com/OA_HTML/ProductDetail.jsp?partnumber=5278-CWP§ion=41854&minisite=10251) and use a safe standard extension cord to your generator. No need for a suicide plug! ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2015, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-for-suicide-cables/676304/50 "2015-09-06T17:59:18Z")
> [@FinsToTheLeft](#): > > Just use an inlet on the outside of the house like [this](http://www.leviton.com/OA_HTML/ProductDetail.jsp?partnumber=5278-CWP§ion=41854&minisite=10251) and use a safe standard extension cord to your generator. No need for a suicide plug! If you have female plugs on both sides of the wall, then you can use an extension cord outside without having to have it go out a door. ---
**Author:** ![friedo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8edcca/32.png) [@friedo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/friedo)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2015, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-for-suicide-cables/676304/51 "2015-09-06T19:02:14Z")
Jesus fucking Christ people. The NEC requires a lockout transfer switch. The NEC requires inlet receptacles for portable generators. This shit is not hard to get right. Do it correctly and stop fucking killing people. ---
**Author:** ![FinsToTheLeft](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finstotheleft/32/2930_2.png) [@FinsToTheLeft](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinsToTheLeft)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2015, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-for-suicide-cables/676304/52 "2015-09-06T19:14:35Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > If you have female plugs on both sides of the wall, then you can use an extension cord outside without having to have it go out a door. If you have an inlet outside and a receptacle inside this does exactly that without risking anyone’s life. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2015, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-for-suicide-cables/676304/53 "2015-09-06T19:27:32Z")
> [@FinsToTheLeft](#): > > If you have an inlet outside and a receptacle inside this does exactly that without risking anyone’s life. That’s what I said. With females on both sides of the wall you can use the ‘suicide cable’ to plug the house into the interior receptacle, and an extension cord to the outside receptacle. Or you can use the ‘suicide cable’ to attach a generator to the outside receptacle and plug your power strip into the inside receptacle. IOW, power from house circuit =\> extension cord =\> electrical device (e.g., mitre saw) being used outside. OR: Generator =\> not-the-house-circuit receptacle =\> power strip for TV, cable, modem, etc. No risk to anyone’s life, as there is no power going from the generator to the house circuitry. ---
**Author:** ![Crafter\_Man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crafter_man/32/458_2.png) [@Crafter\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crafter_Man)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2015, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-for-suicide-cables/676304/54 "2015-09-06T19:46:24Z")
Earlier this year I made a “suicide cable” for plugging our Honda gas generator into our home. I first installed a 240V/40A receptacle in the basement near an outside door. I then made a 20’ cable that plugs between the generator and the receptacle. This cable has a male plug on each end. Definitely not to code. When the power goes out, I simply turn off the main breaker in the panel, plug in the generator, and then close the circuit breaker for the 40 A receptacle. It works great. I addition, I [built](https://www.dropbox.com/s/8xoc9ifmfcpp3kq/20150411_183047.jpg?dl=0) a [box](https://www.dropbox.com/s/2ytaj56altpg7ec/20150411_183149.jpg?dl=0) that monitors the current and voltage of each 120 V leg of the generator. It also monitors the voltage coming into the house, and a buzzer will sound to let us know when the power is once again available. ---
**Author:** ![Crafter\_Man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crafter_man/32/458_2.png) [@Crafter\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crafter_Man)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2015, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-for-suicide-cables/676304/55 "2015-09-06T19:51:38Z")
> [@friedo](#): > > Jesus fucking Christ people. The NEC requires a lockout transfer switch. The NEC requires inlet receptacles for portable generators. Very true. But, in my case, 1. I didn’t want to screw around with installing a transfer switch. 2. I know what I’m doing. 3. No one else is allowed to plug the generator into our house; I am the only person who does it. 4. If we sell the house, I will take the generator and suicide cable with me, so no one is for the wiser. ---
**Author:** ![FinsToTheLeft](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finstotheleft/32/2930_2.png) [@FinsToTheLeft](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinsToTheLeft)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2015, 12:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-for-suicide-cables/676304/56 "2015-09-07T00:39:27Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > That’s what I said. With females on both sides of the wall you can use the ‘suicide cable’ to plug the house into the interior receptacle, and an extension cord to the outside receptacle. Or you can use the ‘suicide cable’ to attach a generator to the outside receptacle and plug your power strip into the inside receptacle. IOW, power from house circuit =\> extension cord =\> electrical device (e.g., mitre saw) being used outside. OR: Generator =\> not-the-house-circuit receptacle =\> power strip for TV, cable, modem, etc. > > No risk to anyone’s life, as there is no power going from the generator to the house circuitry. No, not two female receptacles. One female receptacle on the inside and a **male inlet** on the outside. Essentially a hard wired extension cord. At no point do you ever need to have exposed pins that have power on them. Click on the link in my earlier message to see one that Levitt makes. You can buy one at any big box store. ---
**Author:** ![KCB615](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ea666f/32.png) [@KCB615](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KCB615)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2015, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-for-suicide-cables/676304/57 "2015-09-07T00:49:24Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > That’s what I said. With females on both sides of the wall you can use the ‘suicide cable’ to plug the house into the interior receptacle, and