# Vanilla?!? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 25, 2004, 7:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vanilla/276611 "2004-11-25T07:35:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2004, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vanilla/276611/121 "2004-11-25T17:46:03Z")
> [@ffinn](#): > > I’ve been lurking on this message board for years, and long ago I formed the opinion that **vanilla** is a loon. > > Mayhap none of you remember the Snark/vanilla debacle? Hmmm? The whole mess was dragged all over the board until they were both warned to cease and desist. After that, the way it looked to me was that he was trying to avoid her, trying to avoid rising to her baiting. He finally lost it and responded and got banned. At the time I thought she deserved banning more than he did. At the very least, if HE got banned, they should have BOTH got banned. > > Note my comment above about baiting. She baited him, just like she has baited people since then and like she baited her elder. Sure, it was the pastor who got lured into it, but she appeared to be behaving perfectly normal (for her) by attempting to lure in the elder. > > I agree completely with the decision, hope it is permanent and am puzzled why it didn’t happen years ago. I know my opinion doesn’t matter, but from some of your posts about vanilla, I am amazed-have all of you missed all the drama, sturm and drang that she has created here for years? The flip-flopping? The intentional stirring of the pot? > > JMHO, and I do mean humble. I don’t know the lady, and am just going on what I have read on the dope. It is unseemly to attack people who cannot defend themselves, jackass. Why didn’t you come out of the shadows to sling your mud when she could sling it back? ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2004, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vanilla/276611/122 "2004-11-25T17:53:43Z")
Having now read **Samclem’s** link I do see that **vanilla** had been previously warned about similar behavior and I can understand that **Lynn** has to follow through on her warnings in order for them to be meaningful. I’ll just say that I hope the ban isn’t permanent. ---
**Author:** ![alice\_in\_wonderland](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alice_in_wonderland/32/176_2.png) [@alice\_in\_wonderland](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alice_in_wonderland)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2004, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vanilla/276611/123 "2004-11-25T18:04:26Z")
Just as a matter of interest - when you’re “BANNED” or “On a Posting Sabatacal” as I was for a while earlier this year, you can’t read the board. Now, I suppose Vanilla could go to the library or something to check this thread out, but she wont be able to read it from her home computer (assuming that’s where she posts from). ---
**Author:** ![joyfool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/df788c/32.png) [@joyfool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/joyfool)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2004, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vanilla/276611/124 "2004-11-25T18:10:18Z")
> [@alice\_in\_wonderland](#): > > Just as a matter of interest - when you’re “BANNED” or “On a Posting Sabatacal” as I was for a while earlier this year, you can’t read the board. > > Now, I suppose Vanilla could go to the library or something to check this thread out, but she wont be able to read it from her home computer (assuming that’s where she posts from). Can’t someone read the board if they clear their cookies? That’s what I thought happens when someone isn’t a member and just lurks. I’m sure I could be wrong though, but I thought this is what I did before I joined. ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2004, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vanilla/276611/125 "2004-11-25T18:12:14Z")
> [@Liberal](#): > > It is unseemly to attack people who cannot defend themselves Thanks **Liberal**. It’s gotten so a ‘why was X banned (or some such)’ thread doesn’t seem complete until you make that much needed point. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Una\_Persson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/una_persson/32/346_2.png) [@Una\_Persson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Una_Persson)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2004, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vanilla/276611/126 "2004-11-25T18:12:54Z")
> [@faithfool](#): > > Can’t someone read the board if they clear their cookies? That’s what I thought happens when someone isn’t a member and just lurks. I’m sure I could be wrong though, but I thought this is what I did before I joined. Depends on if it’s an IP ban or cookie ban. And even then it depends on other factors. The only thing to say with confidence is “the account will not be used to post during the time in question”. ---
