# Uvalde, Texas school shooting - the political thread **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [May 24, 2022, 9:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uvalde-texas-school-shooting-the-political-thread/965036 "2022-05-24T21:36:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 23
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2022, 12:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uvalde-texas-school-shooting-the-political-thread/965036/441 "2022-05-28T00:45:36Z")
Just two days later, a dangerous armed intruder enters another Texas school. Fortunately, this one was shot by a parent before he could harm any children. [Arlington Texas school shooting incident](https://www.valleycentral.com/news/local-news/texas-parent-brings-gun-to-school-accidentally-shoots-self/) ---
**Author:** ![chela](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chela/32/21582_2.png) [@chela](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chela)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2022, 1:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uvalde-texas-school-shooting-the-political-thread/965036/442 "2022-05-28T01:03:38Z")
Your post is false news. Not funny. ---
**Author:** ![Folly](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/folly/32/3219_2.png) [@Folly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Folly)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2022, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uvalde-texas-school-shooting-the-political-thread/965036/443 "2022-05-28T01:21:49Z")
> [@chela](#): > > Your post is false news. Not funny… Then again, I’m having trouble pointing to the part that’s technically false. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2022, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uvalde-texas-school-shooting-the-political-thread/965036/444 "2022-05-28T01:22:05Z")
> [@DWMarch](#): > > It’s only political in the abstract but why does a young American with $3500 think his best option is to use it for the purposes of murder? Why is it that a capitalist country with immense expertise in appealing to people’s need for instant gratification couldn’t put $3500 worth of distraction in front of this kid other than murder? I have a notion about this, but I think before I offer it, I’d like to wait and learn more about the shooter and what influences may have contributed to his ghastly choices. I do think that @Kimstu has it right: The shooter never planned on actually paying for his purchases because he didn’t expect to get out of the situation alive. I will probably start a new thread to discuss my thinking about this because the implications are far-ranging and I would like to frame the discussion more precisely. I will state my thoughts on your very important questions are extremely political. I will also ask another P&E moderator to moderate the thread when I start it. But let’s wait till we learn more (if we can) about what the shooter’s possible motives were. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2022, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uvalde-texas-school-shooting-the-political-thread/965036/445 "2022-05-28T01:22:19Z")
> [@chela](#): > > Your post is false news. Doesn’t seem to be all that false (ETA: as Folly noted). The concealed-carrying parent who accidentally shot himself with the weapon he brought onto school grounds is in fact rather lucky that he only harmed himself rather than causing harm to any child(ren). Apparently he was treated for his wound at a hospital and charges are pending, so it’s not like this incident is merely some kind of merry japery involving a water pistol or something. Serious harm could in fact have been done. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2022, 1:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uvalde-texas-school-shooting-the-political-thread/965036/446 "2022-05-28T01:34:47Z")
> [@Aspenglow](#): > > I do think that @Kimstu has it right: The shooter never planned on actually paying for his purchases because he didn’t expect to get out of the situation alive. I’ve had a somewhat macabre but weirdly hopeful thought: If this is the case, then perhaps it provides some incentive for gun sellers to refuse or delay sales to buyers who seem like a potential “nonpayment because of suicide-by-cop” risk? I mean, I know that credit card companies try to get survivors to pay the outstanding debts of deceased persons even if the deceased’s estate is insufficient to cover the debt, but they can’t legally compel survivors to assume such debts. If the Uvalde shooter’s estate didn’t have enough money to cover his weapons purchases, who eats that loss? It’s hard to imagine that the grandmother he shot is going to be eager to take over the responsibility of paying for the weapon he shot her with, for example. ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2022, 1:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uvalde-texas-school-shooting-the-political-thread/965036/447 "2022-05-28T01:44:15Z")
Interestingly, the Texas Department of Public Safety says that the mass murderer > used a debit card to buy the rifles and 1,600 rounds of ammunition [**SOURCE**](https://www.kens5.com/article/news/shooter-social-media-facebook-instagram-uvelsa-shooting/273-cd17888e-837b-4384-b6a1-41846c8ce8f1) If that’s literally true, then he had the money in the account to pay for this stuff. It wasn’t bought on credit. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2022, 1:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uvalde-texas-school-shooting-the-political-thread/965036/448 "2022-05-28T01:49:17Z")