an extension cord to the outside receptacle. Or you can use the ‘suicide cable’ to attach a generator to the outside receptacle and plug your power strip into the inside receptacle. IOW, power from house circuit =\> extension cord =\> electrical device (e.g., mitre saw) being used outside. OR: Generator =\> not-the-house-circuit receptacle =\> power strip for TV, cable, modem, etc. > > No risk to anyone’s life, as there is no power going from the generator to the house circuitry. [soapbox] No life other than your own. There’s a darn good reason that suicide cables are prohibited by the National Electrical Code - because they’re friggin dangerous. You have the potential to have exposed conductors, essentially a welder, in contact with whatever the end of the cable hits. Forget (for now) the poor lineman outside who can get whacked if the cable is powering your service panel. The danger is to the user of the cable. It will injure or kill animate things, or ignite inanimate ones. It’s just bad all around. Spend the extra dough and get one of [these](http://www.grainger.com/product/HUBBELL-WIRING-DEVICE-KELLEMS-Specification-WP141578/_/N-/Ntt-nema+inlet?nls=3&nlsit=0.8&ssf=2&sst=subset&s_pp=false&picUrl=//static.grainger.com/rp/s/is/image/Grainger/3D189_AS01?$smthumb$), rated for the amperage and voltage, mounted on the outside of your house. Electricity goes _in_ an inlet, and comes _out_ of an outlet. A regular extension cord can still be used, only that the power comes out of the female end, like it’s supposed to, in contrast to the suicide cable. [/soapbox] ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2015, 1:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-for-suicide-cables/676304/58 "2015-09-07T01:03:37Z")
> [@KCB615](#): > > Forget (for now) the poor lineman outside who can get whacked if the cable is powering your service panel. Except that I specifically said it is not putting power into the house circuitry, and therefore not connected to the service panel. ---
**Author:** ![Habeed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a587f6/32.png) [@Habeed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Habeed)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2015, 6:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-for-suicide-cables/676304/59 "2015-09-07T06:27:49Z")
So I read on an electrician forum the correct but inexpensive way to do it. 1. Buy a [generator interlock kit](http://www.interlockkit.com/). First google to see if your electrical panel has one already, one designed for your panel will fit better. If not, use the link I just provided. 2. Buy a [generator inlet receptacle](http://www.lowes.com/pd_206355-76863-T030N_1z0x2n4__?productId=4326713&pl=1). 3. Buy a small piece of conduit to connect your breaker box to the generator receptacle if it is outside. Look up other guides on how to connect it. 4. Buy a 30 amp 240 volt breaker of the same brand and type as your electrical box, or one UL listed as compatible for your box. You then turn off the main switch, replace the top left or top right breaker(s) (you need 2 spaces in most boxes for a 240 volt breaker) with the new 30 amp breaker. You connect the wires, appropriate for 30 amps, to the breaker, the neutral, through the conduit, and to the 30 amp inlet’s terminals. Total cost : about $150 in materials to do this properly. Make darn sure the interlock kit is installed properly and it works cleanly, such that it is impossible to turn the main switch on at the same time the generator breaker is on. Then you need a generator. 30 amps is the most common and inexpensive, which means you need about a 7200 watt generator. Here’s o[ne I have my eye on](http://slickdeals.net/f/6986018-costco-599-champion-9000-watt-dual-fuel-portable-generator-with-electric-start-battery-and-features-clean-sine-wave-output-epa-and-carb-approved), the Champion Dual Fuel ~7k watt generator. Specifically, the costco version of this generator has a rotor designed to give a clean sine wave, appropriate for charging UPS batteries and running wireless routers, modems, tvs, and computers. I saw it listed for about $650. You purchase a large propane tank and store it outside (in case the tank leaks), such as [this one](http://www.amazon.com/Worthington-297317-43-Pound-Aluminum-Forklift/dp/B004FPZABA/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1441606758&sr=8-5&keywords=aluminum+propane+tank). I suspect you definitely want an aluminum tank because it won’t rust and so it can be stored outside for years, holding a full load of fuel. Propane does not deteriorate when stored, unlike gasoline or diesel. You keep the generator inside the garage/a store room, not outside, and you store it dry (make sure to run it dry of gasoline after you test run it.) 7000 watts is enough to run everything in a house except the AC, and if the AC is a 5 ton unit, it _might_ run if it’s an efficient one that is variable speed like a Carrier Greenspeed. (5 ton ACs used between 7 to 9000 watts, and may require more than that to start, depending on if it has a capacitor hard start kit.) Window units and portable ACs that connect via hose to a window would of course work fine, if you have them. Total cost : $650+$150+$200 = ~$1000. If all you have is a small, cheap generator, like those $300 gas models, you should just use extension cords. Don’t be stupid. ---
**Author:** ![Habeed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a587f6/32.png) [@Habeed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Habeed)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2015, 6:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-for-suicide-cables/676304/60 "2015-09-07T06:42:37Z")
Quick edits : I forgot to mentioned you need a generator cord, like [this one](http://www.amazon.com/Conntek-20601-010-250-volt-Generator-Extension/dp/B00ATPGHIA/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1441607964&sr=8-4&keywords=generator+cord), to actually make the connection. Also, my aluminum tank idea is a bust because propane tanks have to be recertified every 12 years, and a steel tank, even stored outside, will probably last that long. So [this one](http://www.amazon.com/Worthington-303953-100-Pound-Propane-Cylinder/dp/B004FPZAA6/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1441608055&sr=8-1&keywords=propane+tank+100+lb), that stores 100 lbs/24 gallons is probably a better buy since it will need to be replaced every 10-15 years anyway. I reiterate, make sure to store the propane outside, if the tank ever leaks you want the gas to dissipate harmlessly. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-for-suicide-cables/676304.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-for-suicide-cables/676304.md?page=4)