**Author:** ![alice\_in\_wonderland](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alice_in_wonderland/32/176_2.png) [@alice\_in\_wonderland](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alice_in_wonderland)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2004, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vanilla/276611/127 "2004-11-25T18:20:45Z")
I was under the impression, from speaking (emailing) posters in the same position that typically an IP ban is used meaning that the posters personal computer is banned. This may not be totally accurate, and obviously, this doesn’t prevent someone from looking via someone elses computer. ---
**Author:** ![SkipMagic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skipmagic/32/20706_2.png) [@SkipMagic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SkipMagic)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2004, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vanilla/276611/128 "2004-11-25T19:09:18Z")
> [@alice\_in\_wonderland](#): > > I was under the impression, from speaking (emailing) posters in the same position that typically an IP ban is used meaning that the posters personal computer is banned. > > This may not be totally accurate, and obviously, this doesn’t prevent someone from looking via someone elses computer. An IP ban is not necessarily someone’s personal computer–just the IP address from which they currently post. In a lot (if not most) cases, the poster is getting a new IP address from their ISP every time they log on (such as in dial-up). You can see where this wouldn’t be effective in the long run. Banning by specific IP address is normally only effective when you _know_ a poster is always using that address. (There are, as in most cases, exceptions to this.) ---
**Author:** ![omni-not](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/8dc957/32.png) [@omni-not](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/omni-not)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2004, 7:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vanilla/276611/129 "2004-11-25T19:13:50Z")
> [@Liberal](#): > > I think that’s the best summation of it. > > Tuba… honey, sweetie, lovely darling… Maybe you did the right thing by suspending her. Well, frankly, it’s right by definition, since that sort of thing is your call. But your melodramatic scolding was over the top. > > Edlyn and I both know how kind and generous you are. We still treasure your gift to our grandson’s guest book. We know how gracious you can be. But on the other extreme, you can have a tendency to kill a fly with a sledge hammer. As someone who has been the recipient of your “I’m so horrified at your despicable behavior” rant, I can tell you that you carry it way too far, piercing into the marrow when only a mild slap is necessary. > > Vanilla doesn’t have a mean bone in her body. She got a little carried away maybe, but frankly, everything you said to her could be said to you, and for the same reasons. You took your place at your bully pulpit, used your special powers to make a last-word post that she could not respond to, and then proceded to bash her into a pulp. You played “Let’s you and them fight” with her by giving her a public ass-whipping in front of us, her peers. > > The fact is that you are not a horrible person. And neither is Vanilla. This is one you should reconsider all around. All the best to you and yours. Like **Liberal** said: > [@](#): > > I think that’s the best summation of it. ---
**Author:** ![Ilsa\_Lund](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/a6a055/32.png) [@Ilsa\_Lund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ilsa_Lund)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2004, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vanilla/276611/130 "2004-11-25T19:15:22Z")
AFAIK (IANAAdmin), unless a poster consistently registers socks, an identity ban on the username is all that it used, not an IP ban. Logging out enables you to read the boards. I speak from experience. ---
**Author:** ![Rilchiam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@Rilchiam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rilchiam)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2004, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vanilla/276611/131 "2004-11-25T19:49:44Z")
> [@SolGrundy](#): > > And I respond to both points with the same question: what did she have to hide? Why is it so important to keep the SDMB safe from The Outsiders? As far as I can tell, **vanilla** didn’t feel she had to keep her activity on the SDMB a secret, because she wasn’t saying anything on this message board that she wouldn’t say to people in real life. I don’t see anything “foolish” about that. > > I have to say I find this whole insistence on keeping the “Real World” and the “Doper World” separate, to be very troubling. It strikes me as two-faced. _Of course_ there are common sense rules that you take – don’t put identifiable information on here like your street address and phone number and such, because you have no idea who’s going to be reading it… I’m in a tearing hurry (Turkey Day, don’t’cha’know), so I hope I’ll be forgiven for, just this once, posting without reading the entire thread. There’s always the possibility of a dispute that crosses Real World/Dope World lines getting heated enough to result in a lawsuit. One lawsuit would ruin the Chicago Reader. Not “could”. **Would**. ---