I see. Well, there goes that idea, I guess. ---
**Author:** ![ekedolphin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ekedolphin/32/10003_2.png) [@ekedolphin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ekedolphin)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2022, 4:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uvalde-texas-school-shooting-the-political-thread/965036/449 "2022-05-28T04:21:43Z")
[https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/trump-urges-end-to-gun-free-school-zones-easier-confinement-of-deranged-people/ar-AAXOeeA?bk=1&ocid=msedgntp&cvid=3973568393ff42909a93270346cbbcd6](https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/trump-urges-end-to-gun-free-school-zones-easier-confinement-of-deranged-people/ar-AAXOeeA?bk=1&ocid=msedgntp&cvid=3973568393ff42909a93270346cbbcd6) Trump wants to make it easier to detain “violent and deranged people” into mental institutions, and make every school have just one point of entry. Both ideas are stupid. The first idea would not have stopped the Uvalde shooting. The perpetrator had no prior criminal record and no history of mental illness. And the U.S. does _not_ have the kind of budget to rebuild every school so that they only have one exit door. ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2022, 4:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uvalde-texas-school-shooting-the-political-thread/965036/450 "2022-05-28T04:25:14Z")
One exit door sounds like the biggest fire hazard ever. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2022, 4:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uvalde-texas-school-shooting-the-political-thread/965036/451 "2022-05-28T04:36:07Z")
> [@chela](#): > > Your post is false news. Not funny. It was obviously sarcastic, but it wasn’t posted as a joke. What’s “not funny” is the people who refuse to countenance any restrictions whatsoever on gun ownership, and instead advocate filling schools with “good guys with guns” to address this problem. The moron in the story I linked demonstrated the likely consequences. ---
**Author:** ![ekedolphin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ekedolphin/32/10003_2.png) [@ekedolphin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ekedolphin)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2022, 4:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uvalde-texas-school-shooting-the-political-thread/965036/452 "2022-05-28T04:45:28Z")
An article full of conservatives’ scapegoats for the mass shooting. The usual suspects. > **[Too Many Doors And Liberal Teachers: Here's What The GOP Blames For The...](https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/too-many-doors-and-liberal-teachers-here-s-what-the-gop-blames-for-the-uvalde-shooting/ar-AAXNva4?bk=1&ocid=msedgntp&cvid=3973568393ff42909a93270346cbbcd6)** > > Anything but guns. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2022, 5:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uvalde-texas-school-shooting-the-political-thread/965036/453 "2022-05-28T05:02:57Z")
And homeschooling. It’s obvious really - solve school shootings by keeping the guns but getting rid of schools… ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2022, 5:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uvalde-texas-school-shooting-the-political-thread/965036/454 "2022-05-28T05:54:05Z")
I wonder what the overlap is between the people who say we should arm the teachers and the people who say teachers are greedy Communist groomers indoctrinating children with CRT and wokeness. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2022, 8:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uvalde-texas-school-shooting-the-political-thread/965036/455 "2022-05-28T08:39:58Z")
> [@DWMarch](#): > > Honest question here about gun laws: from the US perspective are Canadian guns laws regarded as particularly onerous or oppressive? Depends on the American. For THIS American typing out the post Canadian gun laws seem a hell of a lot more sensible and rational than the mess we have here in the States. For other Americans - and if you look at the threads about guns on this forum you’ll even find a few - yes, the Canadian laws are regarded as draconian. There are other Americans who think the Canadian laws don’t go far enough. There is some indication that the majority of Americans, including the majority of gun owners, would prefer the nation move closer to the Canadian model than towards the “constitutional carry” that prevails in places like Texas. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2022, 8:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uvalde-texas-school-shooting-the-political-thread/965036/456 "2022-05-28T08:50:45Z")
