# Vacation in North Korea **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [June 21, 2017, 2:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vacation-in-north-korea/789533 "2017-06-21T14:34:03Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Tom\_Tildrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e95f7d/32.png) [@Tom\_Tildrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Tildrum)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2017, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vacation-in-north-korea/789533/61 "2017-06-23T19:29:04Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > I wouldn’t regard the State Department’s warnings as the be-all and end-all, but I’d certainly read them carefully before buying my tickets. That and [TripAdvisor](https://www.tripadvisor.com/Tourism-g294444-Pyongyang-Vacations.html). 😃 I was a little startled to find that there were reviews for tourism in North Korea. ---
**Author:** ![jtur88](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e9c0ed/32.png) [@jtur88](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jtur88)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2017, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vacation-in-north-korea/789533/62 "2017-06-24T18:26:12Z")
I wouldn’t really expect North Korea to be so different, if I could freely visit and see for myself. It would certainly be nowhere as bad as Pol Pot’s Cambodia. I spent a week in Idi Amin’s Uganda, freely moving about without hindrance,and life was pretty much normal for common people. I spent three months in Ceaucescu’s Romania in 1968, and it was a pretty relaxed atmosphere, but it became somewhat worse later on. I would not expect to see 30-million North Koreans marching in chains to their jobs, but rather nuclear families living together, getting up in the morning, and going to school or regular jobs the same as they do in any other country. Even the most biasedly exaggerated statistics show that the incarceration rate in NK is no higher than in the USA, so I wouldn’t expect to see people trembling fear of arrest. NKoreans know pretty well when to keep their mouths shut, and live day to day in peace and security. I’d much rather see it for myself, than to depend on the constant blather of people guessing what life is like there, based on a handful of anecdotal incidents turned loose in the tabloids or facebook newsfeeds. ---
**Author:** ![Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bosda_di_chi_of_tricor/32/16845_2.png) [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosda_Di_Chi_of_Tricor)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2017, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vacation-in-north-korea/789533/63 "2017-06-24T21:00:30Z")
> [@BubbaDog](#): > > Pretty simple actually. A tour group has a package were you can visit North Korea. > > IS it OK to do so? > [@Living\_Well\_Is\_Best\_Revenge](#): > > Yes, you should definitely go. Bring us a souvenir. Bring me back a Rocket. ---
**Author:** ![Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ccd318/32.png) [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paul_in_Qatar)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2017, 2:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vacation-in-north-korea/789533/64 "2017-06-25T02:57:44Z")
Remarkably enough, we are each responsible for our own moral decisions. If I go to Bahrain for Eid (as everyone in my office is doing), I am in some small way supporting a nasty, brutish regime. If you go to North Korea you have to accept you are in some tiny way helping them do what they are doing. In our day-to-day lives we do a lot of stuff a saint would not do. I understand that, few of us are saints. Still, when you have a clear choice between good and evil, if you choose evil you too are in some way evil. ---
**Author:** ![Idle\_Thoughts](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/838e76/32.png) [@Idle\_Thoughts](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Idle_Thoughts)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2017, 3:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vacation-in-north-korea/789533/65 "2017-06-25T03:07:45Z")
I’ve read quite a bit about vacationing there and it’s not as bad as you would think, I’m thinking. If you were serious I’d say “sure, go for it, might be really interesting”, but as countless people in this thread have said before me, don’t expect the Ritz. They are extremely harsh and hard in their rules over there. You will have a person following you all day long, anywhere you go, and barring you from most places. Being a tourist, your whole visit will be extremely biased, you won’t be allowed anywhere where they appear to have weakness or poverty…you won’t be allowed to access internet (as far as I know), and your TV will be very boring, unless you like 24 hour propaganda about how great the leader is. Also, you will be allowed to take SOME photos, but it will be extremely limited. You may be asked to delete many photos that you take and if you refuse, guess what? You lose your camera (yes, they will take it away by force) and delete it for you. You can take photos only of those things they want you to, like of kids looking smart and military looking strong. You will also be very limited in the customs there and might accidentally commit a faux pas accidentally (or many of them in a day), such as going BEHIND any statue of Kim Jong and looking at it from the back. That is a very frowned upon thing to do…yes, even as something as small as that…and you probably will be told to not to do it again. So yeah, as long as you are fine with being led, limited, controlled, ordered, and followed/watched…it might be interesting if you REALLY wanted to see that side of it in person. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2017, 3:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vacation-in-north-korea/789533/66 "2017-06-25T03:30:09Z")
Cambodia is just fine. We were there again just last July. Why is anyone comparing Cambodia and North Korea? With Cambodia, you don’t even need to arrange a visa ahead of time, just get one on arrival, and independent travelers are welcome. North Korea? Forget it. I doubt I’d even be allowed into the country having worked for newspapers in the past. Newspaper staff are still banned, I believe, dunno about former staff, but I’m not going to go find out. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2017, 5:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vacation-in-north-korea/789533/67 "2017-06-25T05:06:17Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > Not just no but Hell No. > > My kids were both born in South Korea. I wouldn’t put it past the North Korean bastards to decide to grab them (if they were with me) or grab me and hold me for ransom just because. > > If I wanted to experience the official fictions of a fascistic oligarchy, I would watch MSNBC. > > Regards, > Shodan Are you or your spouse Korean? ETA: I voted it’s a stupid idea to go there. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2017, 5:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vacation-in-north-korea/789533/68 "2017-06-25T05:34:37Z")
> [@JoseB](#): > > Not-American here. I’d rather eat my own liver than going to visit North Korea. Have you tried it with some fava beans and a little chianti? North Korea, I mean. Not your liver. ---
**Author:** ![drewder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/57b2e6/32.png) [@drewder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drewder)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2017, 6:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vacation-in-north-korea/789533/69 "2017-06-26T06:16:53Z")
I’m having a hard time coming up with a worse place on the planet to visit than North Korea. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2017, 12:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vacation-in-north-korea/789533/70 "2017-06-26T12:57:05Z")