**Author:** ![Reeder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c6cbf5/32.png) [@Reeder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reeder)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2004, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vanilla/276611/132 "2004-11-25T19:59:31Z")
> [@alice\_in\_wonderland](#): > > Just as a matter of interest - when you’re “BANNED” or “On a Posting Sabatacal” as I was for a while earlier this year, you can’t read the board. > > snip… I just came back from a “Posting Sabatical” and I can tell you for a fact you can still read the boards. Why would they stop you? ---
**Author:** ![Rilchiam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@Rilchiam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rilchiam)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2004, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vanilla/276611/133 "2004-11-25T20:04:41Z")
> [@clairobscur](#): > > Finally, what was seriously wrong in this situation, exactly? The elder and pastor got to know that they had been criticized in front of strangers. Hey! _I_ would like to know if someone was badmouthing me on a message board. They got a chance to know what other people thought, they got a chance to give their side of the story and to defend their point of view, had they chosen to. Were they somehow wronged? I don’t think so. Were we (or at least the dopers who posted in this thread?) wronged? I don’t thing so, either. Was the SDMB wronged? I can’t see how, and if it is the case, I would like it to be explained. Speaking only for myself, I don’t like it when people tell me what’s being said behind my back. I figure, if it’s behind my back, that means the people saying it don’t have the stones to say it to my face. So I’m not bothered about them. The person/people I do get bothered about are the ones who go out of their way to make **sure** I hear these remarks. In which case, it’s difficult for me to think anything except that they are consciously trying to hurt me. Or to set up a “let’s you and him fight” between me and whoever they’re quoting. ---
**Author:** ![Darkhold](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/90db22/32.png) [@Darkhold](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darkhold)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2004, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vanilla/276611/134 "2004-11-25T20:06:53Z")
> [@Reeder](#): > > I just came back from a “Posting Sabatical” and I can tell you for a fact you can still read the boards. > > Why would they stop you? I don’t remember where but I saw a mod specifically say once that in certain cases they do prevent the banned member from viewing the boards. My guess would be if the poster in question had threatened to hack the boards, if they suspected they were harassing members through email or if they were using a third party as a go between…just my guess though of course. ---
**Author:** ![yosemite](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/3ab097/32.png) [@yosemite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yosemite)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2004, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vanilla/276611/135 "2004-11-25T20:26:48Z")
> [@grienspace](#): > > I will no longer mention to anyone in the meat world that I paticipate on this wonderful message board. I do not want to take responsibility for the actions of anyone who I may have invited here. Exactly, exactly, exactly! Now, I know that some people invite their coworkers, relatives, friends to check out the board, and this isn’t necessarily a bad thing as long as it’s an innocuous invitation (“Check out this great message board!”) and they (the one inviting) _knows_ that they can _never, never, NEVER_ post anything too personal on this board. However, you have to realize that if, for instance, if you invite Coworker A to the boards, Coworker A can tell everyone else that you (and they) post to these boards, and then _anyone else_ that you know has access to what you say on these boards. Then they can make things difficult for you, or they can search all the posts that you made in the X years you’ve posted here and perhaps find something that you discuss that they take offense with (some comments in a 2-year-old thread about your coworkers, perhaps?). Then they can bump up the thread, and get really nasty with you about it, or cause some other messy stuff with you. Is it really worth that risk? Sometimes, if you know that you are only informing the Most Trusted Friends and Loved Ones of this board, it _is_ worth the risk because there really isn’t any risk. (If you can’t trust mom, who _can_ you trust?) But a lot of the time, it’s not worth it. It’s also a good idea to never write anything on these boards that you couldn’t bear to be exposed as being written by you. Be vague enough about personal details and when describing other people/situations so that, worst case scenario, if they found out what you wrote, you could still face them. You never know who might have stumbled upon this board and figured out who you are. > [@](#): > > I hope you come back **vanilla** I hope you come back too, **vanilla**. We love you. ---
