# Useful Idiots: How many of you still think invading Iraq was a good idea? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 1, 2006, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/useful-idiots-how-many-of-you-still-think-invading-iraq-was-a-good-idea/371135 "2006-09-01T23:21:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2006, 6:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/useful-idiots-how-many-of-you-still-think-invading-iraq-was-a-good-idea/371135/141 "2006-09-05T06:32:30Z")
> [@](#): > > The most influential moderate Shia leader in Iraq has abandoned attempts to restrain his followers, admitting that there is nothing he can do to prevent the country sliding towards civil war. > > Aides say Grand Ayatollah Ali al-Sistani is angry and disappointed that Shias are ignoring his calls for calm and are switching their allegiance in their thousands to more militant groups which promise protection from Sunni violence and revenge for attacks… From the\* UK Telegraph \* You ain’t seen nothing yet. This may prove to be the “Tet Offensive” moment of this turd-infested fever swamp. This would be kinda like MLK handed over leadership of the civil rights movement to H. Rap Brown. Only much, much worse. ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2006, 12:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/useful-idiots-how-many-of-you-still-think-invading-iraq-was-a-good-idea/371135/142 "2006-09-05T12:06:31Z")
[QUOTE=Squink] Slightly off topic, but did you know that just this past month the total number of American soldiers killed in Bush’s little Iraq adventure surpassed the number bin Laden killed at the World Trade Center (2642 vs 2602)? [/QUOTE] **Squink** , That was exactly the link I posted that gave **The Viscous One** a conniption fit. Note my [response](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=7745667&postcount=127) to him on the matter and his ensuing [senseless reply](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=7745819&postcount=128), complete with homophobic overtones. The brave Keyboard Warrior, at the height of his stupidity, then goes on to respond to **GIGO’s** comment with this gem: [QUOTE=The Slimy One] Why? Because it’s bloody? Shall we become squeamish when my brothers have been bombed and burned and shot and skinned and flailed and poisoned and beheaded, all in the name of holding Hell at its boundaries? [/quote] IOW, destroy a nation for no other reason than greed and geopolitical gains, shit on **me** for mentioning the fact that more Americans have died in this fool’s quest than did during 9/11 and yet continue to back this plundering invasion based on demonstrable lies and fearmongering. Yeah, that’ll stop the killing of young GI’s. Or the innumerable innocent Iraqis they’ve taken with them. Surprisingly enough, they are people too. Fuckin’ shit-for-brains, educate yourself prior to speaking to me:[Another fatal day in the ‘war on terror’](http://news.independent.co.uk/world/politics/article1362708.ece) > [@](#): > > I have spent most of my time since 2001 in Afghanistan and Iraq. \*\*The reason for the rise of radical Islam is foreign occupation. Iraq had a secular tradition. Fanatical Islamic groups made little headway under Saddam Hussein not only because he persecuted them but because they had little popular support. > > But the five million-strong Sunni community in Iraq almost entirely supported armed resistance to the US occupation. Fanatical Islamic groups were for the first time operating in a friendly environment.\*\* > > \ > > One of the most extraordinary aspects of Tony Blair’s analysis of militant Islam is his blindness to the extent to which foreign invasion and occupation has radicalised the region and legitimised militant Islam. – bolding mine. Once you’re done with that, you might want to check into the statements by Iraq’s Shiia most powerful clery, al-Sistani, as per **elucidator’s** post. Want to stop young Americans kids from dying and killing? Get them out from where they don’t belong – and never did. ---
**Author:** ![El\_Cid\_Viscoso](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/41988e/32.png) [@El\_Cid\_Viscoso](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Cid_Viscoso)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2006, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/useful-idiots-how-many-of-you-still-think-invading-iraq-was-a-good-idea/371135/143 "2006-09-05T23:51:01Z")
[QUOTE=RedFury] … gave **The Viscous One** a conniption fit. [/QUOTE] No, that’s not what did it and I owe you an apology. Over the holiday I got a chance to catch up with my Alumni group and found out a classmate was lost, someone I knew from my sophomore platoon and from Pre-Flight. I should have made the time to attack you last week, you bigoted fool. We are paying in blood for a problem that is not ours but is a problem only we can fix. I hope you will understand that. Separately, and let’s face facts; I mean this earnestly, if my American cousins say Colonialism, what can you do to shut them up? I’d love to know, because you’re allegedly European and stuff and have all the answers. ---
