# Use of the word "homophobia" **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [April 12, 2010, 7:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-of-the-word-homophobia/535873 "2010-04-12T19:28:18Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Jackknifed\_Juggernaut](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de053/32.png) [@Jackknifed\_Juggernaut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackknifed_Juggernaut)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2010, 7:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-of-the-word-homophobia/535873/1 "2010-04-12T19:28:18Z")
There are posters posted at my office that show people wearing shirts that say: “I walk…to fight sexism, racism and homophobia”. I believe that the sign promotes a walk-a-thon of some sort (even I’m astounded by my mastery of the obvious). I don’t really think that the walkers actually care that much about homophobia, but rather about discrimination against homosexuals. While homophobia may be the cause of SOME of this discrimination, there are probably also other sources (like ignorance, religious beliefs and direct hatred). So has the word homophobia now evolved to be synonymous with discrimination, or is this simply oversight on part of the shirt’s designers? ---
**Author:** ![Giles](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/giles/32/60_2.png) [@Giles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giles)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2010, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-of-the-word-homophobia/535873/2 "2010-04-12T19:39:16Z")
Yes, I think “homophobia” means discrimination against gays, and it’s not a real phobia. It’s probably because that no good word ending in -ism, to parallel “ageism”, “racism”, “sexism”, etc. ---
**Author:** ![hogarth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hogarth/32/1773_2.png) [@hogarth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hogarth)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2010, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-of-the-word-homophobia/535873/3 "2010-04-12T19:42:38Z")
I’m not crazy about the word, but that ship has basically sailed, I think. ---
**Author:** ![JSexton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/96bed5/32.png) [@JSexton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JSexton)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2010, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-of-the-word-homophobia/535873/4 "2010-04-12T22:47:23Z")
It’s definitely evolved to mean that, sadly. It means that bigots get to avoid the question by saying that they aren’t scared of fags, dammit. But usage is usage. If anyone has a better word, I’d like to hear it. (i’ve heard plenty of _different_ words, but none that are actually better) ---
**Author:** ![AClockworkMelon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aclockworkmelon/32/10803_2.png) [@AClockworkMelon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AClockworkMelon)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2010, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-of-the-word-homophobia/535873/5 "2010-04-12T22:59:02Z")
Hetero Supremacist? 😛 ---
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2010, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-of-the-word-homophobia/535873/6 "2010-04-12T23:11:58Z")
People are against homophobia because gayism or homoism don’t sound right. ---
**Author:** ![Lamia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/8e7dd6/32.png) [@Lamia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamia)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2010, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-of-the-word-homophobia/535873/7 "2010-04-12T23:29:02Z")
We’ve had basically this same discussion many, many times here before. “Homophobia” has been used for years to describe anti-gay sentiment in general. It may not be the best possible term, but it’s the one we’ve got and no one’s come up with a more popular substitute. “Heterosexism” is sometimes used to describe discrimination against homosexuals (or sometimes bisexuals), but I’ve usually encountered this in reference to fairly mild forms of discrimination and not outright bigotry or violence. “Heterosexism” is also problematic because the term suggests that heterosexuals are solely responsible for such discrimination. It’s possible for non-heterosexuals to discriminate against each other, or for heterosexuals to be the victim of sexual orientation-based discrimination. I guess “sexual orientationism” would be the clearest counterpart to “racism” or “sexism”, but it doesn’t exactly trip off the tongue. Every time I point this out someone wants to argue with me about it, but I also feel compelled to mention that the suffix “-phobia” does not necessarily mean “fear”. It can also be used to indicate _aversion_, as in “photophobia”. The OED tells me that the “-phobia” suffix is first recorded in English in the mid 16th century with the Latin loan word “hydrophobia”. Although this can mean “fear of water”, it was used to describe the aversion to water that is symptomatic of rabies. The earliest quote for the word in the OED is from a health text that defines “Hidrophorbia” as “abhorynge of water”. So there’s a very long history in English of using “-phobia” to indicate aversion or abhorrence rather than fear. If we’re going to be really pedantic about our Latin the problem with “homophobia” is that it looks like it should mean “fear or aversion to men/mankind”. The word was indeed occasionally used this way in English – the OED has quotes from 1920 and 1960 – but apparently this usage never became common. Today everyone seems to understand well enough that the “homo” is short for “homosexual”. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 12:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-of-the-word-homophobia/535873/8 "2010-04-13T00:30:40Z")
I propose “jiggyism” to denote discrimination against a person based on whom they want to get jiggy wid. ---
**Author:** ![Serenata67](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/serenata67/32/10646_2.png) [@Serenata67](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Serenata67)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-of-the-word-homophobia/535873/9 "2010-04-13T00:31:38Z")
> [@hogarth](#): > > I’m not crazy about the word, but that ship has basically sailed, I think. Yeah, that’s where I’m at. I don’t think it’s the right word, but I think it might be too late to introduce a new one. ---
**Author:** ![panache45](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/panache45/32/64_2.png) [@panache45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panache45)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-of-the-word-homophobia/535873/10 "2010-04-13T00:44:35Z")
> [@Jackknifed\_Juggernaut](#): > > . . . ignorance, religious beliefs and direct hatred . . . I cannot tell the difference between these three things. As far as “homophobia” is concerned . . . we’ve had many, many threads about this word, and it encompasses fear, hatred, intolerance, discrimination, ignorance, stigma, and many other “anti-gay” attitudes, including religious beliefs. ---