**Author:** ![shijinn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/cc9497/32.png) [@shijinn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/shijinn)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2004, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vanilla/276611/136 "2004-11-25T20:34:40Z")
> [@Una Persson](#): > > … shows real, convincing remorse and demonstrates real, convincing effort to straighten up that the Staff will allow her back. … > [@Qadgop the Mercotan](#): > > … I mean, it’s just a message board. Noone’s rights are getting trampled. … > [@Mr. Blue Sky](#): > > … It just seems that some posters take bannings more personally than others. … maybe it’s because i’m not familiar with a paid message board culture, but i find these snippets disquieting, and am not at all surprised at the interest on bannings. ---
**Author:** ![Ilsa\_Lund](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/a6a055/32.png) [@Ilsa\_Lund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ilsa_Lund)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2004, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vanilla/276611/137 "2004-11-25T20:43:13Z")
If I were **vanilla** , I don’t know that I’d want to come back. After being treated like shit by her fellow churchgoers and an Admin, then be publicly humiliated by that Admin _and_ being subject to a month long suspension? Being forced to grovel to be let back into our little club? Why would she want to come back? In forcing the distinction between this board and RL, it seems we often force a distinction between real people and clever anonymous screen names, when there isn’t any. That false distinction leads to way over the top situations like this. And Jesus wept? Indeed. ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2004, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vanilla/276611/138 "2004-11-25T20:57:30Z")
> [@](#): > > Originally Posted by Qadgop the Mercotan > … I mean, it’s just a message board. Noone’s rights are getting trampled. … > [@shijinn](#): > > maybe it’s because i’m not familiar with a paid message board culture, but i find these snippets disquieting, and am not at all surprised at the interest on bannings. Meh. I work in a maximum security prison. I see plenty of rights being lost and compromised, both appropriately so and in wildly unfair and capricious manners. And I do what I can to address such problems when and where I can. This whole situation boils down to “You were warned. Actions have consequences. You can’t post on our site for at least a month. Deal with it.” ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2004, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vanilla/276611/139 "2004-11-25T21:29:44Z")
Having complained previously, I am duty-bound to come back and say that **samclem** has clarified the situation. I still hope she is allowed back after a month. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Eats\_Crayons](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/278dde/32.png) [@Eats\_Crayons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eats_Crayons)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2004, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vanilla/276611/140 "2004-11-25T21:30:38Z")
> [@Diogenes the Cynic](#): > > If **vanilla** had sent the thread to the pastor herself I would understand a suspension but I think this is over the top. In all honesty, I think it’s very naive to think that she sent the thread to the elder without knowing full well it would be forwarded. So I disagree with the statements that say “she’s innocent because _she_ didn’t forward the link directly.” No, but she sent it to someone who obviously would. If anything, due to the potential for libel. It would be as if I wrote a nasty thread about my ex-girlfriend and then sent a link to it to one of her best friends saying “Ssh! Don’t tell anyone… Oh, and _especially_ don’t tell Sniffs\_Markers…” Then imagine I cried foul and acted “surprised” and “apalled” that my trust had been betrayed, and shocked, just _shocked_, that it got passed along to my ex. You’d roll your eyes at me and my obvious passive-aggressive ploy. You’d roll 'em so hard you’d be able to see your tonsils. She could have composed a separate complaint, or copied and pasted her OP. But she didn’t. She sent a message to en elder that said: “Look! I’m publicly maligning the pastor. See for yourself. And _lots_ of people agree with me and my side of the story. See? See?” _Of course_ it got forwarded to the pastor. It’s like talking about someone behind their back, loud enough so you _know_ they still hear you. Hopefully this behaviour is the exception, not the rule. Like **ffinn** I’ve had issues with some elements of her behaviour, but over the past year she has been nothing but upstanding and sweet. So I’m hoping that this was just an uncharacterstic lapse, and will be resolved so she can come back as the well-respected contributor she has been for the past year. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vanilla/276611.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/vanilla/276611.md?page=8)