> [@Monty](#): > > Are you or your spouse Korean? We’re both American. But for all I know, the North Koreans would decide that anyone who was ever a South Korean is now a North Korean, and my son was in the military so he’s probably a spy. Or some damn thing. My kids actually both went to South Korea to meet their birth mothers, but that was several years ago, and things were marginally less crazy then. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Borgia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/larry_borgia/32/156_2.png) [@Larry\_Borgia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Borgia)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2017, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vacation-in-north-korea/789533/71 "2017-06-26T20:24:20Z")
> [@Desert\_Nomad](#): > > Cambodia is a beautiful country to vacation in and Angkor Wat is one of the most amazing places I have ever been to. Holiday in Cambodia was released in 1978, when conditions in Cambodia were a little different than today. ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2017, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vacation-in-north-korea/789533/72 "2017-06-26T21:11:08Z")
> [@Idle\_Thoughts](#): > > You will also be very limited in the customs there and might accidentally commit a faux pas accidentally (or many of them in a day), such as going BEHIND any statue of Kim Jong and looking at it from the back. That is a very frowned upon thing to do…yes, even as something as small as that…and you probably will be told to not to do it again. God help you if you laugh when they tell you that you have to purchase a bundle of flowers and present them to those statues to honor them. ---
**Author:** ![Drunky\_Smurf](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drunky_smurf/32/449_2.png) [@Drunky\_Smurf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drunky_Smurf)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2017, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vacation-in-north-korea/789533/73 "2017-06-26T21:18:44Z")
> [@Idle\_Thoughts](#): > > So yeah, as long as you are fine with being led, limited, controlled, ordered, and followed/watched… You make it sound so sexy. Now I want to go. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Tildrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e95f7d/32.png) [@Tom\_Tildrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Tildrum)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2017, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vacation-in-north-korea/789533/74 "2017-06-26T23:16:12Z")
> [@Drunky\_Smurf](#): > > You make it sound so sexy. Now I want to go. I actually once had a dream that my wife and I attended a Stalinist vacation resort. All I remember is that the accommodations were spartan, and we were not allowed to leave. ---
**Author:** ![amarinth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3be4f8/32.png) [@amarinth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/amarinth)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2017, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vacation-in-north-korea/789533/75 "2017-06-27T00:32:34Z")
> [@Murph1111](#): > > Besides, if you went to North Korea, you wouldn’t see North Korea. I don’t understand this sentiment. (you’re not the only one to say it, even though I’m quoting you) So what? The playacting, artifice, mask, whatever you want to call it, is interesting to me in and of itself. It doesn’t bother me that it isn’t the “Real North Korea” (whatever that means). I’m up for the interactive experimental theatre production of North Korea. I would like to see what their leaders think I should believe about the place. Still, the risk far outweighs the reward for me - so I don’t see myself going. ---
**Author:** ![velomont](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/8491ac/32.png) [@velomont](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/velomont)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2017, 1:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vacation-in-north-korea/789533/76 "2017-06-27T01:14:18Z")
Not a chance in hell. To echo others, I can think of far better and more relaxing places to go. ---
**Author:** ![drewder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/57b2e6/32.png) [@drewder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drewder)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2017, 2:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vacation-in-north-korea/789533/77 "2017-06-28T02:23:52Z")
> [@DrumBum](#): > > Sure, I’ve been to worse places. Where? and don’t say Detroit. ---
**Author:** ![Ann\_Hedonia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ann_hedonia/32/319_2.png) [@Ann\_Hedonia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ann_Hedonia)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2017, 2:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vacation-in-north-korea/789533/78 "2017-06-28T02:48:01Z")
> [@BubbaDog](#): > > Thanks everybody. > As of this post roughly 3 out of 4 of us think vacationing in NK is a stupid idea. > In another thread I was chastised for agreeing with someone that Otto Warmbier made a stupid decision. > > I feel sorry for him and his family. He most definitely didn’t deserve his fate but that doesn’t automatically excuse his stupid decision. > > I just wanted to see how many others agreed that taking a vacation in a hostile land is a stupid idea. IF he did what they said he did, yes - he made a very stupid decision. But that’s a really big “IF” for me, and my doubts increased the more I learned about the alleged specifics of the incident and about Warmbier. I think it obvious the confession was scripted - I really don’t think his REASON for going to NK was to steal the poster. I don’t think the video looks real. He could be completely innocent or there could be something else going on altogether but I’m a skeptic. But if he was detained for another reason, or no reason at all - the story about the poster was good cover as it dampened the outrage. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2017, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vacation-in-north-korea/789533/79 "2017-06-28T02:59:31Z")
> [@amarinth](#): > > …the interactive experimental theatre production of North Korea… I have to admit, I like this phrase. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2017, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vacation-in-north-korea/789533/80 "2017-06-28T03:13:04Z")
There are three reasons to visit a place: To see things (works of art, maybe), to see places (historic sites, relaxing climates, etc.), and to see people. I’m not aware of any particularly interesting things to see in North Korea, the climate isn’t particularly better than the rest of the world, and if you want to experience Korean culture, there’s a perfectly good first-world country where you can do so. What’s left? What can you get out of a visit to North Korea that you couldn’t get from a visit to some other place? The only appeal I can see at all is if you’re keeping a bucket list to visit every single country on the planet, and even there, I can’t see any reason not to put North Korea at the very bottom of the list. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vacation-in-north-korea/789533.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vacation-in-north-korea/789533.md?page=5)