**Author:** ![matt\_mcl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ab992/32.png) [@matt\_mcl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/matt_mcl)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 12:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-of-the-word-homophobia/535873/11 "2010-04-13T00:45:55Z")
> [@JSexton](#): > > It’s definitely evolved to mean that, sadly. It means that bigots get to avoid the question by saying that they aren’t scared of fags, dammit. As **Lamia** points out, -phobia means fear _or hatred_, as in “xenophobia.” ---
**Author:** ![Zahava424](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/76d3ee/32.png) [@Zahava424](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zahava424)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-of-the-word-homophobia/535873/12 "2010-04-13T19:40:40Z")
I agree that it’s come to mean discrimination against gay people, but I’m not in favor of it-- for one thing, it assumes that, because discrimination comes from fear and fear comes from ignorance, if we just introduce everyone to gay people, all will be well. But some discrimination, like religiously-based discrimination, can’t be surmounted this way, and I think the term minimized the issue. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2010, 4:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-of-the-word-homophobia/535873/13 "2010-04-14T04:33:16Z")
> [@panache45](#): > > I cannot tell the difference between these three things. > > As far as “homophobia” is concerned . . . we’ve had many, many threads about this word, and it encompasses fear, hatred, intolerance, discrimination, ignorance, stigma, and many other “anti-gay” attitudes, including religious beliefs. I’m getting tired of this. I have a hard time believing you actually can’t tell a difference. But here: Ignorance: hating gay people because you don’t realize there’s nothing wrong with them. No active malice. Religious beliefs: You’ve been flat out told there’s something wrong with these people by someone whom you respect. In fact, maybe from multiple people. Malice is present, but it’s not directly from you. Direct hatred: You may or may not have been told. But you are generally just a hateful person, and have no problem with hating entire groups of people. And homosexuals happen to be one of your hate targets. Malice is present directly in this individual. ---
**Author:** ![Freudian\_Slit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/5daacb/32.png) [@Freudian\_Slit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freudian_Slit)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2010, 5:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-of-the-word-homophobia/535873/14 "2010-04-14T05:23:02Z")
But how is hatred ever without malice? ---
**Author:** ![Rigamarole](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/77aa72/32.png) [@Rigamarole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rigamarole)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2010, 5:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-of-the-word-homophobia/535873/15 "2010-04-14T05:48:24Z")
So what is it called when a homosexual person discriminates against a hetero- or bisexual person? ---
**Author:** ![Markxxx](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/5daacb/32.png) [@Markxxx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Markxxx)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2010, 8:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-of-the-word-homophobia/535873/16 "2010-04-14T08:53:03Z")
Homophobia is idiomatic, just like Anti-Semitism means “against Jews.” Arabs are also Semites but anti-Semitic doesn’t mean you’re against Arabs, why? Because the term is idiomatic not literal ---
**Author:** ![DMark](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e68b1a/32.png) [@DMark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DMark)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2010, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-of-the-word-homophobia/535873/17 "2010-04-15T17:01:02Z")
Although not a perfect work, and by no means defining “phobia” in most cases, it is a fairly decent “catch all”. By that I mean it forces people to define their limitations when discussing the issue. I have heard religious fanatics claim hell and damnation for anyone Gay, plus more extreme legal measures - that is pretty close to a phobia. However, others might say “I don’t care if someone is Gay, but don’t believe they should have equal marriage rights” which wouldn’t make them homophobic, perhaps dogmatic or bigoted, but they are not going running out of a room when a Gay man appears. Others, even here on the board, admit that they do not know of a single Gay person (at least nobody they know has openly come out to them) and thus they freely admit ignorance of many of the issues. They might not be particularly enlightened, due to lack of contact, but hardly phobic on the issue. So although homo **phobia** is not particularly apt in most cases, it is at least a word that starts discussion - and then let someone define their own bias, if any. ---
**Author:** ![DianaG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7ab992/32.png) [@DianaG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DianaG)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2010, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-of-the-word-homophobia/535873/18 "2010-04-15T18:30:39Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > I’m getting tired of this. I have a hard time believing you actually can’t tell a difference. But here: > > Ignorance: hating gay people because you don’t realize there’s nothing wrong with them. No active malice. > Religious beliefs: You’ve been flat out told there’s something wrong with these people by someone whom you respect. In fact, maybe from multiple people. Malice is present, but it’s not directly from you. > Direct hatred: You may or may not have been told. But you are generally just a hateful person, and have no problem with hating entire groups of people. And homosexuals happen to be one of your hate targets. Malice is present directly in this individual. Seriously? No malice? You’re arguing for the existence of warm fuzzy hatred? ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2010, 9:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-of-the-word-homophobia/535873/19 "2010-04-16T09:25:37Z")
> [@Lamia](#): > > If we’re going to be really pedantic about our Latin the problem with “homophobia” is that it looks like it should mean “fear or aversion to men/mankind”. The word was indeed occasionally used this way in English – the OED has quotes from 1920 and 1960 – but apparently this usage never became common. Today everyone seems to understand well enough that the “homo” is short for “homosexual”. What Latin? Both “homo” meaning “same” and “phobia” meaning “fear or aversion” are Greek roots. ---
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2010, 9:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-of-the-word-homophobia/535873/20 "2010-04-16T09:37:05Z")
> [@DianaG](#): > > … You’re arguing for the existence of warm fuzzy hatred? God damned warm fuzzies, always fucking up my shit. Ya ask me they should be shaved and thrown into the freezer! CMC fnord! 😃 [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/use-of-the-word-homophobia/535873.md?page=2)