**Author:** ![El\_Cid\_Viscoso](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/41988e/32.png) [@El\_Cid\_Viscoso](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Cid_Viscoso)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2006, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/useful-idiots-how-many-of-you-still-think-invading-iraq-was-a-good-idea/371135/144 "2006-09-05T23:53:46Z")
> [@Der Trihs](#): > > If by “your brothers” you mean American soldiers, my response is : Too damn bad. They invaded a country in a war of aggression and greed, and every one that dies is a victory for humanity in general. I have no sympathy for any of them. With respect, Soldiers, Sailors, Airmen and Marines don’t need your sympathy. Also, we didn’t impose Hell, we unleashed it. My brothers though are both the fighters of the Coalition and the police and military forces of Iraq. The Iraqis are fighting against thousands of years of hatred, corruption, bigotry and fear in an attempt to carve a nation out of desert clay and desperation. The average American can’t put down the clicker and get off his ass to vote. Sad times. ---
**Author:** ![El\_Cid\_Viscoso](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/41988e/32.png) [@El\_Cid\_Viscoso](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Cid_Viscoso)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2006, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/useful-idiots-how-many-of-you-still-think-invading-iraq-was-a-good-idea/371135/145 "2006-09-05T23:55:37Z")
> [@GIGObuster](#): > > Ah, the old “White man’s burden” I thought that idea fell in disrepute after the Britain found out they could not hold on in India. Oh GIGO that’s the cruelest cut, thinking me Rudyard Kipling. At worst I’m Edward Said on acid. Thanks for being reasonable though, I’ve always enjoyed that about you. 🙂 I believe Red’s anti-Americanism is profound and dangerous because it’s cloaked in the soft warmth of Liberalism. I rebuke it, but at the least you should take it with a grain of salt. ---
**Author:** ![Contrapuntal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e274bd/32.png) [@Contrapuntal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Contrapuntal)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2006, 11:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/useful-idiots-how-many-of-you-still-think-invading-iraq-was-a-good-idea/371135/146 "2006-09-05T23:59:31Z")
[QUOTE=El Cid Viscoso] We are paying in blood for a problem that is not ours but is a problem only we can fix. I hope you will understand that. [/QUOTE] How is the problem not ours? Whose problem is it? We invaded a country under false pretenses and all sorts of holy hell ensued. The chickenhawks who got us there do not even have the grit to admit that they fucked up. The only reason we have any credibility in the world is our big stick. We are making a pretty convincing case for ‘might makes right.’ ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2006, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/useful-idiots-how-many-of-you-still-think-invading-iraq-was-a-good-idea/371135/147 "2006-09-06T00:31:29Z")
[QUOTE=El Cid Viscoso] No, that’s not what did it and I owe you an apology. Over the holiday I got a chance to catch up with my Alumni group and found out a classmate was lost, someone I knew from my sophomore platoon and from Pre-Flight. [/quote] As much as I feel for your fallen classmate, it is rather obvious that his death has nothing to do with my views – which would have never placed him in Irq to start with – and everything with yours. The fact that you fail to acknowledge this simple point is rather astonishing. > [@](#): > > I should have made the time to attack you last week, you bigoted fool. Yep. You should have. But being viscous is rather a handicap when it comes to debating. As in calling me “bigoted” for instance. > [@](#): > > We are paying in blood for a problem that is not ours but is a problem only we can fix. I hope you will understand that. No, asshole, I “don’t understand that.” All the blood you’re shedding is for a problem of **your own making**. Full of fuckin’ lies while we’re at it too. \ _::::Thick as a brick:::_ \ > [@](#): > > Separately, and let’s face facts; I mean this earnestly, if my American cousins say Colonialism, what can you do to shut them up? I’d love to know, because you’re allegedly European and stuff and have all the answers. No need to be of European heritage to realize I need do nothing. See, palie, [The War Is Lost](http://www.antiwar.com/roberts/?articleid=9649) already. You’ve had your head handed to you on a silver platter, by the very same people you were told would “strew flowers in your path.” > [@](#): > > I believe Red’s anti-Americanism is profound and dangerous because it’s cloaked in the soft warmth of Liberalism. I rebuke it, but at the least you should take it with a grain of salt. You might “believe” I am “Anti-American,” but _I know_ you’re a worthless Bushit eater. After all, you’ve made that quite clear what with your inane, turd-eating, posts in this very thread… Nothing inherently “American” about your CIC and his pals. Unless America now stands for coorporate greed, lust for power and outright cowardliness. Tell you what, stand-up, place hand to heart, [play this](http://www.star-spangled-banner.info/mp3-midi-wav/) and use [this site](http://www.marchforjustice.com/shock&awe.php) as your background scenery. If nothing else, that should make you proud of your “mission” in Iraq. ---
