# Utah Boy Scout rock toppling outrage **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [October 19, 2013, 12:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/utah-boy-scout-rock-toppling-outrage/671644 "2013-10-19T12:20:22Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2013, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/utah-boy-scout-rock-toppling-outrage/671644/21 "2013-10-19T14:32:10Z")
> [@Debaser](#): > > They were wrong. But what could you charge them with? Destruction of property? Vandalism? I don’t think they deserve to have their lives ruined or anything, but I’d be fine with seeing a $500 fine slapped on all of them or something. Community service, maybe. Well, the humiliation of all this - twits posting something online they have no clue is a bad thing - is already something they’ll have with the for the rest of their lives. I don’t quite know how to deal with this type of Internet shaming. I mean, are these guys idiots who, for want of a better term, vandalized a National Park site? Yes - but folks sending death threats or calling for super-aggressive punishments sound like a lynch mob, not reasonable people seeking justice and a teaching moment… ---
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2013, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/utah-boy-scout-rock-toppling-outrage/671644/22 "2013-10-19T14:32:17Z")
> [@LinusK](#): > > Yeah, I’d be a lifer if they knew how many thing I’d knocked over when I was a kid. These aren’t the kids, they are the leaders. A good fine and some community service is about all you can do to them. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2013, 2:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/utah-boy-scout-rock-toppling-outrage/671644/23 "2013-10-19T14:34:21Z")
They’re certainly at the very least guilty of vandalism, and if the crime of vandalism scales with the value of the property damaged, it’s pretty big vandalism. I would also expect that there’s probably some specific law that deals with destruction of natural formations on federal land, and if so, they’re guilty of that, too. They’re also guilty of extreme stupidity, as evidenced by them filming themselves committing the previously-mentioned crimes, but I don’t think US or Utah law has any penalties written for that. ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2013, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/utah-boy-scout-rock-toppling-outrage/671644/24 "2013-10-19T14:52:31Z")
It has now come out that that piece of trash was in a fender bender prior to this incident and filed a personal injury lawsuit claiming permanent and debilitating back injuries. I can’t link from my phone but there is a beautiful video of a reporter dropping that news on that smug mother fucker and the expression on his face is priceless. ---
**Author:** ![ZenBeam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/3ab097/32.png) [@ZenBeam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZenBeam)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2013, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/utah-boy-scout-rock-toppling-outrage/671644/25 "2013-10-19T15:04:38Z")
Watching the video, the rock spins before falling away from him. The guy pushing it is lucky it didn’t crush his legs. It’s not their place to make that decision. They could have warned the Park Service. They should face charges. I’d expect a plea deal will be reached (one that’s closer to the $500 fine than $100,000). ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2013, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/utah-boy-scout-rock-toppling-outrage/671644/26 "2013-10-19T15:06:28Z")
> [@hajario](#): > > It has now come out that that piece of trash was in a fender bender prior to this incident and filed a personal injury lawsuit claiming permanent and debilitating back injuries. I can’t link from my phone but there is a beautiful video of a reporter dropping that news on that smug mother fucker and the expression on his face is priceless. Awesome. You would have to be a complete chucklehead to believe their “We were worried it would blow over” excuse. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Hamster\_King](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8edcca/32.png) [@The\_Hamster\_King](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Hamster_King)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2013, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/utah-boy-scout-rock-toppling-outrage/671644/27 "2013-10-19T15:24:32Z")
They should make an example of them. Park rangers can’t be everywhere, so most park visitors need to be self-policing. The authorities need to send a very strong message that this sort of vandalism is totally unacceptable. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2013, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/utah-boy-scout-rock-toppling-outrage/671644/28 "2013-10-19T15:26:07Z")
> [@hajario](#): > > It has now come out that that piece of trash was in a fender bender prior to this incident and filed a personal injury lawsuit claiming permanent and debilitating back injuries. I can’t link from my phone but there is a beautiful video of a reporter dropping that news on that smug mother fucker and the expression on his face is priceless. Har Har. Assholes. ---
**Author:** ![carlotta](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/898d66/32.png) [@carlotta](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carlotta)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2013, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/utah-boy-scout-rock-toppling-outrage/671644/29 "2013-10-19T15:28:22Z")
> [@guanolad](#): > > a [sisyphean](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/sisyphus) task. Sounds good to me. ❤❤❤ ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2013, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/utah-boy-scout-rock-toppling-outrage/671644/30 "2013-10-19T15:43:45Z")
> [@hajario](#): > > It has now come out that that piece of trash was in a fender bender prior to this incident and filed a personal injury lawsuit claiming permanent and debilitating back injuries. I can’t link from my phone but there is a beautiful video of a reporter dropping that news on that smug mother fucker and the expression on his face is priceless. I think [this](http://www.kutv.com/news/top-stories/stories/vid_7578.shtml) is the story about Glenn Taylor you’re referring to, from KUTV. ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2013, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/utah-boy-scout-rock-toppling-outrage/671644/31 "2013-10-19T15:51:53Z")
> [@hajario](#): > > It has now come out that that piece of trash was in a fender bender prior to this incident and filed a personal injury lawsuit claiming permanent and debilitating back injuries. Maybe he should try to amend his lawsuit and claim permanent and debilitating _ **brain** _ injuries. ---