> [@Aspenglow](#): > > I do think that @Kimstu has it right: The shooter never planned on actually paying for his purchases because he didn’t expect to get out of the situation alive. That actually makes a lot of sense, unfortunately. > [@Kimstu](#): > > I mean, I know that credit card companies try to get survivors to pay the outstanding debts of deceased persons even if the deceased’s estate is insufficient to cover the debt, but they can’t legally compel survivors to assume such debts. If the Uvalde shooter’s estate didn’t have enough money to cover his weapons purchases, who eats that loss? I think it’s the credit card company that eats it, but I’m not 100% sure. If he was paying with check or debit there would be the matter of the transaction clearing the account but I don’t think 18 year olds bother with checking accounts these days. > [@DavidNRockies](#): > > Interestingly, the Texas Department of Public Safety says that the mass murderer > > > used a debit card to buy the rifles and 1,600 rounds of ammunition > > [**SOURCE**](https://www.kens5.com/article/news/shooter-social-media-facebook-instagram-uvelsa-shooting/273-cd17888e-837b-4384-b6a1-41846c8ce8f1) > > If that’s literally true, then he had the money in the account to pay for this stuff. It wasn’t bought on credit. Was it the _shooter’s_ debit card, though, or did he use someone else’s, like a parent’s card? > [@ekedolphin](#): > > Trump wants to make it easier to detain “violent and deranged people” into mental institutions, and make every school have just one point of entry. The irony is that could come back to bite Trump, or more likely, his supporters in the ass. Also, the “one point of entry” idea is really bad from a safety standpoint, because that also implies just one exit. That would suck in case of fire or, you know, evacuating people while a mass shooting is going on. That’s just really rich coming from a guy who has a cadre of bodyguards paid for by the government. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2022, 11:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uvalde-texas-school-shooting-the-political-thread/965036/457 "2022-05-28T11:48:04Z")
> [@EllisDee](#): > > One exit door sounds like the biggest fire hazard ever. You can have only one point of entry, and multiple exits that can only be opened from the inside. Until a teacher props open one of the exit doors to get better air circulation, of course. ---
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2022, 12:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uvalde-texas-school-shooting-the-political-thread/965036/458 "2022-05-28T12:06:23Z")
When I was in Iraq, a lot of facilities hardened their compound to make it more difficult to attack the building. As a result there were just a few entry points so in the morning, everyone had to line up at these entry points to gain access to the facilities. So the insurgents just started attacking the people as they lined up to enter. Shooting fish in a barrel. The people who won’t wear a mask to protect the public from a pandemic are turning our schools into armed camps. The only solution is dissolution. Red State America can be the theocratic dystopia they clearly want and we can be a civilized nation free of their burden. ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2022, 12:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uvalde-texas-school-shooting-the-political-thread/965036/459 "2022-05-28T12:11:34Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > > [@DavidNRockies](#): > > > > Interestingly, the Texas Department of Public Safety says that the mass murderer > > > > > > used a debit card to buy the rifles and 1,600 rounds of ammunition > > > > > > [**SOURCE**](https://www.kens5.com/article/news/shooter-social-media-facebook-instagram-uvelsa-shooting/273-cd17888e-837b-4384-b6a1-41846c8ce8f1) > > > > > > If that’s literally true, then he had the money in the account to pay for this stuff. It wasn’t bought on credit. > > Was it the _shooter’s_ debit card, though, or did he use someone else’s, like a parent’s card? It **looks** like it was probably his debit card: > **[Texas school shooter got job at Wendy's to save up $4K for guns](https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10855013/Texas-elementary-school-killer-Salvador-Ramos-got-job-Wendys-save-4-000-guns.html)** > > Salvador Ramos, 18, worked at Wendy's to save money to purchase the assault weapons he used to shoot up a Texas elementary school on Tuesday. He quit after earning the money. > Texas school killer Salvador Ramos got job at Wendy’s to save up $4,000 for rifles he used to massacre 19 young children, and shared his lust for guns with worried co-workers ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2022, 12:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uvalde-texas-school-shooting-the-political-thread/965036/460 "2022-05-28T12:21:44Z")
Not surprisingly, few if any minds on the right have been changed. I’m seeing the same FB posts from the right that I see every time a mass shooting occurs such as this: “The problem is not guns. It’s hearts without God, homes without discipline, schools without prayer, and courts without justice.” I’ve see that one many times. To the right, everything but the guns are the problem. Cruz wants to limit schools to one door with an armed guard. For larger schools, that would mean pretty long times for a crowd of students to enter every day not to mention getting people out for a fire. Abbot wants to focus on mental health, despite having recently cut it in Texas. Then there those that think that anything we propose has to be proven to be 100% effective else it isn’t worth doing. Some think that as long as there are knives and poison, regulating guns is pointless. It’s easy to come up with excuses for not doing something. Time to get past all that bullshit and do something meaningful. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uvalde-texas-school-shooting-the-political-thread/965036.md?page=22) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/uvalde-texas-school-shooting-the-political-thread/965036.md?page=24)