**Author:** ![El\_Cid\_Viscoso](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/41988e/32.png) [@El\_Cid\_Viscoso](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Cid_Viscoso)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2006, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/useful-idiots-how-many-of-you-still-think-invading-iraq-was-a-good-idea/371135/148 "2006-09-06T00:49:40Z")
[QUOTE=Frank] What, precisely, do you expect from Bush to solve the problems in Iraq? [/QUOTE] It’s like the good ole days, buddy. 😃 One night this summer, like a dumbass bastard turfing redneck, a startling thought woke me from a deep sleep. Cuba. The tiny nation of Cuba once brought the world to the brink of nuclear annihiliation, but now its dear leader is cold and withered and will die asleep in a hospital bed, quiescently passing the island to Moderacy, to his brother. During my time on Earth, Cuba has suffered and eaten itself, and as such is a bitter Smithsonian piece of the failed policy of Containment. It’ll be a dystrophic foal born in a bog, gradually adapting to its own liberty. Fast forward to Mesopotamia, 2012. Shithole bunker in Baquoba: satellite phone on his lap, Saddam Hussein pisses himself then ignominiously dies on a Rascal Scooter. His army is meat to the Iranian machine while the Republican Guard is quietly garroting every major Iraqi city, led by a vicious kid in the midst of a power struggle with his perverse gangsta brother. To the Bush Admin circa 2001, taking Iraq? $1 billion. Garnering this breadth of data about modern military occupation at the cost of four, maybe five American lives a day? Priceless. The overarching problem is these men in power have rarely seen modern battle, are not strategists or by any indication, forward thinkers at all! If I had a batphone to the Oval Office, I’d tell them to add another Cabinet member: Secretary of War and hire the office chock full of experts in modern warfare. God knows we’ll have enough to choose from after Beirut, Mogadishu, Yemen, Afghanistan, Iraq and Beirut. Circle of Life, I guess. I just never thought after growing up around Beirut #1 I’d be looking through an album of dead friends, or that we’d still be dealing with this horseshit. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2006, 12:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/useful-idiots-how-many-of-you-still-think-invading-iraq-was-a-good-idea/371135/149 "2006-09-06T00:55:15Z")
[QUOTE=El Cid Viscoso] My brothers though are both the fighters of the Coalition and the police and military forces of Iraq. [/quote] Don’t forget torturers and rapists ! [QUOTE=El Cid Viscoso] The Iraqis are fighting against thousands of years of hatred, corruption, bigotry and fear in an attempt to carve a nation out of desert clay and desperation. [/QUOTE] They are also fighting against us. They are also trying to carve several nations, not one. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2006, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/useful-idiots-how-many-of-you-still-think-invading-iraq-was-a-good-idea/371135/150 "2006-09-06T01:02:52Z")
[QUOTE=El Cid Viscoso] To the Bush Admin circa 2001, taking Iraq? $1 billion. [/quote] _Only_ a billion ? Dream on; we are _long_ past that. For example : [Cost of war could surpass 1 trillion.](http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/11880954/) [QUOTE=MSNBC] U.S. direct spending on the war in Iraq already has surpassed the upper bound of Lindsey’s upper bound, and most economists attribute billions more in indirect costs to the war effort. Even if the U.S. exits Iraq within another three years, total direct and indirect costs to U.S. taxpayers will likely by more than $400 billion, and one estimate puts the total economic impact at up to $2 trillion. [/QUOTE] You’re off by a factor of hundred to thousands. [QUOTE=El Cid Viscoso] Garnering this breadth of data about modern military occupation at the cost of four, maybe five American lives a day? Priceless. [/quote] Because of course, the Iraqis aren’t human; only Americans are human. Why not murder them by the tens of thousands, and not even bother to count ? Why not rape them and torture them ? It’s not like they are people. ---