**Author:** ![Flywheel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/eb8c5e/32.png) [@Flywheel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Flywheel)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2013, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/utah-boy-scout-rock-toppling-outrage/671644/32 "2013-10-19T15:58:22Z")
> [@Musicat](#): > > The fine should be to put the rock back where it was. With the same tools they used to topple it. [Ranger Woodlore](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X8-pqAMKJs8&t=5m51s) concurs. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2013, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/utah-boy-scout-rock-toppling-outrage/671644/33 "2013-10-19T16:00:11Z")
Vandalism is never right. And their explanation – they were afraid it would fall and hurt some kids – is one of the greatest insults to intelligence in the history of jurisprudence. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2013, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/utah-boy-scout-rock-toppling-outrage/671644/34 "2013-10-19T16:05:28Z")
> [@Debaser](#): > > I don’t think they deserve to have their lives ruined or anything, but I’d be fine with seeing a $500 fine slapped on all of them or something. Community service, maybe. $500? I don’t see a smiley-face here. California charges almost that much for some totally safe but technically illegal moving traffic violations. If destroying hoodoos became a new pastime, I’m sure the parks could charge more than that to raise money. $500? ETA: Ninja’ed by **Little Nemo**. ---
**Author:** ![Antigen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/848f3c/32.png) [@Antigen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Antigen)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2013, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/utah-boy-scout-rock-toppling-outrage/671644/35 "2013-10-19T16:27:06Z")
> [@WordMan](#): > > I don’t quite know how to deal with this type of Internet shaming. I mean, are these guys idiots who, for want of a better term, vandalized a National Park site? Yes - but folks sending death threats or calling for super-aggressive punishments sound like a lynch mob, not reasonable people seeking justice and a teaching moment… Wishing death on them is ridiculous, and the people who are literally calling for blood need to simmer down a little. That said, it **is** “just a rock,” but it was an ancient and delicate formation. The whole point of these National (or State) Parks is to protect natural wonders so they can be studied and enjoyed by future generations. You don’t go spraypainting dicks on pristine cave walls, or cutting down ancient trees for firewood. I can’t understand the mindset of these guys at all. It’s disrespectful assholes like this that make official protection of these areas necessary in the first place. ---
**Author:** ![Aquadementia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aquadementia/32/555_2.png) [@Aquadementia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aquadementia)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2013, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/utah-boy-scout-rock-toppling-outrage/671644/36 "2013-10-19T16:38:39Z")
I think it’s part of the scouting creed to leave no traces. So these guys really got that wrong. > [@Flywheel](#): > > [Ranger Woodlore](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X8-pqAMKJs8&t=5m51s) concurs. I think the duck is on to something. Canyons should be filled in before anyone falls in. Safety! All lakes should be drained so no one is in danger of drowning. Safety! A good wind gust can knock over a tree, so they should all be chopped down. Safety! ---
**Author:** ![TonySinclair](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/49beb7/32.png) [@TonySinclair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TonySinclair)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2013, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/utah-boy-scout-rock-toppling-outrage/671644/37 "2013-10-19T16:45:09Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Five hundred dollars? For vandalizing national park property that’s a million years old? I think about a dollar a year sounds more like it. But I hope this doesn’t interfere with their plans to shoot all the bears in Yellowstone. SOMEBODY has to protect our children. ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2013, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/utah-boy-scout-rock-toppling-outrage/671644/38 "2013-10-19T16:54:46Z")
> [@ZenBeam](#): > > Watching the video, the rock spins before falling away from him. The guy pushing it is lucky it didn’t crush his legs. Then I’m sure those dumbasses would have used this as proof that the rock was indeed dangerous. ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2013, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/utah-boy-scout-rock-toppling-outrage/671644/39 "2013-10-19T16:57:54Z")
> [@hajario](#): > > It has now come out that that piece of trash was in a fender bender prior to this incident and filed a personal injury lawsuit claiming permanent and debilitating back injuries. I can’t link from my phone but there is a beautiful video of a reporter dropping that news on that smug mother fucker and the expression on his face is priceless. Wow. What an incredibly stupid, stupid man. We can only imagine where this is going to go. Talk about feeding raw meat to the Internet wolves. He’s clearly getting his karmic payback; these Internet witch hunts still freak the bejesus out of me… ---
**Author:** ![CLee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f19dbf/32.png) [@CLee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CLee)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2013, 5:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/utah-boy-scout-rock-toppling-outrage/671644/40 "2013-10-19T17:12:23Z")
> [@WordMan](#): > > Wow. What an incredibly stupid, stupid man. We can only imagine where this is going to go. Talk about feeding raw meat to the Internet wolves. > > He’s clearly getting his karmic payback; these Internet witch hunts still freak the bejesus out of me… I think it’s partly hubris and partly the impact of the crime. When I was a kid, a friend who stole a couple stop signs displayed them in his bedroom and few knew of the vandalism. But if he had posted a video of the theft the sticklers for justice would have a platform to express outrage and they guy whose teenaged daughter died because she sailed into a busy stop sign less intersection would have someone to blame. Don’t blame the audience when a fame and attention hungry jerk posts evidence of jerkishness. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/utah-boy-scout-rock-toppling-outrage/671644.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/utah-boy-scout-rock-toppling-outrage/671644.md?page=3)