**Author:** ![El\_Cid\_Viscoso](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/41988e/32.png) [@El\_Cid\_Viscoso](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Cid_Viscoso)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2006, 1:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/useful-idiots-how-many-of-you-still-think-invading-iraq-was-a-good-idea/371135/151 "2006-09-06T01:03:15Z")
[QUOTE=Der Trihs] Don’t forget torturers and rapists ! [/quote] So? That’s life. People torture and rape shit all the time. Just last week one of my neighbors got pinched for raping his goat. And it was HIS GOAT! > [@](#): > > They are also fighting against us. They are also trying to carve several nations, not one. I would honestly hope so. What if some Giant Alien AntiBushites invaded the USA, wouldn’t you expect the average American would hunker and regroup? Hello, 50 states? How old are you? ---
**Author:** ![El\_Cid\_Viscoso](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/41988e/32.png) [@El\_Cid\_Viscoso](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Cid_Viscoso)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2006, 1:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/useful-idiots-how-many-of-you-still-think-invading-iraq-was-a-good-idea/371135/152 "2006-09-06T01:08:57Z")
[QUOTE=Der Trihs] Because of course, the Iraqis aren’t human; only Americans are human. Why not murder them by the tens of thousands, and not even bother to count ? Why not rape them and torture them ? It’s not like they are people. [/QUOTE] Alternative lifestyles and all, but you are totally out of your tree. Holy shit. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2006, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/useful-idiots-how-many-of-you-still-think-invading-iraq-was-a-good-idea/371135/153 "2006-09-06T01:09:05Z")
[QUOTE=El Cid Viscoso] So? That’s life. People torture and rape shit all the time. Just last week one of my neighbors got pinched for raping his goat. And it was HIS GOAT! [/quote] Ha. Ha. Thanks for confirming my opinion that war supporters are utter scum. [QUOTE=El Cid Viscoso] I would honestly hope so. What if some Giant Alien AntiBushites invaded the USA, wouldn’t you expect the average American would hunker and regroup? Hello, 50 states? [/QUOTE] No, Americans are bullies and cowards; we’d cave in like cardboards. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2006, 1:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/useful-idiots-how-many-of-you-still-think-invading-iraq-was-a-good-idea/371135/154 "2006-09-06T01:10:45Z")
[QUOTE=El Cid Viscoso] Alternative lifestyles and all, but you are totally out of your tree. Holy shit. [/QUOTE] That was my impression of _your_ attitude, that it’s OK to kill tens of thousands of Iraqis for a learning experience. ---
**Author:** ![El\_Cid\_Viscoso](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/41988e/32.png) [@El\_Cid\_Viscoso](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Cid_Viscoso)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2006, 1:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/useful-idiots-how-many-of-you-still-think-invading-iraq-was-a-good-idea/371135/155 "2006-09-06T01:18:16Z")
[QUOTE=Der Trihs] That was my impression of _your_ attitude, that it’s OK to kill tens of thousands of Iraqis for a learning experience. [/QUOTE] _sputters into beer mug_ Oh my God they’ve figured us out! stupid kid ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2006, 1:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/useful-idiots-how-many-of-you-still-think-invading-iraq-was-a-good-idea/371135/156 "2006-09-06T01:24:49Z")
[QUOTE=El Cid Viscoso] stupid kid [/QUOTE] From Profile : **Birthday:** December 9, 1968 ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2006, 2:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/useful-idiots-how-many-of-you-still-think-invading-iraq-was-a-good-idea/371135/157 "2006-09-06T02:56:05Z")
[QUOTE=Der Trihs] From Profile : **Birthday:** December 9, 1968 [/QUOTE] Harumph. Puppy. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2006, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/useful-idiots-how-many-of-you-still-think-invading-iraq-was-a-good-idea/371135/158 "2006-09-06T02:59:37Z")
[QUOTE=elucidator] Harumph. Puppy. [/QUOTE] Woof ! \< scratches behind ear with foot \> ---
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2006, 3:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/useful-idiots-how-many-of-you-still-think-invading-iraq-was-a-good-idea/371135/159 "2006-09-06T03:00:14Z")
[QUOTE=Der Trihs] From Profile : **Birthday:** December 9, 1968 [/QUOTE] Harrumph indeed. I was protesting the Vietnam War when you were still strugging with potty-training. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2006, 3:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/useful-idiots-how-many-of-you-still-think-invading-iraq-was-a-good-idea/371135/160 "2006-09-06T03:01:32Z")
:smack: That would be “strugg **l** ing”. [sup]Damn bifocals…[/sup] [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/useful-idiots-how-many-of-you-still-think-invading-iraq-was-a-good-idea/371135.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/useful-idiots-how-many-of-you-still-think-invading-iraq-was-a-good-idea/371135.md?page=9)